What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

[MikkoAkure]

Well, this is awkward

I don't get how this is difficult to understand.

Hydaelyn's summoning contrasts against Zodiark's because he kept the souls of those sacrificed intact. As we know, Hydaelyn did not. Eulogia says "fragments of our former souls", which if my understanding of English is correct doesn't mean a whole soul.

We already knew before this patch that The Watcher had vague memories from his other life and that two Ancients in Elpis were likely Althyk and Nymeia because the latter has the exact same line in Elpis and in the raids (confirmed at the end, and something Venat could not possibly have known to be able to repeat). So we had a reasonable suspicion that the gods were based on Venat's supporters.

It wasn't a great leap of logic even back then to suggest that The Twelve plus One were created from bits of remaining fragmented soul as the cores of the creation magic used to bring them to "life" and grant them a semblance of personality of their former selves. They're still mostly just advanced programming other than that. It doesn't contradict anything.

[Vyrerus]

My WoL standing behind Zero and Durante.

Durante: "Do you truly believe we could regain the world of old?"

Zero: "As long as we work together, then we can do anything!"

Hold up! Wait a minute. What happened to forge ahead? This goes directly against the theme of Endwalker.

Gonna hafta put the 24 man off til tomorrow. I can only stomach so much of this shit sandwich in one sitting.

[OdinelStarrei]

As respectfully as I can say this:

I disagree.

While some parts of the story I didn't like, the story itself I liked overall, some parts of it I liked tremendously, and now with the resolution, I feel it was a journey well taken. Things are nicely tied up and very much leaning into the feeling of rest and reprieve ahead.I know a lot of people like to hate things, and I know others don't but simply have different tastes. And that's fine. But honestly, it's not healthy to harbor so much pent up hate over things.

As for me, I feel the journey was worthwhile, and I like where it ended up in 6.5, and I like where it seems to be going. I'm sorry you didn't all enjoy it, but I'm reminded of that saying "You can't please all of the people all of the time." Hope you enjoy the future better than you have the present.

I cannot believe that you would insinuate that because I didn't like it that I either don't have the same tastes, when things like Shadowbringers or Sorrow of Werlyt are almost universally praised for their complex story telling, or even worse, that I would be insane enough to ENJOY seeing what is one of my favorite story arcs in XIV that is intrinsically tied to my favorite characters completely drop the ball because it was relegated to a patch story that does not properly acknowledge the amount of investment or history of the events taking place in said patch story. Do you honestly think that people like me just hate things for the sake of it? When I have been rewarded many times for being aware of the underlying state of the narrative and excellent world building over the course of XIV's existence?

I am NOT asking for a rewrite or for this filler story to not happen. I am asking for the writers to properly respect the context of the story that other writers wrote! If we had enough time to talk about Coffee Biscuits and Night's Blessed rituals and that stupid trolley and all the fairly justified worshipping we get in the First, the Crystarium should have had an optional focus on NPCs who are all linked to the Void quests! These are major characters in this sub-plot.

How hard would it have been to have us have the option of saying "Before we go to get approval for this tower thing, there's some people who you deserve to speak to, you should know that there has ALWAYS been people trying to help you. It's not just your new friends, you've had unknown allies in your corner the whole time." This could've been huge! And imagine if they did meet, and Cylva or Unukalhai had some non-voiced dialogue like "Yes, when Baron fell, and the Contramemoria took a turn for the worst, the townsfolk being turned, that's when we knew we had to band together. But it was too late by then. But we haven't given up! And now we can take back our home!" So not only would we get a little preview of the dungeon environment and redemption later on, we'd see that this was a massive turning point for EVERYONE, not just Durante. And it even bolsters Zero's character, that her contemporaries do not see her as a unsalvageable voidsent, but a comrade! Imagine if, like in the Hero's Journey dungeon where that stupid idiot Hildabrand could even show up, we had a chance of seeing Unukalhai casting a spell or leading some civilians away from the voidsent that could cohesively tie together events that we knew happened and show the narrative during gameplay!

It's wasted! It's a WASTE OF MY INVESTMENT IN THE PLOT. And even if the future is better (spoilers: it won't be), it will never fix this disappointment. Don't you dare imply that I hate this just because I'm just a bitter person. I won't tolerate it. It's an insult to the person I was that was in love with the game.

[Atelier-Bagur]

I wouldnt call Shb's story complex. I suppose its complex if youve never experienced any other jrpg that had similar apocalypse/alt world plots (ahem, Tales of Symphonia did it better)

And Sorrow of Werlyt funny enough had more emotional baggage than Shb's msq. However I had a few eye rolls in its story when they started to give almost every NPC their own sad story (that one girl who was standing alongside Gaius and that Elezen dude who wanted revenge commented that she had a sad backstory too is what did it for me). It got predictable.

