Healer design is still terrible and I'm tired of apologizing for it.

[OtakuSempai]

First post, been a lurker here for years.

My initial experiences with Endwalker has of course been on the new shiny job, Sage, because healing and support is where (traditionally) most of my enjoyment in this game has come from. I was hoping for a shift in direction for the healing role or at least an expansion on the philosophy from Shb, since I profoundly hate the current paradigm of 1 button spam for healers. It seems like SE just doubled down on that paradigm and I'm so frustrated with it it's brought me out of the shadows to complain about it on the forums.

For the life of me, I can't fathom why SE would design the healing role around being completely unnecessary if the tank is pressing 1-2-3 correctly. It's like SE is so frightened about having any healers (or tanks for that matter) be required to play their role they balance group content around 75% of people being afk, all for what? Appease those who would rather stare at pretty particle effects instead of playing a videogame? It feels patronizing, quite honestly.

Needless to say I'm very disappointed and my enjoyment of the game has incredibly diminished because job design in general has seemed to have taken a big hit post-Shb with no meaningful plus side. I know I'm not the only one who feels this way and I wish SE would at least give the appearance they're listening like they have done so well in the past.

[RinaShinomiya]

I feel like Sage was a move in the right direction but there is obviously room for improvement I do however believe that simply giving healers a 1-2-3 combo won't be enough, we'd need a combat orientated Job gauge to manage which would require SE to get creative and finally start paying attention to hotbar bloat and unnecessary buttons, esp since they basically stripped the conjurer roots from WHM while before 5.0 you could've probably easily make a diet coke Black Mage rotation for White Mage using Stone, Wind and Water elements. Heck, Yshtola even uses offensive Water spells in trust dungeons, boils my blood every time i see them.

[OtakuSempai]

I feel like Sage was a move in the right direction but there is obviously room for improvement I do however believe that simply giving healers a 1-2-3 combo won't be enough, we'd need a combat orientated Job gauge to manage which would require SE to get creative and finally start paying attention to hotbar bloat and unnecessary buttons, esp since they basically stripped the conjurer roots from WHM while before 5.0 you could've probably easily make a diet coke Black Mage rotation for White Mage using Stone, Wind and Water elements. Heck, Yshtola even uses offensive Water spells in trust dungeons, boils my blood every time i see them.

I agree 100% and would take some actual development time to implement. But hey, that's why we pay them right?

[Brandedblade]

First post, been a lurker here for years.

My initial experiences with Endwalker has of course been on the new shiny job, Sage, because healing and support is where (traditionally) most of my enjoyment in this game has come from. I was hoping for a shift in direction for the healing role or at least an expansion on the philosophy from Shb, since I profoundly hate the current paradigm of 1 button spam for healers. It seems like SE just doubled down on that paradigm and I'm so frustrated with it it's brought me out of the shadows to complain about it on the forums.

For the life of me, I can't fathom why SE would design the healing role around being completely unnecessary if the tank is pressing 1-2-3 correctly. It's like SE is so frightened about having any healers (or tanks for that matter) be required to play their role they balance group content around 75% of people being afk, all for what? Appease those who would rather stare at pretty particle effects instead of playing a videogame? It feels patronizing, quite honestly.

Needless to say I'm very disappointed and my enjoyment of the game has incredibly diminished because job design in general has seemed to have taken a big hit post-Shb with no meaningful plus side. I know I'm not the only one who feels this way and I wish SE would at least give the appearance they're listening like they have done so well in the past.

[elioaiko]

I do feel that healer design overall is lacking but only because they more or less feel like healbots. I don't mind being DPS-oriented because its the only thing on healer that feels conductive past progging. There is no support outside of cards and chain stratagem.

Unfortunately, looking at the healer queues now and how fast people swapped off Sage, its only evident that people do not like playing healer. It's a myriad of issues ranging from gameplay issues, lack of meaningful impact, and overall rewarding gameplay but mostly importantly, player mentality.

It's no secret that healer and tank out of any online game with a class trinity/system would have these roles high in demand and not just in MMOs. Overwatch tank and support queues are near-instant. Genshin Impact's co-op never has a healer on deck unless you play Bennett ofc. Killing Floor 2 only has one healing perk which usually is run by a single player.

People have come to this mindset that healers in general are not fun and comes with too much responsibility which is not true. In reality, DPS have the hardest job but are less noticeable when they fail. If DPS can't even beat healers and tanks in killing the boss faster, then what are they there for? This is why tanks and healers have been pushing for more rewarding DPS play styles because DPS is the only thing they can do meaningfully. All these games have one thing in common, beat the timer or kill it faster than it can kill you. We don't need extra healing if we can kill it faster, making the devs' attempt at forcing more healing to go in vain. People will want the healers with the most damage/raid support.

This is why you see AST rise to the top every expansion, they have buffs. SCH will likely be up there too. WHM is WHM and will be a safe pick regardless. Sage's entire gig seems to be damage but idk, if they're the personal dps healer version of SCH, then I'm not sure what they're going to do.

[OtakuSempai]

I do feel that healer design overall is lacking but only because they more or less feel like healbots. I don't mind being DPS-oriented because its the only thing on healer that feels conductive past progging. There is no support outside of cards and chain stratagem.

