Tribute to Zenos

[Vahlnir]

Yeah, as much as I hate to admit it after that awesome fight, I think they actually finally sent him to Valhalla.

My only regret is they didn’t nail his usage until Endwalker. He could’ve been hilarious in Shadowbringers.

I think it would have been neat to play as him once or twice to give us a bit more first hand insight into the fall of Garlemald. Just about everything happened off screen, sadly.

[Garet]

Yeah, as much as I hate to admit it after that awesome fight, I think they actually finally sent him to Valhalla.

My only regret is they didn’t nail his usage until Endwalker. He could’ve been hilarious in Shadowbringers.

I think they basically left the ending of Zenos open just in case they do decide to bring him back. Otherwise they could have shown a more definite ending to him, like maybe his body slowly turning into aether etc., if they really are done with him. But just like our character they just left him there and never really bothered to show what happened after.

[van_arn]

I think they basically left the ending of Zenos open just in case they do decide to bring him back. Otherwise they could have shown a more definite ending to him, like maybe his body slowly turning into aether etc., if they really are done with him. But just like our character they just left him there and never really bothered to show what happened after.

Maybe, but why bother? Of all potential villians, I don't think Zenos is capable of intimidation. He could kill every Scion and my reaction would be more along the lines of, "what took you so long?"

Heck, even his cat-dropping-a-dead-mouse-at-my-feet gift of saying everyone's dead as a gift to me earned little more than an eyeroll. Oh Zenos! <jingle plays>

[Garet]

Maybe, but why bother? Of all potential villians, I don't think Zenos is capable of intimidation. He could kill every Scion and my reaction would be more along the lines of, "what took you so long?"

Heck, even his cat-dropping-a-dead-mouse-at-my-feet gift of saying everyone's dead as a gift to me earned little more than an eyeroll. Oh Zenos! <jingle plays>

This is what makes him an interesting character. He is not purely evil. He could have indeed killed off a lot of the characters if he wanted to or just let black rose decimate the world instead of stopping it. He is not a one sided villain. Hence a lot of people finds him interesting.

For me it would be interesting how zenos could develop after he got the fight he wanted. Would he crave more or would he find another path to find meaning for his life, and what that path would entail. Therefore I really hope he comes back.

[van_arn]

I think it would have been neat to play as him once or twice to give us a bit more first hand insight into the fall of Garlemald. Just about everything happened off screen, sadly.

Oh my god. Or body swap with him and fight ourself.

[Vahlnir]

Oh my god. Our body swap with him and fight ourself.

I'm not gonna lie. That would have been amazing.

[Mirhd]

I think it would have been neat to play as him once or twice to give us a bit more first hand insight into the fall of Garlemald. Just about everything happened off screen, sadly.

Yeah, the Garlemald section not being longer is my only big beef with the expansion... Seriously wish more was done with it, considering, but I enjoyed what was there. Hoping for more going forward.

(Apologies if any of this has already been repeated; I'm feeling lazy and have only just glanced through the thread. :X)

Regarding the topic ... never really understood the Zenos hate, honestly. I mean... I get the why of it mostly, since he's a murderous bastard and all, but I think he worked pretty well, evidenced by how polorising he is in the player base. People go on about sympathetic villains and the "depth" of their characterizations/plight (I loved HW, Emet, Elidibus and the Asians in general, don't get me wrong) but honestly... that can get mentally exhausting and overplayed to me. It can result in a sort of "Oh... another one... ok..." reaction, which is never good. Intersperse someone like Zenos who is fairly simple (on the surface, at least) on the other hand, and you're giving the player/reader a break between all this heavy narrative, if that makes sense?

Also, I think he's underestimated and for all the wrong reasons. Yes, he's essentially a psychopath (or has those tendencies since Psychopathy itself isn't a diagnosis anymore) but that's what makes someone like him so terrifying, and not just some mustache twirling villain... as with any real-life psychopath. Zenos can't be reasoned with or appealed to as he feels nothing outside of the rush he gets from a life-or-death battle, and he just keeps plowing forward regardless of what's in his way to get what he wants, damn the consequences. That's scary, and my character wanted to put him down as soon as possible before he could harm anyone else.

This narrative gets sidelined in Endwalker further into the story and yet it works. No longer is he your focus, and he hates it; or as much as someone like him can even feel hate. Try as he might, he just isn't even on your radar anymore as you have far greater concerns; no reason to just drop everything and entertain his desire for a duel to the death... so he goes looking for one for you. Yikes!

That final battle with him was a highlight in the expansion for me. The canon seems to be that while the WoL genuinely enjoys helping people and bettering the world (even while complaining. hello, DRK questline!), she/he does enjoy a good fight (even as she/he may deny it inwardly), and my character(s) certainly does. The WoL has just saved her planet, the universe at large, her friends are safe, and she doesn't really have any pressing matters to worry about. Finally, finally she can have a brutal beatdown with someone without any burdens weighing on her.

EDIT: "Well, why didn't they just show more of how horrible Zenos is?", some say. We've seen plenty of that across 3 expansions now, though really... is more needed? When you hear about a serial killer who murdered 10 children, do you need to have seen the crimes to know how terrible they are? Come on now.

TLDR; Zenos works as a villain y'all haters are just nubs. /s

In all seriousness, I get people not liking a character but it is pretty crummy to go into a fan thread only to complain about them. I'm not a fan of Lyse (don't hate her, just neutral. can take or leave her), but I wouldn't go into a Lyse thread trying to start beef. That's just petty.

Oh my god. Our body swap with him and fight ourself.

Thought this is where they might eventually go with it, but alas.

[Gemina]

Thought this is where they might eventually go with it, but alas.

Oh, they can still do it. It really doesn't matter who is in possession of our body if our power is used against ourselves.

What I thought was awkward was when we shoulder slam ourselves. That alone would cause all kinds of weird sensations.

[Mirhd]

Oh, they can still do it. It really doesn't matter who is in possession of our body if our power is used against ourselves.

What I thought was awkward was when we shoulder slam ourselves. That alone would cause all kinds of weird sensations.

Depends how they'd handle it, as not just anyone would be capable of doing so; even Fandaniel had to rely on very advanced tech... and he has experience with such things, given he was an Ascian and resurrected Xande himself.

As for the shoulder charge... I thought it was awesome and hilarious, given the context... then I just frown thinking of how ridiculous it would be with a Lalafel. My sibling just finished the MSQ two days ago and was laughing while questioning how her popoto person could possibly punch Zenos in the face.

EDIT: Should be clear and say I still think it would be hilarious in a different situation. :P

[Jirah]

*Que “This boy is a bottom”*