Warning for "Grief" Tactics?!

[Denji]

lmao thanks for enlightening me i thought the OP would have to go through SE justice system and hire a defense attorney to fight the grief tactic allegation!

i mean if they don't live in EU they're SOL then, and I've heard that even in EU it's harder said than done to collect data that way, but idk about that I live in the US so it doesn't apply to me

anyway idk I believe the OP on not knowing what the griefing report was based on entirely, tbh. out of all the things they've said that appears to be the most consistent statement throughout the thread IIRC, and usually their policy is not to tell you anyways so 100% plausible the OP wouldn't know what exactly what they did was considered griefing, attitude of the OP aside.

ignorance does not absolve you of the responsibility of not treating people like garbage, nor is it an excuse for not following laws or rules. no court in no place on the planet would ever say "well, they didn't know breaking the law was against the law. so we'll just not do anything".

in addition, this isn't a ban. it never was a ban. it was a warning and if they are as innocent as they claim they have 2 other warnings before they would ever be even considered for a free 3 day vacation.

[SturmChurro]

ignorance does not absolve you of the responsibility of not treating people like garbage, nor is it an excuse for not following laws or rules. no court in no place on the planet would ever say "well, they didn't know breaking the law was against the law. so we'll just not do anything".

in addition, this isn't a ban. it never was a ban. it was a warning and if they are as innocent as they claim they have 2 other warnings before they would ever be even considered for a free 3 day vacation.

Exactly how have I treated anybody like garbage? I don't harass anybody. I barely even chat! Why is this still being spread? I am so confused. I did not go out and "grief" anybody. So ridiculous. I don't care if it wasn't a ban, yes it was a slap on the wrist, but this is a blemish on my account, and it won't go away for a long time. It's.. distasteful, and annoys me quite a bit, but there is nothing I can do about it.

[forsakee]

LOL when SE gives warnings for "griefing" but nothing to mentors advertising addons in game/forums.

[kaynide]

I would like to attempt to offer advice:

1) You did, in fact, do something wrong.
-You did something to make someone upset; it was enough for them to report it.
-it was enough for a GM to review and accept that it merits a warning, but not banning.
-it was enough for the GMs, when asked to review, to uphold their decision.

This suggests it might even be a gray zone thing- they are not sure of your intentions and trying to give you a heads up that your actions might be misunderstood by others.

2) Just from the information you have provided in this thread, people have given you places to check that could be interpreted against you, regardless of how people want to argue semantics. That should have provided you a place to reflect on, not argue with us over your innocence. We are not your jury. Frankly most of us don’t care if you are guilty or innocent. Most are just trying to provide guidance for your own reflection.

3) Review the ToS as needed. Consider why people might mistake your actions/lack of communication/raising/whatever else as malice.

4) Accept your penalty with grace, move on, let the thread die.

[Shibi]

Gee guys, don't you think it's about time to stop bullying Sturm? Like, please?

Pushing it to 40 pages is bordering on harassment.

[Larirawiel]

9 of 10 players enjoy bullying.


Cheers

[Katt_Felista]

LOL when SE gives warnings for "griefing" but nothing to mentors advertising addons in game/forums.

Some "mentors" and Gm's networks are the most corrupt things in this game, it's at the level of Age of Conan of "bribery" and illness of "access" and "laissez faire" dripping down into preferencial FC's and players that benefit from it. I think people don't get the scale of corruption and "in group" preferences / nepotism going on in this game and their "alternative" economics all rounder within it and circling in stratas all through ERP / housing, Gamba, savage, gil making -> going straight into reselling. If you played this game for 8+ years. You just "know", you see it for what it is.

They also do a lot of agressive defense of this on the forums, they are the first to tell you "it doesn't exists" "it's a conspiracy" anyone in game with eyes to see and experience, over the years know it "is". It just "is". not "maybe". it is. Anyone with basic skill keyword google search, find all these "houses" "medium houses" on every servers, sold by these FC and alt characters that belong to some specific groups, like a side "advantage" of their "function".

