Some Sage Discussion

[nelothi]

Id like this thread to discuss Sage as a whole. Im unsure why the official forums dont have Job specific forums, and instead group all roles together into one big mess..
Regardless.. Here are my thoughts (Do note that I dont have a ton of experiance in FFXIV

At the time of this post, im level 83.
Im going to format my post as

•Ability - Thoughts
Suggestions


•Kardia - The healing potency of Kardia effects is far too low, I feel. And this iconic
ability
just doesnt feel like its a big part of the job, where i feel it should be.
I understand the worry that Kardia, if too powerful, would make Sage way too
good.

My suggestion to make Kardia feel better without increasing potency, Would be to allow
us to adjust the Kardia target while casting (if thats possible), but also take away the healing over time effect on Enhanced Kerachole, and instead make Enhanced Kerachole put Kardia on your party for 15 seconds.

This would give us a VERY different way to heal our party over time. effectively doing the same thing that Enhanced Kerachole did, but less passively. It would also force Kardia to have a bigger role with the job than it currently does.


•Icarus- This movement ability is very fun to use

Can we get two charges, please?

•Enhanced Kerachole - The ability is great as-is, but as seen above, I think it could be
changed.

Changing Enhanced Kerachole to give the party Kardia for 15 seconds instead of a HoT for 15 seconds could give Kardia a bigger role for our healing, and would round out our job identity/fantasy a bit better. As-is, Kardia doesnt do much.


• Dosis/Eukrasian Dosis/Phlegma/Toxicon - Lets just talk about our damage kit. It
works.. but it could be better, I think.

As the Job is right now, you keep up Eukrasian Dosis, don't let Phlegma cap on 2 charges, and don't let Toxicon over cap on charges (use the 3rd charge if you're about to get another charge).

im pretty sure this is normal for every healer, i hear memes about glair all the time..
but its not a particularly engaging dps rotation — but with how important dps is to healers in FFXIV, it would be nice to have a more involved dps rotation. Especially with a job like Sage where doing damage also triggers a heal.

being able to double weave Plegma and Toxicon with your Dosis casts would be really cool and could even offer a burst heal when Soteria is added in.

Ill keep updating this thread as I play more. Im unfortunately at work so I cant exactly think of everything at the moment...

over all, Sage is a lot of fun, I think the aesthetic of our weapons is great also. The variety of styles is fantastic, and I think it will only get better as time goes on.
(my current favorite is the Muskets)

My biggest complaint, as you can see, is that Kardia just is not impactful right now

[HyperiusUltima]

IMO Kardia feels fine where it is. It staves off autos just fine in single target, and you’re more likely to rely on Haima first for big pulls while you can Chuck your oGCD heals mid GCD.

[rewd]

Kardia is just fluff and is strong enough for what it is supposed to do. It's something that they needed to come up because Eos/Selene exist and any buff/change to Kardia would also trigger a change to Embrace and it would be more balancing than it would be worth.

As for DPS, we really don't need another thread asking for a better DPS rotation, as their stance on healer DPS is very clear. Every healer need something different, not just Sage.

[nelothi]

Kardia is just fluff and is strong enough for what it is supposed to do. It's something that they needed to come up because Eos/Selene exist and any buff/change to Kardia would also trigger a change to Embrace and it would be more balancing than it would be worth.

As for DPS, we really don't need another thread asking for a better DPS rotation, as their stance on healer DPS is very clear. Every healer need something different, not just Sage.

Your name is rather... fitting.

moving on.

[HyperiusUltima]

Your name is rather... fitting.

moving on.

I mean, they’re not wrong.

[LachleinStratos]

I don't have too much issue regarding Kardia, except I was hoping all Sage's dps to Kardion target did not just heal, but also provide a minor barrier.
For example, halved the current cure potency and apply minor barrier on the other half potency for Phlegma, Dyskrasia and Toxikon.

What I personally would like to see more is Eukrasia upgrades.
Eukrasia currently only upgrades Diagnosis (healing), Prognosis (healing) and Dosis (DoT). This is an awesome design and I believe it what makes Sage unique. This upgrade can be further explored to upgrade other abilities in the utility department. I believe SE will definitely introduce them in the next expansion. Here are my versions.

Phlegma upgraded to Eukrasian Phlegma
Eukrasian Phlegma spreads your primary target with Eukrasian Dosis to all nearby enemies and refreshing its timer.
You can do this every 45 seconds with 2 charges while you are in melee range which makes sense.

Icarus upgraded to Eukrasian Icarus
Rush to a target enemy's or party's location. Create a barrier to the target and everyone you passed through.
Barrier potency: 200
Very niche however you are able to rush to protect all party members you pass through by doing some positionals between yourself and the party into stacking phase

Holos upgraded to Eukrasian Holos
Cure potency: 150
Reduces damage taken by self and nearby party members by 20%
This version trades healing for a stronger party wide mitigation

Toxikon upgraded to Eukrasian Toxikon
Requires 3 Addersting to use Eukrasian Toxikon. Instant cast and cost no mana.
Create holograms Milpreves (4 floaties) to continously cast Toxikon three times on your target.
Instead of pressing Toxikon each time off GCD, this allow you to expand all at once in situations where you require dishing out continuous minor heals while you cast other spells.
At the moment there is no other reason to use Toxikon outside instant cast moving phase and it does not cost mana. This give us a better reason to stack 3 Addersting and reward us for this function.

[AnotherPerson]

Sage feels fairly good. The only things I would like for the current Sage?

Icarus getting a second charge. I'm used to all jobs having dashes on a 20-30 second cooldown and the 45 second dash messes me up a lot when I intend to dash, only to find out Icarus is not off cooldown yet.

