So how is whm doing?

[Ilyrian]

AST is just... better in virtually every way.

I think there will come a point in the not too distant future that WHM will have to have some sort of buff system, similar to AST.
There's just no feasible future for WHM - unless - the damage goes through the roof which again, is pretty useless with the potential of Sage.

[Anirab]

It's remarkable how in their pursuit of accessibility, White Mage feels the most... incomplete. I almost get the impression they're afraid to expand beyond the tried and simple GCD healing paradigm they seem determined to force it into. I just can't wrap my head around how they could look at WHM and AST then conclude both are properly balanced. AST is just... better in virtually every way.

In what way is AST better? (i have all jobs on 80 but didn't check AST since EW)
WHM just plays as WHM does, don't feel a big difference with EW. Decent DPS and great healing. Just did Duty and got Amaurot and all went fine, nobody died, almost 20% of group damage.

[Silver-Strider]

In what way is AST better? (i have all jobs on 80 but didn't check AST since EW)
WHM just plays as WHM does, don't feel a big difference with EW. Decent DPS and great healing. Just did Duty and got Amaurot and all went fine, nobody died, almost 20% of group damage.

AST equivalent skills of WHM's cost less and have a shorter cast time, even after the cost reduction WHM received. Coupled with Astrodyne and the nerf to Thin Air, AST now has the superior MP economy of the 2.
Exaltation's cure potency makes it more potent in the majority of cases in comparison to Aqua Veil.
Earthly Star's radius buff encapsulates the entirety of most arenas, meaning it will be incredibly rare that it misses healing allies and cleaving enemies.
AST's extensive oGCD kit allows it to continue to DPS while WHM would need to expend GCDs on heals to accomplish the same thing but when coupled with its raid contributions of cards and Divination, allow AST to surpass WHM in terms of rDPS.
Lilybell is still too restrictive in its usage vs Macrocosmos

[Allegor]

It's remarkable how in their pursuit of accessibility, White Mage feels the most... incomplete. I almost get the impression they're afraid to expand beyond the tried and simple GCD healing paradigm they seem determined to force it into. I just can't wrap my head around how they could look at WHM and AST then conclude both are properly balanced. AST is just... better in virtually every way.

I'm starting to think they're not even "meant" to be balanced. Out of the 4 healers, WHM is the only one a brand new player can start with, so it's likely intentionally designed to be as idiot-proof as possible, and if anyone wants anything more ...exciting, well, there's any of the other 3 for that, specially since AST is just WHM, but better.

I'd say this is also true for tanks, to an extend, but even the simplest of tanks (yes, I'm looking at WAR) is still fairly complex next to WHM.

[Adeacia]

WHM feels like WHM. Having gotten to 85 the only real difference I've noticed are the fancy spell effects of Holy III and Glare III.

[lilwitch]

I'm really enjoying new whm. The extra benison shield stack and the 60s cd targeted mini cd nice for smoothing out dungeon runs. Even the bell comfy despite long cooldown. So even if I get stuck with a tank that has subpar cd usage but pulls large regardless, there's enough tools in the kit to keep dpsing and keep them alive. I like bell because although it is 3m cd, with the structure of [2 large pulls -> boss] (and sometimes a mini pull on top of that) it gives me free license to stand in aoe and heal the tank at the same time, for 1 pull per midboss.

Rn I tend to regen tank, maybe apply regen again right as we reach the last pack, swiftcast holy, lily aoe, bubble, PoM, then into holy spam, saving benison to pair with regen so the ogcd isn't wasted. Tank will be fine on 1st pack if he uses cds at all after holy stun wears off in ~9s, so it usually 2nd pack where it is questionable, so I'd save wings for 2nd pack, but now have an extra benison and a 15% for 8s from aquaveil. regen + bubble usually sustains 3 mobs okay, so just having this little bit extra for 6-9 mobs feels so smooth. But most of all because it's ogcd and so I can use it while dodging or without interrupting dps. When bubble cd down, now can use bell + purposefully eat aoe.

Mixed feeling on the new cast time. I find it more awkward bc now when I press button based on the skill cast, it doesn't queue since its too far from the cd time. It will take a while to get used to it, but I didn't enjoy ast for the same reason. That said, it also gives you space to cast and dodge better, without clipping. Even slidecast will clip a bit, so whm feels much more mobile now.

