When are we supposed to stop fighting?

[Necrotica]

During Island Sanctuary release, the players will be able to choose wheter to continue the adventure or stop being WoL and become a farmer. If you choose the later you will have a different expansion to buy later on. The first one will be FFXIV Sanctuary : Back To Nature in which the heart system will be implemented. Once an NPC heart is fully red, you will be able to marry them.

Dibs on Karen.

[Lyth]

There's more to spirituality than religion. There are many ways to come to terms with questions surrounding why we exist, or how to cope with suffering. In Thavnair, the common folk understand this through the sermons of their old gods, which is why Matsya starts the recitation. Has some Amaurotian scholar abstractly contemplated the philosophy around pain and loss? Possibly, but it seems less likely in a society that refuses to openly acknowledge their existence. Unfortunately, it seems like Amaurot was ultimately forced to confront the issue all at once.

I don't think that there's any shame in relying on each other for help. That's part of being human. Sometimes, part of being a hero is simply standing your ground and holding out until reinforcements arrive. We've been there before, many a time. Matsuya is neither a warrior nor a mage. The point of his journey is to show that even the humblest among us can show great courage in the face of adversity and impossible odds. And that's why the scene resonated with so many people.

Just as a side reference, it's worth noting that in various Vedic traditions, Matsya is a fish avatar that saves humanity from the flood. Yet more interplay of Greco-Roman and Vedic philosophy, much like Aether and Akasha.

...

'I mentioned before that there was a member of the Convocation who opposed Zodiark's summoning and defected. One whose office was left vacant. Defectors having been deemed unworthy of commemoration, no crystal exists for the individual in question. Or shouldn't exist, at any rate - and wouldn't, had a friend not created one in secret.'

So here's the thing. Azem was branded as a traitor. We did not part on good terms. Not only did they remove the seat from existence, they refused to record it in their memories. And when you consider how much stock the Amaurotians placed on their stored memories ('Remember us... Remember that we once lived.') it's easy to see that purging someone from their history was a truly damning thing indeed. How ironic it is, then, that Azem is the one now tasked to remember them.

'As you say, the phenomena observed in the two calamities may both be attributed to dynamis. Of note is the difference in its effect. In the first Final Days, it warped creation magicks. In the second, it warped the people themselves. The key variable, I suspect, is the aetheric density of the men in each age. As you know, aether, in essence, negates dynamis. Harboring high concentrations of aether, we ancients cannot readily manipulate dynamis - nor be manipulated by it. Therefore, rather than ourselves, the calamity affected our magicks.'

And there you have it. Meteion cannot mind-control the Amaurotians into using creation magic against their will using dynamis. She actually can't do anything against them directly. Her ability to affect the Amaurotians is entirely dependent on warping the creations that they've created into blasphemies. In the absence of creation magic, she's powerless to affect them. It was ultimately their dependence on creation magic that unfortunately lead to their downfall.

[Veloran]

There's more to spirituality than religion. There are many ways to come to terms with questions surrounding why we exist, or how to cope with suffering. In Thavnair, the common folk understand this through the sermons of their old gods, which is why Matsya starts the recitation. Has some Amaurotian scholar abstractly contemplated the philosophy around pain and loss? Possibly, but it seems less likely in a society that refuses to openly acknowledge their existence.

Amaurotine spirituality was centered around the idea that all life was in essence the blood of the star, and that their people should dedicate their lives to the improvement of the star before returning to it to be reincarnated. A random and unknown calamity destroying all life and the star itself simply isn't compatible with that ideology, the Ancients, dedicated to the star, had no excuses to justify suffering and loss leading to the star's own death. They couldn't just say "life is suffering to forge you into a stronger person", because they understood the cycle of life and reincarnation, and that no matter what hardships or achievements you have in life ultimately you are simply reborn anew with all of those experiences lost. Obviously they did contemplate the meaning of life and the notions of pain and loss, and their overall conclusion was that such things were justified by their purpose in life. The problem is that when stripped of their purpose through the oncoming death of everything and the excision of most of their people from the cycle of life, they naturally refused such an outcome. To say they should readily have rationalized utterly meaningless death is frankly nonsensical.

So here's the thing. Azem was branded as a traitor.

Nothing in that statement says Azem was branded a traitor. Rather they simply didn't record memories of Azem (the person), because they didn't think a defector was worth commemorating. By the by, the Ascians did actually have all fourteen seats filled back when we saw them all in 2.X.

is entirely dependent on warping the creations that they've created into blasphemies.