Toxikon getting an Eukrasia-alternative. A Toxikon DoT on the main target and 50% AoE DoT on the rest. In this manner, you are rewarded for healing with Eukrasia Diagnosis, but with a decently long DoT duration, you're not going to get value on Eukrasia Toxikon if you consistently overwrite the DoT by spamming Eukrasia Diagnosis to get Toxikon stacks. Plus, it takes no extra hotbar space to replace Toxikon with Eukrasia Toxikon.

Dosis III and Toxikon II are both doing the same damage at lv 90. If Eukrasia Toxikon II's total DoT potency is slightly stronger than Dosis III or Toxikon II, then it gives sage a bit more DPS loss management without affecting anything too much. In the end, Toxikon II will still be used for the same purpose of minimizing GCD loss, but you just get one extra DoT alternative. Eukrasia Toxikon II doesn't change that since it would still be a loss to use Eukrasia Diagnosis to specifically generate a Toxikon stack instead of using 2 Dosis III, so Toxikon II will still be used for consistent heavy movement if Toxikon DoT is still ticking and you want to keep the GCD rolling. If anything, it would incentivize using your Eukrasia Toxikon DoT more smartly since your Toxikon stacks don't regenerate normally, so you would have to consider whether you want to apply the DoT in a buff window or save the stack if it can save a GCD for heavy movement phases.

[Gemina]

I have no issue with Kardia. However, I do with Soteria. Because Kardia just tacks on a little bit of healing onto damage, Soteria is like a fireman that shows up after the fire is put out. It's kind of like Rouse when SCH's had it. They are semi useful abilities, but not really worth the real-estate at this point in the game's lifespan.

We will get two charges of Icarus in the next expansion. That is a shoe-in for an added trait. I'm guessing the CD lining up with Phelgma is totally intentional, so I say 1 charge of Phelgma = 1 charge of Icarus

The Addersgall abilities are fine as they are. However, they don't really have a dump skill. I think they should remove Taurochole as an Addersgall spender and just make it an independent oGCD, and give them something else. It could just be their Energy Drain equivalent as I am not sure what else to give them. If they did this, they might have to get rid of Rhizomata, but I am ok with that.

When it comes to DPS, I am not sure what to tell peeps who are dissatisfied. They wanted more buttons, and they gave you more buttons. Of course, I knew and said that would not be enough. The goalposts will continue to move. That aside, my only gripe is Toxicon feels awkward to use as a GCD and just feels like we should be able to weave it. Some potency adjustments will also have to be made as some tier II skills actually lose potency on the falloff opposed to their tier one counterparts. That is no beuno. Want to know what is beuno though? Phelgma. Every bit as satisfying to use as Assize. I think it could use an extra effect though. Blind? Stun? I'm not sure.

Eukrasia is an interesting mechanic; reminiscent of Dark Arts for DKN. Even has that same odd CD it did that gives you the ability to put two non-oGCD skills into a single GCD window. I do like it, but I do not like what it is forcing me to do on my controller.

Because I play on controller, I place skills with cast times on the D-pad because I can't move my character and push those keys at the same time. IOW, I have to take my thumb of the analog stick to use the D-pad. Since Eukrasia turns those skills that have cast times into instant, I lose the luxury of being able to cast them on the move. I think I can work around this, but it is going to take an adjustment. One poster mentioned having the ability to toggle Eukrasia, and I mentioned that it wasn't really needed. I'll compromise a bit and going to do a bit of a Cleric Stance thing that gives it a 5s recast. This means if you turn it on, change your mind and turn it off, you can't turn it back on until the 5s expire.

Other than that there isn't anything I can think of as of right now, but my SGE is only 76 at the moment. Still, I am really surprised how good this job feels out of the gate. Some of these things I mentioned are not only suggestions, but predictions. With the exception of the dump skill. I would actually be really surprised if they did that this expansion.

[Vatom]

After getting Sage to 90 (just a note as to where Im at )

I personally don't care if they do change anything or not since over all it was a solid healer and I got through everything pretty well.

BUT! If I was to point at something that I would change.

Toxicon needs to me on a oGCD or just do more dmg, for something on a gauge and has to proc off a shield break I dont get why it has to be on a gcd. Granted its very easy to pop the shield but 900 mp cost for a GCD non cast dmg is pretty flat

Dyskrasia need to have a dot when augmented, honestly I think all healers should have this but I do feel like it would fit for SGE

I do like the idea of kardia going on the party maybe for future lvls seems a but too powerful for sage right now and I wouldn't have it on 100% of a run but instead on Soteria or share a cd with it with the same potency.

If i was to give any dmg spell a shield it would only be Phlegma having that on demand with any other spell would be busted or just pointless

I do wish the do something with pepsi and single target since most of the time my shield just evaporates on a main tank so pepsi usually isn't worth popping then

2 stacks of Icarus would be cool but not necessary and it dosen't need to give a shield to others you pass but if it did give you a shield by all means

I don't know if its just me or maybe anyone else feels this way but can we do something about pneuma, I mean I might just be greedy here but I really feel it should be more for a last ability. Maybe a regen or put the mit back on. I dont want to up the dmg so opts don't start saying you have to use it for dmg windows but I just feel like it dosen't have the umf feeling. Maybe just me but its a note maybe in the future.

[Gemina]

Snip

Out of these four, I think Phelgma would have the highest chance of being able to be augmented by Eukrasia. The reason I think that is because Holos is a 120 CD and has a dual function built in it already. Toxicon already has its own mechanic being dependent on GCD shields being broken; and Icarus is simply just a gap closer, and SGE is currently the only healer who has one. They can do some interesting things just with Phelgma though because right now it is just a button you press to keep from over capping so it has the most room.