I love SMN

[Adonan]

You know what, looking back I would have to say I had more fun with the old Summoner. I wasn't a fan of the DoT mage playstyle, and the pets left much to be desired, but it was a more engaging job. I initially liked the new SMN because it felt more like the SMN of the classic Final Fantasy games. However, because it's so simple, the shiny new summons and particles affects only held me over for so long.

I haven't even played it much and the boredom everyone is talking about is already setting in. I like the class fantasy of this new SMN, but the gameplay needs serious work.

[Mondschnee]

While I appreciate the SMN rework and think it's a good base to work with, at its current state, that's what it is in my opinion, a base. The Job at level 90 feels like it should have been like that at level 70. Level 90 should have many more layers added to it.

Even though I'm not trying to get my hopes up in terms of another significant rework, I still want to leave my feedback here. I'm making this post es a dedicated SMN main ever since I've started playing back in March. So... yeah, here we go.

1) First and foremost, I'd like to see SMN as a caster again. The short "cast" times are nice, but it's taking away from the job's identity, which should not be equal to physical ranged. I would not mind getting Ruin 2 or an equivalent to that back and in return have more cast times, so I can actually cast something as a caster. I know, sounds wild.
That doesn't mean there shouldn't be phases in which you have a good amount of movement. This is one thing I feel like the previous version of SMN did better. You had an answer to every situation and yet you really felt like a caster.

2) The rotation at level 90 lacks depth and proper build-up. I'm not saying it should be as "complex" as before (even though I personally did not find it complex before), but it should have more layers to it. As it is right now, the rotation doesn't feel rewarding, and that's a shame. You're summoning literal primals as if it's nothing, and while it looks cool, aesthetics alone will get boring at some point.

3) Along with that, I'd like to see potencies adjusted. As SMN is right now, it simply cannot compete with the other casters. RDM brings everything SMN brings and more damage on top of that and therefore it's hard to justify a SMN spot in a raid. Again, we're summoning literal primals and we have nothing to show for it.

Even without adjustments suggested above, some of the primals need their potencies adjusted imho, especially Ifrit's as the long cast times currentely are not worth it. And as it takes longer for Phoenix to be active, it should make more damage than Bahamut, not less.

I have seen several good suggestions on japanese forums when it comes to adjustments, so I really hope they take them to heart. Again, I'm trying really hard not to get my hopes up.
For now, I'll leave it at that.

[Hagen]

I don't mind not being able to use Carbuncle skills while summoning other stuff. It may feel a little odd but at least it is SOMETHING to manage, something to think when it might be best used.

[Hasrat]

Kinda funny how the old complaints were about SMN not actually "summoning" like in games of old. "Give us attacks that are summons that are cool and powerful." And now it sorta seems like they took to that advice, and now it's too boring, "I want to cast stuff."



Anyway, I kinda never got around to touching SMN in ShB, which... I'm guessing doesn't matter much with how completely they overhauled. Just trying to make sure I've got the gist of this, at 70 at least (and doesn't look like it changes much from there..).

Summon Carbuncle, because it's required even if it doesn't do anything itself.
Energy Drain (or aoe) presumably on cooldown, Fester (or aoe) as you please, you get one Ruin 4, use it for movement or whatever I guess.
Summon Bahamut, use Death Flare and Akh Morn before timer is up.
Summon an Egi, burn out the Gemshines (or aoe), summon next, repeat. Presumably movement considerations go into this part. But use them all anyway?

One thing I don't super like is how much they make a distinction of doing elemental damage, even though elemental aspects don't do anything. But I guess that's just part of dressing up spells to make it look like there's more variety.

[Mondschnee]

Kinda funny how the old complaints were about SMN not actually "summoning" like in games of old. "Give us attacks that are summons that are cool and powerful." And now it sorta seems like they took to that advice, and now it's too boring, "I want to cast stuff."

You make it sound like casting =/= summoning. You can cast and still summon, or at least alternate between both. It's always about a good balance of things. The point is that SMN isn't acting like a caster but more like physical ranged class as of now and that's missing the point imo.

[Hasrat]

Ehhh... I might have to play around with the job more to get a good feel. But it's possible I may agree. Unlike AST, I'm not really sure SMN has enough integral weaving going on to need the short cast times.

[Shiroe]

Love the new Smn too! (still keeping one dot would have been nice) .., and pre-90 Smn feels strong too, but at 90 it feels a bit / tick weak

(not a strong caster dps anymore.., sure Blm is and should remain top caster dps .. but feels as if Smn fell behind Rdm & Mnk too, a bit more thsn excepted.., both 2 dps also with slight or (more, Rdm) utility.., Smn feels like it dropped low as ever (normally, new classes or big reworks start off strong or OP, than get lowered after time a bit, .. new Smn is not the case, and somehow doubt it will get a buff)

[Gallus]

Things I like about the new SMN:

- Shiny and spectacular. Every spell you press feels relevant.
- Each primal has its own minirotation and feels unique (even if they are still very simple).
- Extremely smooth.
- Doesn't suffer from downtimes.
- No filler.

Things I feel could slightly improve or get tweaked:

- Searing Light is at a fixed 120 sec. Summon Bahamut/Phoenix is at 57-60 sec depending on your spell speed. It's not a big deal, but it's slightly annoying.
- Summon Bahamut/Phoenix should be two separate buttons and you should be able to decide which one you want every time, bahamut for some extra tiny dps or phoenix for a powerful aoe heal.

[godvivec]

(not a strong caster dps anymore.., sure Blm is and should remain top caster dps .. but feels as if Smn fell behind Rdm & Mnk too, a bit more thsn excepted.., both 2 dps also with slight or (more, Rdm) utility.., Smn feels like it dropped low as ever (normally, new classes or big reworks start off strong or OP, than get lowered after time a bit, .. new Smn is not the case, and somehow doubt it will get a buff)

Damage wise, Monk is ahead of every other class, except reaper. It's very very strong, if a little janky. RDM is ahead of summoner, admittedly not a huge amount, but it's ahead in most useful categories. Damage and Utility being the two most important.
I have no doubt Square will do some potency changes, but not sure how they'll address being so far behind in functional utility.

They COULD add a little complexity in between the weaves with some sort of use for aetherflow. You build up stacks to achieve something and get to summon a support summon. It would add a little something to do between ruin spams.

[zcrash970]

Love the new Smn too! (still keeping one dot would have been nice) .., and pre-90 Smn feels strong too, but at 90 it feels a bit / tick weak

(not a strong caster dps anymore.., sure Blm is and should remain top caster dps .. but feels as if Smn fell behind Rdm & Mnk too, a bit more thsn excepted.., both 2 dps also with slight or (more, Rdm) utility.., Smn feels like it dropped low as ever (normally, new classes or big reworks start off strong or OP, than get lowered after time a bit, .. new Smn is not the case, and somehow doubt it will get a buff)

Smn is close to the very bottom and with little room to grow since the skill floor and ceiling are very close, so once more people get more comfortable with their jobs, it is very possible that new smn will be left in the dust.