What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

[aveyond-dreams]

Glad to see this thread is still around. A pity we still need it, I would have hoped FFXIV would have found its footing by now but that's not the case at all. Patch 6.3 was another major letdown in a long string of them that started the day Endwalker dropped. After the past 10 years were unceremoniously thrown away in Endwalker, the only chance this game has of telling a decent story in 7.0 is if whoever's in charge throws away all that happened this expansion in similar fashion.

We deserve so much better than this.

[Teraq]

aNcIeNtS aRe a dEaD hOrSe!!!!! sToP TaLkInG aBoUt aNcIeNtS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

lmao man go tell the writers that, why don't you? Because I think you've got a hat to eat...

First things first: that was incredibly boring and predictable a reveal. So much for Endwalker subverting all those expectations!

But hey, how about those brother and sister, hmm? I'll try to stay polite.

While Maira's and Nymeia's Japanese lines aren't exactly the same (unlike EN, of course, but are we surprised anymore?) (btw going back to doing the Elpis quests, it is notable that EN translated the second Behemoth name option as "Queen Behemoth" while it is King Behemoth in JP, as well as in FR. How unnecessary.), it still makes for one too many coincidences: the brother's time magic, the Nymeia lily mention, the trash mobs.

This feels spiteful, honestly. Given that it's the side quest we all like to mention the most when we point out that Ancients actually cared about their creations enough to give them death rites and that Hermes was an ignorant, asocial idiot who never talked to anyone, because LOOK, THESE OBSERVERS HERE ACTUALLY HONOR THE BEASTS KILLED BY THE MURDERWOLVES!!!!!! –––

They made them into Venat followers. I'm speechless. Lmao.

While there are many other perfectly decent Ancients we see in Elpis and Amaurot, it's telling that they took the most significant quest, the one that's often brought up positively for Ancients respecting life and creations, and went and told us "See? The GOOD Ancients were on Venat's side!". Only the BAD Ancients were nostalgic fools who clearly spent their days creating and killing for fun – and most of them were!

See? They deserved it! Praise Mother!

On another note, I do appreciate the tacit admission that she screwed up so bad she had to fix her screw up somewhat. Yeah, I guess the unintelligible moaning blobs that used to be human didn't have a good chance at survival for those first few years, huh… But I thought henceforth man shall walk? Curious.

I do love how Venat is still perfectly interpretable as a narcissist with a god complex – I'm getting real Munchausen by proxy vibes from her reducing her entire species to malformed creatures comparable to children and then nurturing them back a little bit, but still broken… ew.

Yet another step back from Shadowbringers's thoughtful nuance for more black and white shallowness.

Honestly considering unsubbing, which is an actual first for me. It isn't helped by content being lesser and lesser, since there is no Bozja equivalent this expansion. I think I've got some Dragon Isles to explore…

I'll come back to see Pandaemonium to its end, of course. And I have less and less hope for it, frankly. I'm looking forward to my favorite character turning around and telling me Venat made the only correct choice, and he will ensure her plan goes without a hitch –– and this is the reason why he made the best candidate for Heart of Zodiark, haha! I hate myself for coming up with this, thanks!

(Edit) As for the Thirteenth, it sounds like a red herring, though I'll definitely be amused if

the final fight ends up being the Watcher, and he still doesn't get a proper name.

Here Lies Giga Simpeus Of Anamnesis Anyder – He Never Scored

As for MSQ,

LOL made you look, who even cares?

[Atelier-Bagur]

aNcIeNtS aRe a dEaD hOrSe!!!!! sToP TaLkInG aBoUt aNcIeNtS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yet another step back from Shadowbringers's thoughtful nuance for more black and white shallowness.
]

Ok how is Shadowbringer's story more nuanced for it being grey? All you do in that expansion is going around killing light wardens because they're killing their world. Oh yeah Vauthry and the people of Eulmore reeeallly had me think long and hard at the ramifications of our actions as the Warrior of Darkness. That expansion was a joke on its premise of being a villain. HECK the Japanese title was literally called "The Jet-Black Villains" yes indeed, we were totally being evil bastards in the First.

