Thread: The Reasoning behind The Sundering? (*6.0 Endwalker Spoilers*)

Originally Posted by Absimiliard

tl;dr:
Venat condemned her own race to extinction based on lots of supposition and the word of some dude from the future.

Correction, the word of a person who had her ward, which was impossible for anybody but her to set upon somebody. Just from having her own Traveler's Ward on us, she knew she could trust us. She wouldn't put such a thing on just anybody.

Originally Posted by Absimiliard

tl;dr:
Venat condemned her own race to extinction based on lots of supposition and the word of some dude from the future.

I read it otherwise. Even beyond the fact that she had good reaaon to believe your story (you had her ward, it was apparent Emet-Selch could tell you weren't lying even despite his objections of your portrayal of him, your investigations into Hermes and Meteion supported your story, etc), there was also her actions and what she said her intentions were.

After telling your story to her, she said she couldn't understand why she would have ever gone to such a drastic extreme as sundering, she knew there must have been a reason but at the time she couldn't fathom it. A clear indication that she wouldn't take an action so lightly and would only do it if she had no choice.

She wanted to stop the Final Days. She tried her best to stop Meteion but when it was apparent she couldn't, she instead resolved to put a trace on Meteion and go back to support Emet and Hyths plan to get you out of harms way.

Afterwards, as she was describing her plans, it was clear she intended to find a way to stop the Final Days, but she couldn't bring the Convocation in on it because Hermes would now be Fandaniel, and if he were to remember the truth of it all, he could potentially make the situation even worse. She had no choice but to gather followers she could trust.

We don't know what else she did in the lead up to the Final Days, but when they came, it was clear she was trying to reach out to the other Amaurotians, trying to find an alternative to Zodiark. But when she saw all that fervent support of Zodiark, and their willingness bow to him and sacrifice everything to him, that's when she realised why she resorted to the Sundering. Her people were already lost. Their fanatical devotion to Zodiark and their willingness to sacrifice anything to bring back their lost paradise would ultimately lead to the death of her world. So... she became Hydaelin, and sundered the world. Her people were doomed, but perhaps the world and its future civilizations were not.

The reasoning is that society that rejects suffering will end up depressed and could not overcome any struggle. Meteion was still out there. All it would take is for a bunch of depressed ancients to pray for Zodiark to stop covering the planet with Aether and let Meteion's song destroy them and Etheirys would be gone.

Originally Posted by Kofufu

What bugs me is that my understanding of The Sundering this entire time, prior to Endwalker, was that it was done specifically to weaken Zodiark. I understand that the revelation of dynamis wouldn\\'t come until later, but weakening Zodiark is kind of a big reason in and of iteself. It now feels like it was just an afterthought.

Things can be done for more than one reason. And the Sundering was done for three.

1. Because only sundered people would be able to undergo a journey that could actually stop Meteion. All things considered this actually seemed to be the least important reason to her at the time, and in fact doesn't even seem to factor into the post-Elpis cutscene much at all, but it does end up being the most important result of it all to us in the present day.
2. To render Zodiark inoperable, without killing him. Zodiark is an important figure for the ecosystem and a vital defense against Meteion, but people... kinda can't be trusted to have him around as an 'insert mass sacrifices to solve problems' button.
3. To stop the Ancients themselves from going down their path. This is definitely the morally shady part of it, because she essentially ended Ancient civilization (although whether that could be called 'death' is a complex question) to save the planet they live on, since they were very ready to hit the aforementioned Zodiark Button, and were likely going to keep pressing it.

None of these reasons are erased by the presence of another, they all simply... exist.

It's always interesting seeing the forums' take on characters.

Amaurotians: 'You sacrificed 75% of our population to a supreme deity, and now you want to sacrifice the rest of life on the planet to it? My life is a chip in your pile, ante up!'
Forums: 'Aww. Can we not save them, though?'

Emet: 'Let's trigger extinction level events in each of the star's reflections to free a supreme deity that we can sacrifice the remainder of these inferior beings to!'
Forums: 'Aww. Did he really have to die, though?'