[Theodric]

I don't get how this is difficult to understand.

It's rather weird for fragments to remain after being told that their souls were burned up, especially when multiple sources state as much. Including a story written from Venat's own perspective which is the image you responded to being quoted.

Then there's the following question from the post Endwalker story clarification Q&A as quoted below:

Q: Venat said that not even her soul would remain, but what does that mean? I’m really fond of her character and want to see her again.

A: Souls are also made of aether, and she had used so much aether that even her soul was gone. Zodiark absorbed those who were sacrificed and was still able to maintain their souls within, whereas Hydaelyn did not have the leeway to preserve the souls of the summoners, including that of Venat herself. This difference was because Venat’s group was a very small minority compared to the group that had summoned Zodiark based on the Convocation’s decision. Venat’s soul, which was the last to remain, was used up in the trial against the Warrior of Light and their allies.

[aveyond-dreams]

It's rather weird for fragments to remain after being told that their souls were burned up, especially when multiple sources state as much. Including a story written from Venat's own perspective which is the image you responded to being quoted.

Then there's the following question from the post Endwalker story clarification Q&A as quoted below:

It literally feels like when writing Myths that previous lore was entirely disregarded or actively rewritten in order to fit whatever they were going for. Doesn't surprise me that they started with making the pantheon of the 12 even more bland by erasing their rivalries and relationships and now we come to the point where their souls weren't actually fully consumed.

They just did whatever they wanted and it's pretty obvious.

[Turtledeluxe]

Well, it's over. Now enjoy the next 3 years of Erenville and taco cat.

Throwing everything away in exchange for this was so not worth it.

And the premise for 7.0 is a letter to grandfather and a WoL fanboy from the new world. There's one thing 7.0 will have in common with previous expansions and that is that no matter where you go, the whole world already knows you're an esteemed adventurer.

[Theodric]

I suppose its complex if youve never experienced any other jrpg that had similar apocalypse/alt world plots (ahem, Tales of Symphonia did it better)

I think that's a rather strange assumption to make, particularly when the conversation on the previous page consists of...referencing other JRPG's and a lot of us have spoken at length over the years that we've posted here about games we've enjoyed played.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that Shadowbringers is the best story ever, though for many it was certainly one of the two expansions where the game properly embraced nuance in the main scenario quests - with the other expansion being Heavenward.

As for the overabundance of 'sob stories', that is in turn a consequence of the game's protagonists being clad in ridiculous levels of plot armour. I don't like the 'feels based storytelling' being so common, either, though if they're not going to have any lasting consequences or real stakes for the same characters we're forced to follow around from region to region then their tried and true tactic of playing sad music as an enemy or ally begins speaking on the trauma of their past is going to continue.

Sure, they could throw in a completely unsympathetic enemy but then they wouldn't allow them to actually do anything memorable given the game's current stance on meaningful consequences.

[Turtledeluxe]

It's rather weird for fragments to remain after being told that their souls were burned up, especially when multiple sources state as much. Including a story written from Venat's own perspective which is the image you responded to being quoted.

Then there's the following question from the post Endwalker story clarification Q&A as quoted below:

That's not exactly a contradiction. The Twelve weren't saved per say. Those aren't the Twelve's original bodies.

What I'm saying is why aren't they allowed to be remade into primal form like Venat...since that's clearly what happened? You aren't fighting their original bodies, but a primal made from their essence.

[Atelier-Bagur]

I think that's a rather strange assumption to make, particularly when the conversation on the previous page consists of...referencing other JRPG's and a lot of us have spoken at length over the years that we've posted here about games we've enjoyed played.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that Shadowbringers is the best story ever, though for many it was certainly one of the two expansions where the game properly embraced nuance in the main scenario quests - with the other expansion being Heavenward.

As for the overabundance of 'sob stories', that is in turn a consequence of the game's protagonists being clad in ridiculous levels of plot armour. I don't like the 'feels based storytelling' being so common, either, though if they're not going to have any lasting consequences or real stakes for the same characters we're forced to follow around from region to region then their tried and true tactic of playing sad music as an enemy or ally begins speaking on the trauma of their past is going to continue.

Sure, they could throw in a completely unsympathetic enemy but then they wouldn't allow them to actually do anything memorable given the game's current stance on meaningful consequences.

People certainly keep acting as if Shb is the best rpg story ever told. And thats what sickens me