SE needs to kick this bad apple's nest, but i don't think they'll ever do anything because it also profits the popularity of the game, so... Stuck between two evils.

A good exemple of this real "griefing" in game is how this thread describe how "mentors" acts and reacts very questionnably in game , ruinning even simple dungeon runs, and it applies also to any other level of the game, especially savages.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme..._with_mentors/

"he/she would invariably rush ahead of the tank, aggro a whole mob, and usually get some people killed at the same time (with the added benefit of acting like a complete ass). "

"So how come literally 100% of the ones I’ve had so far are arguably among the least pleasant players I’ve ever had the displeasure of partying with? I’m kind of wondering if this is supposed to be common knowledge, or if I’m simply completely wrong about them. Please tell me what you think."

Either SE let these groups of organized extremely "bad" Ill intended people intentionally shit up the game to perpetuate some mythos about dungeons and savages being hard (this network of idiots and stalkers / harassers are the only ones making it seem hard) or they vet these groups extremely badly for 8+ years, but you cannot repeat a mistake over and over and over again without being aware of it at some point. not to this extent, it's not possible.

[Anhra]

Squeenix Terms on how Players should behave are way too strict even for MMO standards, it is almost as bad as League of Legends used to be before Tencent bought it (cant say how much it changed since then since i quit way before that happened) with its Tribunal System where Players could ban each other through a majority vote system (you were basically at the mercy of complete strangers, and i dont think i need to tell anyone how much of a "genius" idea this is) and even got rewarded for doing so.

Even if you just get a "slap on the wrist" from Squeenix, guilty or not, the fact that this issue can be used aganist you for any further violation for the next 2-3 Years is pretty much over the top when you consider, that even mere insults among 2 Players can technically get you banned. Player issues among each other, should be resolved by the involving Parties, and not by any GMs. Even 12 Year olds need to learn the hard way that arguing with someone over trivial matters for hours, is at the end just a waste of time and it will end up being a valueable lesson on the long run.

Tl;dr:

[Xaruko_Nexume]

I would have been too embarrassed to bump this after 4 days. I would have let the thread die into obscurity and hope it was forgotten, but thats just me I guess.

[Kaurhz]

Squeenix Terms on how Players should behave are way too strict even for MMO standards, it is almost as bad as League of Legends used to be before Tencent bought it (cant say how much it changed since then since i quit way before that happened) with its Tribunal System where Players could ban each other through a majority vote system (you were basically at the mercy of complete strangers, and i dont think i need to tell anyone how much of a "genius" idea this is) and even got rewarded for doing so.

Even if you just get a "slap on the wrist" from Squeenix, guilty or not, the fact that this issue can be used aganist you for any further violation for the next 2-3 Years is pretty much over the top when you consider, that even mere insults among 2 Players can technically get you banned. Player issues among each other, should be resolved by the involving Parties, and not by any GMs. Even 12 Year olds need to learn the hard way that arguing with someone over trivial matters for hours, is at the end just a waste of time and it will end up being a valueable lesson on the long run.

Tl;dr:

The requisite for issues amongst players being resolved is that they communicate said issues and reach a mutual resolution on the matter. In fact to my knowledge the terms do state that - Even if you're involved in a violation from a communication-based conflict then the matter can be considered resolved if the 2 players reach a mutual resolution through any subsequent communication - and that in instances where this is the case it will not be treated as a violation. So in this regards you're encouraged to exercise a shred of personal responsibility for the conflict and aim to address it.

So yes, player issues can be resolved between each other. However if neither party elects to reach a mutual resolution then that is on the people involved if they think it's fine to act inappropriately without a shred of consequence. If a persons pride or ego gets in the way of them accepting some form of responsibility as to attempt to address the issue pre-emptively before intervention then that is entirely their own fault.