Black Mage - the solution for everything?

[DeadRiser]

No argument there.

It's funny, when someone is shouting for Ifrit parties just for BLM/THM, I go as that. Then enter the content as melee job. Majority of the time, I can out dps the mages. MNK is sooo much fun on Ifrit. I was red most of the time!

They should get rid of the class or limit ONE per party xD hahhaa jk but that's how I feel about it.

[Ruri]

It's funny, when someone is shouting for Ifrit parties just for BLM/THM, I go as that. Then enter the content as melee job. Majority of the time, I can out dps the mages. MNK is sooo much fun on Ifrit. I was red most of the time!

They should get rid of the class or limit ONE per party xD hahhaa jk but that's how I feel about it.

For Ifrit/Moogle I can out DPS weak mages on Drg/Brd/Mnk. Like I said before it's all about how you play the classes.

[DeadRiser]

For Ifrit/Moogle I can out DPS weak mages on Drg/Brd/Mnk. Like I said before it's all about how you play the classes.

But the community won't let you play that way. You either choose the classes/jobs they want or you find someone else.

And Square Enix needs to punish ranged classes as much as they punish melees. Coincounter sort of did this. With the slugs using silence and Coincounter using Eye of the Beholder. I've seen SOOOOO many BLM and BRD die to that move, and EVERYTIME I laugh lol.

[Delsus]

Its not BLM's damage thats the problem, its because most NMs and raid bosses have powerful AoEs (ifrit's sear, coincounter's 100 tonze, Garuda has one, cerb, etc etc) and people don't like healing melee, a well geared MNK can easily out DPS a BLM, but they get hit by AoEs, and a good DRG can almost match MNK, and about equal or a little better than BLM.

The thing is BLM is safe from the AoEs and WHMs don't like healing melee DDs, they see it as a waste of MP, remember before jobs? all DDs NEED sentinal, Cure, Second wind or gtfo, if they nerfed BLM, or added bosses with high magic resistance people would just say BRD ONRY!!! the only reason, because it is out of AoE range no other reason.

I remember first DHs, "you guys want a LNC?" "ARC ONRY, LNC will get raped by AoEs" "then CON can heal me" "thier job is to keep the tank alive, not DDs"

Yes that actually happened for over 1 month.

[Kinseykinz]

Its not BLM's damage thats the problem, its because most NMs and raid bosses have powerful AoEs (ifrit's sear, coincounter's 100 tonze, Garuda has one, cerb, etc etc) and people don't like healing melee, a well geared MNK can easily out DPS a BLM, but they get hit by AoEs, and a good DRG can almost match MNK, and about equal or a little better than BLM.

The thing is BLM is safe from the AoEs and WHMs don't like healing melee DDs, they see it as a waste of MP, remember before jobs? all DDs NEED sentinal, Cure, Second wind or gtfo, if they nerfed BLM, or added bosses with high magic resistance people would just say BRD ONRY!!! the only reason, because it is out of AoE range no other reason.

I remember first DHs, "you guys want a LNC?" "ARC ONRY, LNC will get raped by AoEs" "then CON can heal me" "thier job is to keep the tank alive, not DDs"

Yes that actually happened for over 1 month.

The classes/jobs that are typically sought have nothing to do with Healers not wanting to work/heal others...that's like saying that blm's don't like seeing their spells hit for the highest damage. Healers WANT to heal everyone at all times...it's a sick addiction they have.

1. The reason that Conjurers focused on the tank and ONLY the tank for DH and Ifrit is because we were using the new spells and their costs but the old mana pool. And back in Darkhold days, CNJ didn't even have abilities like Blissful Mind or Shroud of Saints to work with. Also, THM was still the only way to get 85%+ of the debuffs on mobs. So yes, because your average DD couldn't avoid getting seriously injured and/or caused the Ogre to elbow drop, Conjurers, Tanks and Parties went with the safer ranged DD attacks THM's and ARC could provide.

2. Ifrit. Again, we had the same piss-poor mana pool. But if you remember Archer was Not the king of this battle due to animation lock. And THM well, again low HP's made them a liability but one was always nice for the DOT. Also, the 'safe spots' for Ifrit even to this day are not 'optimal' for a WHM, let alone a CNJ to keep the entire party fully buffed, healed and the tank topped off easily. Back in the day it was even more problematic as the MP pool was still low considering the abilities we had/spell cost of the time. Also, the range, circular nature of CNJ/WHM buffs makes it hard to buff the entire party in one shot. (DD's could help by running to tank at key points in the battle but do you know how many time's I've done Iffy and NOT seen a single DD gather on the tank for buffs...esp after Hellfire?)

Cutters, Moogles and Veil: All are DD friendly, if not the whole battle, at least specific parts.

