So you're telling me..

[Wyakin]

Do I raid? Yes I do, but not on this character. Feel free to trawl through my logs. My main is Enyalios Ares on Odin server. Check my last few raid tier clears, check to see if I’ve cleared ultimate.

At the end of the day, buffing samurai and black mage won’t make content trivial. Mostly because it hasn’t even been released yet. The content that’s out is already trivial. Nerfing monk and reaper would be a sorry ass shame

[ssunny2008]

Do I raid? Yes I do, but not on this character. Feel free to trawl through my logs. My main is Enyalios Ares on Odin server. Check my last few raid tier clears, check to see if I’ve cleared ultimate.

At the end of the day, buffing samurai and black mage won’t make content trivial. Mostly because it hasn’t even been released yet. The content that’s out is already trivial. Nerfing monk and reaper would be a sorry ass shame

It´s not about logs, it´s about the claims you make.

And to buff SAM / BLM isn´t the point. SE would need to buff everything but the named classes, which would be just dumb af. You said it yourself, the content is already trivial. Buffing stuff or leaving the balancing as it is, would make everything further trivial too. Nerfs are highly needed in all categories.

[Kolsykol]

Can’t even be bothered to read most of this thread and the stupid idiotic examples of why reaper is “overpowered”

If reaper is so OP why is monk out performing it in 3/6 of the current available fights at 90? If it’s healing is so over powered what about chakra? If it’s utility is so powerful what about brotherhood?

Ladies and gentlemen no, reaper isn’t over powered. BLM and SAM are simply under performing

I mean you could either buff others or nerf in order to balance.
I think that currently both are needed.

I also don't think that they should buff too much either because content becomes too easy, they've already sorta ruined the old content by essentially doubling potencies over the years and with all the new abilities etc.
If all you do is buff then it sorta turns content into a joke at some point.
You can already go through the extremes pretty quickly as it is even without pots and food.

Even with just an okay group you'll end the second EX without even getting anywhere close to the enrage I honestly feel like the damage in the fight is already too high.

No, its not. Lets be real here, job complexity is purely subjective

Eh... No.
It absolutely isn't.

[Acece]

I´m still convinced SAM has been (and probably is) one of the easiest classes to optimize. I don´t argue about the last 10 DPS like some 100% parser would do, i argue about the kit, the possibilities it offers with having "no strict rotation" in some way and how easy and accessible it is. Other classes have strict rotations and one missclick can fck up everything. You do even need to delay stuff or in kind of old MNK you had to care for a bunch of positionals.
On the other hand SAM has offered tons of DPS for "worse players", just because the kit has everything you want on a melee and braindead burst on top. That SAM had overall so much more DPS "for free" wasn´t justified in any way. Same with BLM... either they should be even to their counterpartes or have max. 3% more DPS caused by the missing utility. But not that amount it was in Shb.

Each there own, I personally think decision making makes a dps hard to optimize rather then rng or relying on other players. I also think trying to play sam correctly in shb as in lining yourself within raid buffs is way harder then any of the other jobs. That's why I think balancing around difficulty is dumb because for a lot of other people sam is the hardest to optimize (me) and for others its ninja, blm, or monk.

[Arkdra]

Eh... No.
It absolutely isn't.

It definitely is. I can't play black mage worth a damn but lots of people out there can go to town with the job. Other people can't deal with the APM requirements of Ninja but I've never had a problem with it. Some people had problems with the kinda rapidfire mechanics of e4, but I find it fun and easy. Any mechanic that makes me look at the arena edge will probably murder me though.

[Kolsykol]

It definitely is. I can't play black mage worth a damn but lots of people out there can go to town with the job. Other people can't deal with the APM requirements of Ninja but I've never had a problem with it. Some people had problems with the kinda rapidfire mechanics of e4, but I find it fun and easy. Any mechanic that makes me look at the arena edge will probably murder me though.

That's not what people are talking about when they're talking about complexity.
People are talking about stuff like SAM Tsubame-gaeshi in SHB.
It's objectively less complex and involved now with two stacks than it was before, that's just a fact.

I actually like the two stacks but just because I like it better doesn't mean that it isn't less complex and that I don't understand why there might be SAM mains who dislike it.
To some extent I feel that way a little too because I do think that it felt rewarding to adapt when you ended up drifting and lining things up correctly and precisely.
It doesn't feel rewarding now it feels brainless.

It's the same on MNK, there was a lot of thought and preparation that went into lining up the burst phase the moment you drifted away from your '' dummy rotation '' player skill became more involved and important and it added complexity to the Job.
Same on BLM, you have a ton more mobility now than you did before and it inherently makes the Job less complex in the context of difficult content.
Again that's not to say it's inherently a negative, I've actually been focusing on gearing BLM along with NIN in EW I'll have bis next reset and I am strongly considering maining it.
I love BLM in EW I've had the most fun on it in the Extremes.
But BLM is less complex now than before.

It's still complex imo especially with Ley Lines but it's definitely less so than before and you have more '' fail safes ''.

[Xiaoki]

Reaper is ahead and will most likely get nerfed but there are other roles and Jobs that really need to be looked at before Reaper.

Like Paladin the other tanks, Ninja should be buffed a lot before Reaper is nerfed a little, White Mage needs help and Physical DPS and Caster DPS are pretty much just one Job each now.

Bringing up the many extreme under-performers before the single slight over-performer would do way more for the overall health and balance of the game.

[ssunny2008]

Reaper is ahead and will most likely get nerfed but there are other roles and Jobs that really need to be looked at before Reaper.

Like Paladin the other tanks, Ninja should be buffed a lot before Reaper is nerfed a little, White Mage needs help and Physical DPS and Caster DPS are pretty much just one Job each now.

Bringing up the many extreme under-performers before the single slight over-performer would do way more for the overall health and balance of the game.

Given to your claim everything but SGE, DRK, MNK, RPR, SAM and BLM is underperforming. Meanwhile ppl so even cry why DRK is not broken as WAR in kind of self-sustain.

Without one of the named top DPS classes, you're still able to beat any current content. And that's something SE needs to balance around, not the top tier classes which are easy-mode and allow to skip or to ignore a bunch of mechanics.

I agree that NIN needs a minimum buff, but the rest i named needs a hard nerf in DPS, meanwhile tanks need a flat nerf on their defs. Otherwise the content would need huge buffs, which won't happen.

[ssunny2008]

Cant Edit...

The most classes don't underperform. They're balanced troughout the content, their kit and needed efford to play.

[jadeblade]

RPR needs some serious nerfs those who say otherwise are in denial, Why the average RPR are out dpsing some of the good BLM and SAM , on top of having utility buff.

RPR should be below SAM, BLM because they are pure dps.

RPR should be below MNK, DRG,NIN,RDM as they have the most brain dead dps there is. RPR is ez mode dps this patch let’s see what happens in savage patch.