What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

[DevonEllwood]

I usually enjoy media more after analyzing it.I have analyzed previous expansions and thought more about them than on the surface level and it hadn't backfired...so I did the same with Endwalker. Endwalker's problem is that it's heavily based around philosophy which is designed to invite analysis and discussion. It will inevitably be over analyzed and it's juvenile, contradictory approach will fall apart.
Players who analyzed the story are not at fault; the writers are for leaving the door wide open.

[Rulakir]

This is from 5 months ago, but some provides some information.

https://youtu.be/IqoV_EF8jAM

- Yoshi-P says Emet was always planned to be in EW even before his surge in popularity. Supposedly this is also why there's still no in or out of game merch for him.
- Elidibus was specifically left contained in the CT at the end of 5.3 to be used as time travel fuel in EW.
- Yoshi-P considers Hythlodaeus "scary" because he's irresponsible (??) and he thought returning to the star was "frightening".
- Hermes is called "humane" and "kind". Surprise is expressed that there are people who don't like him, Yoshi-P attributes this to "looking at your own self, and that's not a pleasant sight". He thinks Hermes' defaulting to Meteion's judgment of the universe gave him a proper weakness.
- Yoshi-P says that everyone, including the writers, read through feedback (but doesn't say from where) and "we have more or less decided the story right now."
- Apparently there's a lot of internal interest to keep exploring the Ancients, but Yoshi-P says a stand-alone RPG "might cause trouble" with the MMO and there's an issue of when they could ever do it. (Maybe when the team SE pilfered from FF14 returns from FF16? :P)

Once again, it's weird for Venat/Hydaelyn being such a central figure in EW she's never discussed. Both here and in the Famitsu interview they only talk about Hermes. As much as I'd love a stand-alone RPG for the Ancients, it would need to be an AU where Azem manages to find a third way forward. EW was enough torture ****/snuff film for the Ancients to last me a lifetime.

[CrownySuccubus]

- Yoshi-P considers Hythlodaeus "scary" because he's irresponsible (??) and he thought returning to the star was "frightening".
- Hermes is called "humane" and "kind". Surprise is expressed that there are people who don't like him, Yoshi-P attributes this to "looking at your own self, and that's not a pleasant sight". He thinks Hermes' defaulting to Meteion's judgment of the universe gave him a proper weakness.

[Jagick]

I've been sitting at the Zodiark fight for around a week now, so horribly disappointed at the way everything has been handled up to this point after enjoying the absolute masterpiece (for the most part) that was Shadowbringers. I finally buckled down and read a few spoilers that I was avoiding, desperate to see if this gets any better. Being spoiled in and of itself has no bearing on what I'm about to say, but rather the actual content of what I read does.

I have lost all motivation to continue. I know I need to grind through it so I can be ready to experience whatever comes next, which is hopefully better, but Endwalker thus far and what is to come is sapping me of any enjoyment in the MSQ I generally enjoyed post ARR.

[Theodric]

You're not alone. Endwalker was the first expansion where I took multiple breaks that ranged from days to a week before forcing myself to continue. On many fronts, it simply didn't feel like a true conclusion to a story a decade in the making and the investment and knowledge I had was treated with contempt given the numerous retcons that were, quite frankly, designed to do little but prop up certain characters and factions at the cost of everything else.

I suppose that it doesn't help that the game is seemingly being increasingly influenced by Twitter and Reddit - both of which are prone to giving rise to utterly unhinged takes on any given subject. Sadly even this forum isn't free of some of the bizarre insinuations about anyone who enjoys a bit of grit and consequence in a story.

The writing and world building have simply become very effete and bland to me. It just isn't the same interesting world that piqued my interest back during the early days of ARR. I do hope it changes, though if it doesn't...well, at least there's plenty of other games out there.

[Jagick]

I've been trying to think of ways to describe it, and this may be a very controversial take, but I feel like the game was sort of Rian Johnsoned / JJ Abrams'd

The last act killed off all off the last of the main villains and technically resolved the actual plot. Now this act has to resurrect a seemingly popular villain, introduce a brand new one, and rush to tie everything together in a way that makes no real sense or feels hollow. Sure, you can just shut off your brain and enjoy the ride, enjoy it for what it is, the flashing lights, the dramatic dialogue, the fan service characters. But in the end you know it's lackluster and that there was probably a much, much better way to do it. I know what Ishikawa is capable of. I really, really want to see what she brought to the table before they made her rewrite.

[Rulakir]

You're definitely not alone. I'm in a similar situation with an alt. I just can't muster the motivation to keep going knowing the story.

I really, really want to see what she brought to the table before they made her rewrite.

I think it's the rush as well as the rewrite. She really needed to sit and think on this story longer and wasn't given the luxury to do that. Aside from the rewrite, apparently she was so overburdened others had to step in and assist with the writing/dialog. EW is definitely not something she had full creative control over and it shows. Maybe I am being too generous, I haven't liked everything she's written, but that's the impression I got.

Edit: It's been a while, I should probably shill the thread discord. :P

[Xeronia]

Rulakir I want to applaud your signature art for constantly reminding me how manipulative you can read Hydaelyn and it really isn't even that hard to get that interpenetration. A lot of my complaints about EW come down to I feel the main conflict of a decade of story telling was not explained well at all and instead a new threat was added last second to justify Venat. By the end of EW I felt my character would have just left to go hide away for a few months trying to settle how mad she would feel basically being an eternal pawn in the most pointless universal conflict ever. After the themes of previous expansion that really resonated with me personally I just can't see Xeronia here not going "Do you know how much I have lost because of you, you are telling me this was necessary?" to Hydaelyn.

Again that is fully my own interpretation as the themes of HW and ShB really resonated with me. I just can't see Xeronia rolling over knowing all the death she has witnessed and grieved was somehow intended.

[Jagick]

Rulakir I want to applaud your signature art for constantly reminding me how manipulative you can read Hydaelyn and it really isn't even that hard to get that interpenetration. A lot of my complaints about EW come down to I feel the main conflict of a decade of story telling was not explained well at all and instead a new threat was added last second to justify Venat. By the end of EW I felt my character would have just left to go hide away for a few months trying to settle how mad she would feel basically being an eternal pawn in the most pointless universal conflict ever. After the themes of previous expansion that really resonated with me personally I just can't see Xeronia here not going "Do you know how much I have lost because of you, you are telling me this was necessary?" to Hydaelyn.

Again that is fully my own interpenetration as the themes of HW and ShB really resonated with me. I just can't see Xeronia rolling over knowing all the death she has witnessed and grieved was somehow intended.

Now that you mention it, this segment of the story kind of reminds me of Legacy of Kain: Soul Reaver. Raziel was manipulated (across time and space) from the get go by his supposed master and mentor the Elder God, only Raziel didn't forgive the Elder God nor just accept that he was doing something he felt he had to do. He did everything in his power to thwart the monster and gave his only true friend and ally Kain the means to bury that damn god for eternity.

[NanaWiloh]

This thread is no longer beating a dead horse nope. Thread has dug a hole half to China now.