Venat: 'I'll hold off this idiotic creation for a few millennia to buy time for the buns to invent space travel and for you to stop the Final Days (or run away and start a new life on another Aether dense planet, if you so choose). Good luck!'
Forums:
'Mary Sue!'
'Villain!'
'Why do you believe some random person who claims to be from the future anyways?'
'Why didn't you tell those geniuses on the Convocation the information you got from said random person who claims to be from the future?'
'Why did you have to be mean to Zodiark? Couldn't he save us from bird girl after he was fed the souls of all life on the planet?'
'Why did you have to take away everyone's god powers?'

Honestly, if I'd encountered opinions like that I would have sundered everything as well. Half of an INT score of zero is still zero, so they're honestly not losing out on that much.

I wonder why seemingly none of the unsundered ever went to Hydaelin to have a talk? If we could find her in the aethereal sea as lowly sundered fragments, it should be no problem for them to reach (especially emet - hades, keeper of the underworld or how it was called).

They know that hydaelin isn't just some god or mindless primal, that she has an ascian as her core same as elidibus is for zodiark. Someone they possibly even knew or were friends with (emet and vemat seemingly had quite some familiarity with each other). In all the time since the sundering they never thought to go talk to her, hear her reasons? Or at least clarification on the more precise circumstances of the sundering? To seek a dialogue with the 4th unsundered ascian / ancient, Venat.

Originally Posted by Chyro

I wonder why seemingly none of the unsundered ever went to Hydaelin to have a talk? If we could find her in the aethereal sea as lowly sundered fragments, it should be no problem for them to reach (especially emet - hades, keeper of the underworld or how it was called).

They know that hydaelin isn't just some god or mindless primal, that she has an ascian as her core same as elidibus is for zodiark. Someone they possibly even knew or were friends with (emet and vemat seemingly had quite some familiarity with each other). In all the time since the sundering they never thought to go talk to her, hear her reasons? Or at least clarification on the more precise circumstances of the sundering? To seek a dialogue with the 4th unsundered ascian / ancient, Venat.

Why would they go talk to her? They see her as the destroyer of all they knew and cared for, why the hell would you talk to that person?

If someone blew up my apartment building, my thought probably would not be 'I wonder what their side of the story is'.

Originally Posted by Chyro

I wonder why seemingly none of the unsundered ever went to Hydaelin to have a talk? If we could find her in the aethereal sea as lowly sundered fragments, it should be no problem for them to reach (especially emet - hades, keeper of the underworld or how it was called).

They know that hydaelin isn't just some god or mindless primal, that she has an ascian as her core same as elidibus is for zodiark. Someone they possibly even knew or were friends with (emet and vemat seemingly had quite some familiarity with each other). In all the time since the sundering they never thought to go talk to her, hear her reasons? Or at least clarification on the more precise circumstances of the sundering? To seek a dialogue with the 4th unsundered ascian / ancient, Venat.

Probably because of her protections and knowing there's a chance she'd Sunder them right there. Sunder one of them, and they've lost. They did not want to take the chance.

Originally Posted by Chyro

I wonder why seemingly none of the unsundered ever went to Hydaelin to have a talk? If we could find her in the aethereal sea as lowly sundered fragments, it should be no problem for them to reach (especially emet - hades, keeper of the underworld or how it was called).

They know that hydaelin isn't just some god or mindless primal, that she has an ascian as her core same as elidibus is for zodiark. Someone they possibly even knew or were friends with (emet and vemat seemingly had quite some familiarity with each other). In all the time since the sundering they never thought to go talk to her, hear her reasons? Or at least clarification on the more precise circumstances of the sundering? To seek a dialogue with the 4th unsundered ascian / ancient, Venat.

To be fair, did they *know* that Hydaelyn was Venat? Lahabrea wasn't involved with Elpis, obviously, but Emet would know...Except no, he lost his memory in Elpis as well. There's no real guarantee that either of them (Or Elidibus/Zodiark) would have known exactly who she was beyond the Hydaelyn persona.