The Final Days didn't warp their creations into Blasphemes. Rather Terminus Beasts were created through their magic being forcibly usurped and the concepts being siphoned from their minds against their will. The quote you posted is nothing but speculation of how it might work, and note that it's not saying that it afflicted their creations, but rather their magicks themselves.

[Necrotica]

And there you have it. Meteion cannot mind-control the Amaurotians into using creation magic against their will using dynamis. She actually can't do anything against them directly. Her ability to affect the Amaurotians is entirely dependent on warping the creations that they've created into blasphemies. In the absence of creation magic, she's powerless to affect them. It was ultimately their dependence on creation magic that unfortunately lead to their downfall.

You are wrong. We watched an Ancient summon a creature against his will during that final days cutscene. He is huddled over in terror as his magic goes off outside of his control.

[Lyth]

'By your bemused expression, I gather you find it odd that your elders can fail in so simple an application of creation magicks? It is more common than you realize, little one. In this instance, a gaggle of children was passing by as I held the image of the robes in my mind's eye. Simply by becoming aware of their presence was the form influenced and the final product changed. All things considered, it could have been worse. Just the other day, I was attempting to conceive a white haired lion, when all of a sudden this exquisite eagle alighted on the nearby railing, giving me quite the shock - and dramatically altering my initial concept!'

You saw exactly what was described by the in-game lore text: a summoner losing control of the form of their summon. In fact, you don't even need dynamis for this to happen. Imagine, then, what happens when you're terrified and desperately try to pull out something to save yourself, the only way you know how.

I don't think that the philosophy of 'doing your best for the planet' was at odds with the death and destruction the Final Days brought. What it was at odds with was the second part that follows, which you omitted:
'To return to the star whence we came is a privilege afforded to we who have so loved and nurtured it. A choice embraced by those who have lived their lives to the fullest, in service to our world. And when they depart upon this journey, it is beautiful. Always.'

We don't encounter pain, suffering, and death out of choice, or because they have some deeper meaning. Life finds a way to force them on us, no matter how fortunate we are, and no amount of escapism can change that immutable truth. It doesn't matter what your beliefs or higher purpose is, so long as you have the courage and strength to take that next step forward.

[Lauront]

The Final Days didn't warp their creations into Blasphemes. Rather Terminus Beasts were created through their magic being forcibly usurped and the concepts being siphoned from their minds against their will. The quote you posted is nothing but speculation of how it might work, and note that it's not saying that it afflicted their creations, but rather their magicks themselves.

Yep and it fails to account for how dynamis would even affect them to put them into a state of despair in the first place if it were not possible at all. The natural conclusion here is that the transformation is what their denser aether inhibits. We see the creations discussed here even before the incident spread like wildfire to the point that mass panic occurred, as incidents of "spontaneous creation". My guess is that that "readily" Hermes specifies is meant to be taken in conjunction with both the ability to manipulate dynamis, and to be affected by it, because the latter quite clearly is possible through rendering them in a state of despair in the first place. Indeed this is how it reads in the FR version, where it simply premises it as interaction with dynamis becoming easier if the aether is thinner.

Meanwhile the shade's description on it is emphatic:

Have you not heard? Though yet confined to the lands across the sea, a terrible phenomenon afflicts our star. They are calling it the “Final Days.”
'Tis said it starts suddenly, a cacophonous keening from beneath the earth. The sound distorts all living things within earshot, and wrests from us control of our creation magicks.
Once that happens, all is lost. Fear, pain, despair...every dread impulse is siphoned from our minds and given substance: an eternal fall of fiery rain; an incessant spawning of nightmarish beasts...
None can point to the source of the phenomenon. 'Tis as if the star itself has fallen ill─as if a force inimical to life now festers and spreads.
'Tis only a matter of time until Amaurot, too, resounds to that discordant squall. You should stay with your loved ones, child... Stay with them...

So I think that quote does not make the point that their creation magicks could not be affected (indeed, his own words contradict that) - all it seems to be saying is that it did not affect their bodies (and souls?) wholesale via transformations because of their denser aether. Emotional states, and yes, seemingly even control over creation magicks, could be affected. The ancients already knew they could accidentally create things sometimes (underscoring once more how natural this ability is to them) – so I doubt the loss of control would even have been seen as noteworthy if it were not for the precipitating factor (=keening) that led to it, as opposed to the usual accidental use of such magicks in situations of panic, shock etc. You could just drop it and attribute the loss of control to the despair - yet this isn't how it's described at all, hence this loss of control seems to be pivotal here as a differentiating factor.