Thin air change nice for ressing ppl but less nice for spamming skills.

I don't think all skill should get star treatment. Star seems absurd, might as well be raidwide aoe without a reticule if so large.
I like that c3 is dense heal with limited radius, so it rewards placement. But maybe the potency needs tweaking? idk. It feels okay to me.
I like playing reactive healer and whm rly nice for that. Sage seems so confusing like the buttons needlessly spread out and cleric stance but not cleric stance, but whm nice straightforward healer.

[Liam_Harper]

I don't think all skill should get star treatment. Star seems absurd, might as well be raidwide aoe without a reticule if so large.
I like that c3 is dense heal with limited radius, so it rewards placement. But maybe the potency needs tweaking? idk. It feels okay to me.

Cure III requires placement, it doesn't really reward it. It's 400 less potency than Medica II and only just equal to a Plenary Rapture. The only place Cure III ever shone was rare mechanics with continuous high damage, such as Tumult or Terminal during prog. Now Lilybell does that job. There is almost no place for a 600 potency GCD with such limitations. 600 isn't even that great anymore.

While Star is absurd, I can see why they did it. The unfortunate reality is you have no control over whether players stand in Asylum or Cure III radius. Especially in content like Alliance raids, these abilities often just won't catch everyone and you'll be forced to GCD heal for the 3 people out in Narnia. The idea of a reward for placement sounds good, but the content doesn't allow for it outside of organized high end raids and trials.

There's also the obvious fact that giving one pure healer a massive radius on their ground placement heal and not the other, puts the first at a massive advantage. Why play WHM and try to get people to bunch up for your mana draining 600 potency GCD, when AST is detonating a free 720 potency nuclear heal-bomb that even deals damage instead of costing it.

[Ashua]

Cure III requires placement, it doesn't really reward it. It's 400 less potency than Medica II and only just equal to a Plenary Rapture. The only place Cure III ever shone was rare mechanics with continuous high damage, such as Tumult or Terminal during prog. Now Lilybell does that job. There is almost no place for a 600 potency GCD with such limitations. 600 isn't even that great anymore.

While Star is absurd, I can see why they did it. The unfortunate reality is you have no control over whether players stand in Asylum or Cure III radius. Especially in content like Alliance raids, these abilities often just won't catch everyone and you'll be forced to GCD heal for the 3 people out in Narnia. The idea of a reward for placement sounds good, but the content doesn't allow for it outside of organized high end raids and trials.

There's also the obvious fact that giving one pure healer a massive radius on their ground placement heal and not the other, puts the first at a massive advantage. Why play WHM and try to get people to bunch up for your mana draining 600 potency GCD, when AST is detonating a free 720 potency nuclear heal-bomb that even deals damage instead of costing it.

I would be all for a heal four that really hones in the fact the white mage is the defacto king of pure healing by providing a % based regen effect based on health that provides more healing as the target gets weaker. A supreme heal defining spell maybe. Cure 4 600 potency+regen 2.

[lilwitch]

It's 400 less potency than Medica II and only just equal to a Plenary Rapture. The only place Cure III ever shone was rare mechanics with continuous high damage, such as Tumult or Terminal during prog. Now Lilybell does that job. There is almost no place for a 600 potency GCD with such limitations. 600 isn't even that great anymore.

I think that rly lacking any hint of nuance. Sure, m2 does more over time, but that's the tradeoff of a HoT - more if you can afford to wait.
Liturgy on 3min cd. C3's the highest group heal that's spammable, and you can thin air at least one of them if necessary. Idk, it just feels comfy to me, and it's easy enough to precast for stacks. If ppl spread out, can plenary too yeah.

[RinaShinomiya]

I love WHM but is agree it's not the best it could be.
One thing that always bothered me about the 5.0 rework is how Cure II and Afflatus Solace and Medica and Afflatus Rapture are the exact same buttons but for some reason need to be separate buttons. Under no circumstances have i ever found myself wanting to cast Cure 2 over Afflatus Solace when i had a lily stack ready. So why not turn these buttons into 1 via trait and use the extra room we freed up for things missing from WHM toolkit?