Unfortunately, looking at the healer queues now and how fast people swapped off Sage, its only evident that people do not like playing healer. It's a myriad of issues ranging from gameplay issues, lack of meaningful impact, and overall rewarding gameplay but mostly importantly, player mentality.

It's no secret that healer and tank out of any online game with a class trinity/system would have these roles high in demand and not just in MMOs. Overwatch tank and support queues are near-instant. Genshin Impact's co-op never has a healer on deck unless you play Bennett ofc. Killing Floor 2 only has one healing perk which usually is run by a single player.

People have come to this mindset that healers in general are not fun and comes with too much responsibility which is not true. In reality, DPS have the hardest job but are less noticeable when they fail. If DPS can't even beat healers and tanks in killing the boss faster, then what are they there for? This is why tanks and healers have been pushing for more rewarding DPS play styles because DPS is the only thing they can do meaningfully. All these games have one thing in common, beat the timer or kill it faster than it can kill you. We don't need extra healing if we can kill it faster, making the devs' attempt at forcing more healing to go in vain. People will want the healers with the most damage/raid support.

This is why you see AST rise to the top every expansion, they have buffs. SCH will likely be up there too. WHM is WHM and will be a safe pick regardless. Sage's entire gig seems to be damage but idk, if they're the personal dps healer version of SCH, then I'm not sure what they're going to do.

I 100% agree with most of your post except I do think healers in general are not fun, and its due to them being badly designed. I can't imagine 1 button spam being engaging for most people.

And to touch on the other thing you said, yes healers and tanks will always be in demand because less people will play them and this seems to be a fundamental fact about multiplayer RPGs. I think the devs insistence to make the support roles in this game as braindead as possible is an attempt to address this fact, when really I think it turns off the role for people who would normally play them helping no one.

[Truen]

FF14 healers are the most basic, boring healers found in any MMO on the market. We spam one button WAY too much, but sadly Yoshi P thinks this is the greatest thing ever. The fun builds we enjoyed during Heavensward aren't coming back

[Szylver]

FF14 healers are the most basic, boring healers found in any MMO on the market. We spam one button WAY too much, but sadly Yoshi P thinks this is the greatest thing ever. The fun builds we enjoyed during Heavensward aren't coming back

Did you try the new AST? more buttons than a joystic can have and more APM than a SC2 player... sadly is all to keep the player busy without to much reward for it.

[Vivix]

Players ask to press 1111111 less.
SE invents new job where 111111 also heals and reduces it's cast time on all healers.

[Gemina]

First post, been a lurker here for years.

My initial experiences with Endwalker has of course been on the new shiny job, Sage, because healing and support is where (traditionally) most of my enjoyment in this game has come from. I was hoping for a shift in direction for the healing role or at least an expansion on the philosophy from Shb, since I profoundly hate the current paradigm of 1 button spam for healers. It seems like SE just doubled down on that paradigm and I'm so frustrated with it it's brought me out of the shadows to complain about it on the forums.

For the life of me, I can't fathom why SE would design the healing role around being completely unnecessary if the tank is pressing 1-2-3 correctly. It's like SE is so frightened about having any healers (or tanks for that matter) be required to play their role they balance group content around 75% of people being afk, all for what? Appease those who would rather stare at pretty particle effects instead of playing a videogame? It feels patronizing, quite honestly.

Needless to say I'm very disappointed and my enjoyment of the game has incredibly diminished because job design in general has seemed to have taken a big hit post-Shb with no meaningful plus side. I know I'm not the only one who feels this way and I wish SE would at least give the appearance they're listening like they have done so well in the past.

Firstly, welcome to the forums.

Next is I wish my response to your entry wasn't along the lines of telling you that you are preaching to the choir. A lot, and I do mean a lot of people here on the forums will agree with you. Unfortunately when that is the case, then it also becomes very difficult for you to provide a fresh perspective on the matter, and to interact with those who do oppose your views. In case you are not aware, there are many healers who support current healer design. Crazy, right?

The other thing I will mention is the devs do not create this false expectation that the players carry into every expansion. This is created by the players themselves, and I would even go as far to say the devs make sure to let the players know that encounter design isn't changing. Yet, they will still carry the expectation regardless.

Anyone who thought Sage would be this breakout healer that would "change the game" is the epitome of that false expectation. Most knew that despite all the fancy animations and a few more DPS options, SGE was still a healer at the end of the day. It is those players who are enjoying this job right now. It is also those players who have actually noticed that while the core concept of the job is the same, the manner which a SGE supports the party actually has them drawing upon their resources differently. In that sense, it has changed how a healer prioritizes their skills, which can make it feel quite different and take some getting used to. Just ask the many tanks who ate the floor with a SGE healer this past week (many of whom anticipated it).

I assure you, SE isn't frightened about anything. That's the echo chamber influencing your thoughts. They are however, conscious of how fallible human beings are, and that the very nature of the healer role is reactionary as a result of that. Healer is not the best role - nor should even be in contention, when it comes to optimization. There is another role in this game that is purely designed entirely around that concept and you know which one it is.