The subterranean keening aspect appears to remain unexplained, and perhaps Pandaemonium may touch on it. The 1.0 CNJ quests detailed similar events with the elementals whereby their wrath results in a keening and they seize control over the will of man; the game is silent on the role of the elementals in the ancient world, to the extent that they even existed and, if they did, how they’d react to a sustained onslaught of despair beyond the rather ephemeral Final Days the current timeline saw. Possible red herring but I find it interesting.

[KageTokage]

The subterranean keening aspect appears to remain unexplained, and perhaps Pandaemonium may touch on it. The 1.0 CNJ quests detailed similar events with the elementals whereby their wrath results in a keening and they seize control over the will of man; the game is silent on the role of the elementals in the ancient world, to the extent that they even existed and, if they did, how they’d react to a sustained onslaught of despair beyond the rather ephemeral Final Days the current timeline saw. Possible red herring but I find it interesting.

I kind of feel like that's a plot thread that they might latch onto going into the future, because there was a noticeable lack of the natural disasters that were tearing the world apart that were present with the original Final Days, which to me suggests they might've been coming from somewhere else. Either things simply didn't progress far enough to trigger them, or worse, we haven't actually seen them manifest yet.

The prophetic words of the Golden Dyhata suggesting the Lifestream itself will eventually be responsible for widespread disaster is something that raises particular concern to me.

[RyuDragnier]

I kind of feel like that's a plot thread that they might latch onto going into the future, because there was a noticeable lack of the natural disasters that were tearing the world apart that were present with the original Final Days, which to me suggests they might've been coming from somewhere else. Either things simply didn't progress far enough to trigger them, or worse, we haven't actually seen them manifest yet.

The prophetic words of the Golden Dyhata suggesting the Lifestream itself will eventually be responsible for widespread disaster is something that raises particular concern to me.

I feel the same too. If Pandaemonium does not cover this, then it's very likely this is what Azem was off doing during Zodiark and Hydaelyn and the Sundering. If this also leads to what was originally causing the weakening of the Aether as well, then we have an underlying link for things. Especially considering how the FSH quest for the Studium pointed out how the fish ended up going all over the place into regions they're not supposed to be with Zodiark's death, the aethercurrents went out of whack with his departure.

[SannaR]

They had more than 14 during that 2.x scene though. We also know from the Hythlodaeus shade that they hadn't refilled the seat. I highly doubt Emet would have secretly made the Azem crystal and then go and refill the seat using some random person. It also doesn't make sense as to why you'd want a person who's job practically is to go do what a WoL does. Especially when Elidibus was already occasionally doing that in order to try and keep some form of balance. Even if they had found a shard of Azem and tried to do what happened in the Eden storyline to them. I just don't see said shard agreeing with the rejoinings.

[Lyth]

The Meteia are entelechies. They don't directly create despair themselves. They take the emotion that they encounter in others, amplify it, and give it form. You'll remember, for example, that Meteion enjoys candied apples, even though she cannot eat, because of the emotion she feels from Hermes when he does. If joy was the predominant ambient emotion that the Meteia had encountered on their travels, then we'd be fighting off sunshine and rainbows.

We know for a fact based on the in-game text that the Amaurotians can neither manipulate nor be manipulated by dynamis due to their aetheric density. If it was that easy, then they would have simply killed themselves like many of the other civilizations that the Meteia encountered. Their underlying emotions can still be perceived by entelechies, however. We know this from the Elpis bloom phenomenon. The Amaurotians' despair was their own, not Meteion's.

We also know that there always needs to be an initiating event to get the ball rolling. In Thavnair, Khalzahl's business fell on hard times and he lost a critical trade deal, causing him to go into abject despair. It's only after he transformed that the sky began to burn. Likewise, there would have needed to be an initiating event in Amaurotian society, where someone's despair got the best of them, leading to the creation of the first terminus beasts.

The Amaurotians themselves tell you that it's quite common to accidentally give form to an altered concept based off of the workings of your unconscious mind. In some cases, this leads to a fortuitous discovery. With Meteion's influence, however, none of that was safe. Nor, I suspect, were any of their existing creations, while we're at it. Perhaps even moreso given that Lahabrea's group were experimenting with merging souls with creation magic at precisely the wrong time. Who knows what happens if a less aetherically dense construct fused with an Amaurotian soul, like a hemitheos, catches the dynamis flu. I wouldn't be surprised if the raid series elaborates on this further.