[SPOILERS] Hermes is a hypocrite.

[Padudu]

True, but he threw a number of animals directly into a trio of killing machines (+a bishonen) BEFORE he knew about the whole Fermi Paradox thing. Meteon had given him like, 25% of her report and he instantly diteched his convictions.

A man who abandons his convictions without a second thought never had faith in those convictions at all

[Manny_Maneater]

Writing was on the wall there, by the time he grabbed Meteion all there agreed that she didn’t find any life that wasn’t dead. My own personal interpretation was that his actions were not logical decisions but a man going through an emotional and psychological breakdown, which only ended after we beat him.

Fair enough, but one would think that even in this sort of highly stressful situation he'd mantain the moral standards that, according to him, caused him to start this whole endeavor. If one of your most entrenched moral paradigms is "the death of any living creature is an injustifiable tragedy, regardless of the contex" (for example, even if this creature is an artificial creation that is deadly and violent), you'd think his first action wouldn't be "throw about a hundred creatures into a meat grinder" the second things turned sour. I think it shows he didn't care that much. Despite having (if memory serves me) two different speeches about how much he hated how amaurotian society treated other lifeforms, he was willing to do just the same. It is possible he just didn't...think about it. For a genius, he was kind of a moron.

[HemlockEvergreen]

Not even FFXIV is immune to the dreaded ludonarrative dissonance huh?

[nighttimebunny]

He's a massive hypocrite and not really a good person. "Who are you to decree whether we live or die?" basically sums up all my feelings about him.

[Berteaux_Braumegain]

Hermes being a hypocrite is kind of the central conflict of his character.

[Gemina]

"The creatures are a means of defense" is quite an utilitarian view of another being's life, isn't it? Why aren't those creatures lives worthy of living? Because Hermes deemed them less valuable than his answers? Regardless of wether you agree with that or not, Hermes had before manifested an extreme aversion to any loss of life. He almos had a breakdown over the death of a dangerous, uncontrolable beast. Yet, he backpaddled the moment it suited his needs. He did the exact same thing that he so despised on his peers.

And yes, at the point of KH he was beyond the point of no return, because he was beyond the point of no return when we met him. He had already sent dozens of artificial intelligences with unique, untested abilities into space without telling anyone. He wasn't all to sane to begin with. But what I find interesting is that his abandonment of his own ideals shows that, in the end, his pseudo-altruism wasn't much more than a facade. He was a lonely, conflicted man who really wanted something to live for, it didn't really matter what.

I think I have to point out I don't dislike Hermes as a character. He is very interesting as an antagonist. But I think its quite fascinating how much you can se the Fandaniel/Amon that already lived inside of him.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying he isn't a hypocrite. The game outright tells you he is, especially when it is pointed out how much he clings to his own life despite his desires for the end; but he also points out himself how conflicted he is when he utters the words, but can't seem to find the truth in them. There is also a big contrast between the Hermes we see in tears when having to kill the flawed creations in Elpis, and the Amon who laughs at the irony of Emet Selch now wandering the underworld armed with the truth that would allow him to fight the final days, and the sundering after the fact, calling it a "folly". We see Fandaniel/Amon in several forms. From the beautiful Hermes, to the grotesque Amon; his descent came in stages.

When I talk about the point of no return, this is usually defined by an action and not a mindset. I don't think Hermes sent out the AI with the intention of learning the the universe is a giant cemetery of lost civilizations, and to engineer the final days. His intentions at that point were good, at least as far as I can tell. However, when he turned against his fellow man, and activated Kairos, that is when he was gone for good. His soul became damned at that point of time.

Your last comment is also very interesting, as it can refer to what Graha tells us in relation to the soul, and that even though each life is unique, there still remains certain defining characteristics tied to the soul. While this was referring to Hermes iirc, it most certainly applies to the WoL as well being the reincarnate of Azem. No one recognizes the behaviour of Azem in the WoL more than Emet because they exhibit the same personality traits that Azem had that would drive him batty.

[Cleretic]

Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying he isn't a hypocrite. The game outright tells you he is, especially when it is pointed out how much he clings to his own life despite his desires for the end; but he also points out himself how conflicted he is when he utters the words, but can't seem to find the truth in them. There is also a big contrast between the Hermes we see in tears when having to kill the flawed creations in Elpis, and the Amon who laughs at the irony of Emet Selch now wandering the underworld armed with the truth that would allow him to fight the final days, and the sundering after the fact, calling it a "folly". We see Fandaniel/Amon in several forms. From the beautiful Hermes, to the grotesque Amon; his descent came in stages.

Yeah, something to point out is that Hermes isn't exactly a deliberate hypocrite. He's aware that he holds conflicting views and is having trouble reconciling them, as opposed to the deliberate duplicitous nature we see from, say, Varis, or Emet-Selch in Shadowbringers.

[Ryaz]

That's kinda the point. The Acients were flawed. Emet himself was a big hypocrite when he was condemning Meteion with the whole "What right do you have to determine if we live or die" bit when his people literally play gods and do that every single day with other life forms.

[KariTheFox]

He's a massive hypocrite and not really a good person. "Who are you to decree whether we live or die?" basically sums up all my feelings about him.

What I like about that line is that Emet-Selch says it. The very same person who later by the time of Shadowbringers had decreed who is worthy of living and dying. It's a pretty powerful contrast between who he was and who he became.

[Erendis]

What if Hermes had not only depression but also split personality disorder?