UNDERCUTTING....

[Green_and_a_Half]

Honestly, I think people are confusing undercutting and competition. If someone can provide the same good at a cheaper price its competition. If they are gathering thier own materials and not buying from the markets then they can sell at a lower price. everything they make will be profit. its a benefit of having a gathering class to gather the materials you need for crafting.

I know i would sell at a lower price if i gathered my own materials or my the input costs of bought items for any craftable item was low.

or you can camp the markets and buy low priced items and sell them at higher prices like others said if you have the gil resources to do it. its basically artificially increasing demand by removing some of the supply.

I did this before merge by was selling crab bows for 100k, and had been for a week, so all history was 100k, then some one stepped in and set 5 of them for sell for 60k.
I bought all 5 and resold for 100k.
I dont see an issue doing that to keep the market correct.

[Achtzen]

I did this before merge by was selling crab bows for 100k, and had been for a week, so all history was 100k, then some one stepped in and set 5 of them for sell for 60k.
I bought all 5 and resold for 100k.
I dont see an issue doing that to keep the market correct.

I don't think it would really correct anything. The person that sold the bow for 60k knows he can continue to sell at that price. You just bought his goods and decided to re-sell it at your initial price. In the end everyone is happy. the initial seller makes roughly 260~300k gil and you make roughly 170-200k profit considering your input cost of purchasing at 60k a bow and reselling at 100k giving about 40k profit from each sale.

[TheVedis]

I did this before merge by was selling crab bows for 100k, and had been for a week, so all history was 100k, then some one stepped in and set 5 of them for sell for 60k.
I bought all 5 and resold for 100k.
I dont see an issue doing that to keep the market correct.

this only works to an extent

think of this, you just bought 5 for 60k

now people go in there, see them for 100k, see they sold for 60k, and decide to wait til they are 60k again....since they see a bunch sold for 60k not too long ago



also ive brung up this arguement before to those who are using gathering as a reason why they can afford to sell lower


if an item cost 30k in mats to make, but sells for 20k, you are not really making a profit by selling the item at 20k when you coulda sold the mats for 30k, so gathering your own items, while it is a way to keep your costs down, isnt a viable excuse for undercutting everyone in a market where the items are now costing less then the materials

do the math, 30k for materials, 20k if you craft them...if you care about money why are you crafting them and undercutting people

[Green_and_a_Half]

this only works to an extent

think of this, you just bought 5 for 60k

now people go in there, see them for 100k, see they sold for 60k, and decide to wait til they are 60k again....since they see a bunch sold for 60k not too long ago



also ive brung up this arguement before to those who are using gathering as a reason why they can afford to sell lower


if an item cost 30k in mats to make, but sells for 20k, you are not really making a profit by selling the item at 20k when you coulda sold the mats for 30k, so gathering your own items, while it is a way to keep your costs down, isnt a viable excuse for undercutting everyone in a market where the items are now costing less then the materials

do the math, 30k for materials, 20k if you craft them...if you care about money why are you crafting them and undercutting people

this happens when people are grinding, it works out well when they grind on mats and sell them for less then the raw mats to make them saving me a step

[Lux_Rayna]

people stop getting the mats, then people stop selling the gear cuz they arent making it

and then it all just stops, until that 1 person goes back in and starts to try to make a fortune on it and it starts all over again


what we need is more stability, NOT price drops, profit is what the system is about, trying to tell people otherwise is just insane

Ahhh but thats how markets work, the boom and they crash. If you want stability take out the MW altogether and have npcs buy everything at good prices. Ppl wanted this so you have to live with the reality of economics. This is how it goes, we cant all be winners here. Stability is impossible in any free market...sooner or later the price will crash or boom until it reverses direction.

Maybe SE should just have everything bought and sold through npcs at established prices. Thats basically what youre asking for. Take out MW altogether because its clear ppl cant handle the reality of a competitive market.

[Achtzen]

if an item cost 30k in mats to make, but sells for 20k, you are not really making a profit by selling the item at 20k when you coulda sold the mats for 30k, so gathering your own items, while it is a way to keep your costs down, isnt a viable excuse for undercutting everyone in a market where the items are now costing less then the materials

do the math, 30k for materials, 20k if you craft them...if you care about money why are you crafting them and undercutting people

It really depends on the seller. Not everyone is competent to know how to maximize their profits and end up short changing themsevles by not evaluating thier input costs prior to entering the market for that item.

But to be completely honest nothing in markets is fair. I know if entered a market i would check and see what my input costs for any craft was going to be for required materials and decide whether or not to enter. Knowing how I am, I always farm my materials that way my input costs are at or close to zero every time. So no matter what the market price is. I will always turn a profit no matter how big or small it is.

[Noblewar]

Bunch of hypocrite people complaining about undercuts.

Why do I dare call you that? Because your all a bunch of greedy a holes. I bet you cry babies buy undercut items! Try arguing with me that you will buy a 600k item when someone undercuts it for 550k! Everyone is GUILTY of buying undercut items anyone dare say they don't only lie to themselves.

I hope MODS lock this worthless thread.

[Geo]

If I'm losing money selling the item, then I won't sell it.

But let me come up with a fictional example. An item costs 1mil to make, and it sells for 10mil because few people make it and they've all decided that it should be priced at 10mil.

I come along and sell my item for 8mil. I'm still making a big profit, and I can ensure that I'm the only one selling the item now. Nobody is going to buy it for 10mil. Those other people are either going to have to bow out, or drop their prices to compete with me -- at which point I get to decide again if I want to drop my price and drive them out, or if it's no longer worth it for me to make and sell this item.

During this whole process, I'm not losing anything. I'm the only one making pure profit.

This is the dumbest comment ever. Because, more people will continue to undercut and drive the price to the ground. Look at the big picture genius, if they buy it for 8mill they'll buy it for 9,999,999 gil as well.

Undercutting is fine.... and great.

Undercutting by 10-20% is stupid it drives the price down way too fast, and eventually the items aren't worth the time and effort.]

And this is why I stay in the double/triple meld business, because people don't like chance money. And we make our own prices.

[TheVedis]

This is the dumbest comment ever. Because, more people will continue to undercut and drive the price to the ground. Look at the big picture genius, if they buy it for 8mill they'll buy it for 9,999,999 gil as well.

Undercutting is fine.... and great.

Undercutting by 10-20% is stupid it drives the price down way too fast, and eventually the items aren't worth the time and effort.

you want stupid

item sells for 10k, stacks of 99
someone posts a single piece of that item up, not even a stack, for 8k gil

and the 10k sellers notice this, and instead of waiting out the 1 guy with his single piece, undercut him too bringing the price down to 5k...


thats the kind of inteligence people are working with right now.


or also, 500+ of an item sells per day, about that much is made to make sure theirs sells this morning instead of being sold perhaps when they get home from work, they cut the cost 50%.
their item would have easily sold, but they insist on doing it anyway because they demand it sells first

[Denmo]