[ENDWALKER SPOILER!] On Zenos

[KageTokage]

Given the weirdness of dynamis and aether in general, a vague wish can be made manifest in all the manner of different ways; Thancred's own wish managing to transform Ultima Thule into a perfectly habitable environment being a testament to that.

It does feel like something they'll likely just leave open to interpretation rather then spelled out plainly, though.

[Gemina]

I don't see that as proof the message came from Zenos. He's stranded on the end of the universe and probably didn't think to bring a radio tuned to alien frequencies.

In fact, the quest where that message is described to us indicates that it is Stigma-1's command to all of the Omicrons

I take it that the "powerful burst of energy" triggering the message was in fact Emet and Hyth flooding the zone with aether and allowing us to reclaim the Scions, which also seems to have affected other beings in the vicinity.

And Stigma-1 of course is the "leader" intelligence at least partly housed in M-017, who was spontaneously caring for the living tree and with whom G'raha had to reason to find our path forward.

It makes far more sense to me that the sending of the message was linked with unentangling the Scions – and perhaps the other beings – from the aether of the world once they were no longer required to hold it together. And certainly fitting with the earlier plot for M-017 to be sending that message.

Not only stranded; he's also very dead, having succumbed to his injuries. Was it his dying wish? Again, there is nothing to indicate that would be true, but also not out of the realm of possibility. I found this on reddit. It's pretty close to how I remember the interactions with the Scions after regaining control of our character after completing the MSQ. The dialogue is from Urianger in specific reference to this incident.

I understand that, following thy clash with Zenos, the teleportation device thou had discarded fell to thee from on high. To return to thee in such a manner... I did confer with Wilfsunn and Bloewyda, yet they insist the device was possessed of no such capability. 'Twas a miracle befitting the nature of that place, where emotion becometh tangible reality. Whence, then, arose this timely wonder? Thine ardent wish...or another's fervent prayer?

I think all we can accurately take from the matter is the will for the WoL to return to their friends and home was beyond anything measurable. Whose will that belongs to is anyone's guess. I feel those intangible forces are at play in this universe as much as it is ours. Hermes is another example of this. Nothing explains why Kairos not only did not truly reconfigure his memory, but also saw fit to ensure these memories would haunt his soul for all eternity; no matter how many times it would be reincarnated before facing oblivion.

[Platypusamus]

I know this is a bit older but thank you! You have put into words what I've been trying to explain to people about why I feel crestfallen at the end of EW.

[HappyHubris]

I'm still salty that I couldn't flip off Zenos and leave him stranded on the edge of space with no one to fight and no way to end his life. Not only did I have to put up with him getting shoved in our face, but the game forced me to indulge his desire with no narrative option to not consent.

And to do so after I beat the real end boss for no reason was immensely distasteful. If you couldn't find a place for Zenos in the narrative make him a mid-expansion boss and clear his piece off the board. Don't rob us of victory after conquering the End of Days by having us almost die to a cranky toddler.

[Iscah]

I'm still salty that I couldn't flip off Zenos and leave him stranded on the edge of space with no one to fight and no way to end his life. Not only did I have to put up with him getting shoved in our face, but the game forced me to indulge his desire with no narrative option to not consent.

And to do so after I beat the real end boss for no reason was immensely distasteful. If you couldn't find a place for Zenos in the narrative make him a mid-expansion boss and clear his piece off the board. Don't rob us of victory after conquering the End of Days by having us almost die to a cranky toddler.

All of this. The worst part is that it isn't even treated as a friendly sparring match but a fight to the death, with the WoL scripted to basically die and revive by pure determination twice.

My character should not be willing to risk everything here, just to indulge Zenos's whims, to the point of possibly not returning to the people she actually cares about.

---

Late edit: "Friendly" was perhaps not the right word. But... safe. Somewhere that the Scions know where I am and that I'm probably going to need some healing when it's all over.

[HappyHubris]

To expand a bit, the focus on building Zenos up and then doing absolutely nothing with the character also left Endwalker without a satisfying villain:
-Fandaniel offed himself four levels into the expansion.
-Zenos was AFK pouting for 99.9% of the time and had no narrative purpose.
-Meteion was more of a force of nature than a direct antagonist, and she didn't drive the events of the expansion. While I enjoyed her as a final boss, she was more of an obstacle than a villain. The final fight was like putting out a raging wildfire before it could burn down a continent, not a clash of sides.

[HappyHubris]

All of this. The worst part is that it isn't even treated as a friendly sparring match but a fight to the death, with the WoL scripted to basically die and revive by pure determination twice.

My character should not be willing to risk everything here, just to indulge Zenos's whims, to the point of possibly not returning to the people she actually cares about.

You raise a good point. The WoL is characterized as a warm friend of the Scions who wants nothing more to return to them after a well-fought victory. Instead we're goaded into almost throwing everything away to fight an angry townie at the bar.

[KageTokage]

Even if we decided to just ignore Zenos again, I felt it unlikely that he wouldn't have eventually pulled another destructive stunt to get our attention.

He was simply too dangerous and unpredictable to be left to his own devices.

[AziraSyuren]

There are really people out here who wanted let a monster who could bring ruin to most of the known cosmos with his power live just for the sake of a Twitter burn.

Wild.

[Rannie]

All of this. The worst part is that it isn't even treated as a friendly sparring match but a fight to the death, with the WoL scripted to basically die and revive by pure determination twice.

My character should not be willing to risk everything here, just to indulge Zenos's whims, to the point of possibly not returning to the people she actually cares about.

I just tend to see him as the annoying ex (great when you first get together then you break up) that you do your best to try and ignore until you had to say screw it and put a restraining order on them (kill him in Ultima Thule) just to be done with him...

Basically he did threaten the people we held dear all because he didn't want to get over us.