[Teraq]

Ok how is Shadowbringer's story more nuanced for it being grey? All you do in that expansion is going around killing light wardens because they're killing their world. Oh yeah Vauthry and the people of Eulmore reeeallly had me think long and hard at the ramifications of our actions as the Warrior of Darkness. That expansion was a joke on its premise of being a villain. HECK the Japanese title was literally called "The Jet-Black Villains" yes indeed, we were totally being evil bastards in the First.

I'm not sure how someone can miss the point this much without being a troll (is it? help me out here, please), but at least this one is intelligible.

[Atelier-Bagur]

I'm not sure how someone can miss the point this much without being a troll (is it? help me out here, please), but at least this one is intelligible.

Its probably time for you people to wake up and smell the mun tuy beans because Shadowbringer's plot wasnt that great to begin with.

[Kazhar]

Ok how is Shadowbringer's story more nuanced for it being grey? All you do in that expansion is going around killing light wardens because they're killing their world. Oh yeah Vauthry and the people of Eulmore reeeallly had me think long and hard at the ramifications of our actions as the Warrior of Darkness. That expansion was a joke on its premise of being a villain. HECK the Japanese title was literally called "The Jet-Black Villains" yes indeed, we were totally being evil bastards in the First.

When people talk about Shadowbringers being grey, it's in reference to the conflict between the Ascians and the Sundered (which is the actual core of the story), not the Light zombies backdrop.

[Teraq]

When people talk about Shadowbringers being grey, it's in reference to the conflict between the Ascians and the Sundered (which is the actual core of the story), not the Light zombies backdrop.

Though the Light not being good and Darkness not being bad was, as simplistic as it is, more nuanced than Endwalker walking back on this in its rhetoric. (i.e. all the lines about finding the light of hope and fighting back against the darkness of despair…)

It's like Shadowbringers did a 180° from the previously established story, and then Endwalker did a 180° from Shadowbringers. Which means being back exactly where we started. Brilliant!

[Atelier-Bagur]

When people talk about Shadowbringers being grey, it's in reference to the conflict between the Ascians and the Sundered (which is the actual core of the story), not the Light zombies backdrop.

which comes literally at the last bit of main Shb. Isnt that kind of telling that 90% of the majority of Shb was just pointless filler? Yeah it was a neat premise and we learned a lot more about Ardbert but when people talk about Shadowbringer's having a more nuanced story its really just that last bit with the Ascians and the Unsundered. Everything else prior to it was just your typical isekai, monster of the week flavor of jrpg journey, which I dont mind honestly, I enjoy these tropes but its stuff like this that you already seen with back in ARR.

[aveyond-dreams]

I seriously do not understand how we went from Shadowbringers to bending the story over backwards around a single Mary Sue character in Endwalker. Venat didn’t just sunder the world she sundered the past 10 years worth of story besides.

[Atelier-Bagur]

Here's what I initially expected when people told me I was gonna cry in ShB and the story was going to turn what you knew before over its head.

I thought the story was gonna be about us having to literally fight the balance of light overtaking the world...OUR WORLD not the First with us being villains despite us not wanting to do it. The whole deal with Black Rose and the Empire and the talk of calamities during the post Sb story made me believe that us saving the world multiple times was going to usher a calamity of light due to the abundance of good in the world. Basically what Ardbert and his group did when they defeated Mitron and Lohgrif but it was the Scions and in our world. I believed the theme was gonna be about having to literally becomes antagonists to the people we cared about, the nations we helped save just to bring the world back in balance. That honestly would've been very daring and gut wrenching if that was the case for the build up to what was to come.

Obviously that didnt happen as the whole build up with Garlemald and Black Rose was axed and concluded off screen (with Estenien and Gaius and eventually Zenos) but instead we got an abrupt stop with all that payoff with an isekai story in the First. You have no idea how much of a let-down that was to me when I finally realized thats what Shadowbringers was about. Oh well, I still liked the story we got regardless but man it couldve been so much better.