3. People don't typically do the Moogle Battle with 4BLM's simply because BLM's will run out of MP WAY before they could ever burn down every moogle. (which btw is the REAL way to get rid of the stacking of BRD/BLM, make it a battle that lasts longer than BLM's mana pool and something that bard just can't do enough damage to=we <3 Monk,WAR,LNC,PLD)

4.Cutters can be WAR or BLM burned on princess...and parties came up with this strategy not because the WHM's didn't want to heal DD's but because again, your average pick-up dd doesn't know how to quickly target the one mob he should be hitting when it's buried in a pile of 20. BLM's and War's are able to AOE like mad (so they can't target either but at least they have the aoe damage to compensate for it). However, technically Monks who know how to target would be way better on the Princess. Monks and Lancers can do awesome on chimera, but again it is on them (not the healer) to know where to stand to avoid traps and aoe damage. But Chimera has ranged attacks and close up attacks. The fact that mages are used more than DD's has more to do with the close up DD's not knowing how to avoid moves and traps and/or a tank that turn Chimmy wrong forcing the close-range DD to eat an aoe/trap. (And yes, the WHM's again may or may not heal anyone other than the tank in this fight depending on how much hate the tank has at the time... this fight is hard on WHM's because depending on how trigger happy your DD's were/how well tank dodged in beginning WHM's are riding the hate threshold the whole fight.)

5. Veil is actually pretty forgiving as to the set-up you use. The main reason for BLM/MNK burn in Veil is because both classes tend to be more efficient, meaning faster clears than othersetups. But any setup that has at least 1 tank and 1-2 healers would work in there.

6. Garuda...yes, atm She's a BLM burn. But most of this is for 2 reasons. One: speed, you can kill her in under 5 mins this way meaning every 20ish minutes you can be working towards sexy weapons. Two: DD's have yet to figure out how to avoid her massive damage aoe's and still match the DPS of the BLM's/BRD's. The hotfix might address this as far as BLM being able to out DPS the melee but that remains to be seen.

[DeadRiser]

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All this is true. I like Aurum Vale the best just because the party setup you use doesn't matter. What is also killing this is the time attacks as well. but that's a different story.

Sorry Chardrizard if you're seeing this, was just a misunderstanding.

[Nabiri]

WHMs don't like healing melee DDs, they see it as a waste of MP

Really? O.o That's an odd mentality for a healer. I've never heard of a WHM who didn't like (or even possibly refused??) to heal party members. But I come from FFXI...
I like healing people on WHM. o.o; Tank = #1 priority in a battle, and if anyone else is getting low they get healed next.

Just sounds like bad WHMs to me. :x
As if they only exist to heal the tank and just say "screw you" to everyone else. XD

[Chardrizard]

Really? O.o That's an odd mentality for a healer. I've never heard of a WHM who didn't like (or even possibly refused??) to heal party members. But I come from FFXI...
I like healing people on WHM. o.o; Tank = #1 priority in a battle, and if anyone else is getting low they get healed next.

Just sounds like bad WHMs to me. :x
As if they only exist to heal the tank and just say "screw you" to everyone else. XD

I wouldn't quote him on that, he doesn't play WHM. Although, it does hold truth to some degree. I wouldnt bother healing anyone that constantly takes damages from avoidable moves (Eruptions/Plumes/Pom Flares/Shrieks).

[Nabiri]

I wouldn't quote him on that, he doesn't play WHM. Although, it does hold truth to some degree. I wouldnt bother healing anyone that constantly takes damages from avoidable moves (Eruptions/Plumes/Pom Flares/Shrieks).

Just sounds weird to me. I heal anyone who needs healing. I don't sit there and hoard my MP.
As a healer I try my best to keep the whole party alive. If I fail I fail, but I always try my best.

Anyways, on topic..
I don't like the whole stacking jobs thing because it becomes hard to get a group on my job of choice.
I'm not going to go level a new job that's the current favourite for the newest battle, just to get in.
I think SE said they're already looking into balancing things though. Hopefully things improve.

Edit: It's actually not just people being left out for not having the favoured job that bothers me, but.. even as a BLM I don't want to join a full party of BLMs.. I don't want stuff handed to me. I want a challenge.

[Firon]

Just sounds weird to me. I heal anyone who needs healing. I don't sit there and hoard my MP.
As a healer I try my best to keep the whole party alive. If I fail I fail, but I always try my best.

Anyways, on topic..
I don't like the whole stacking jobs thing because it becomes hard to get a group on my job of choice.
I'm not going to go level a new job that's the current favourite for the newest battle, just to get in.
I think SE said they're already looking into balancing things though. Hopefully things improve.

Edit: It's actually not just people being left out for not having the favoured job that bothers me, but.. even as a BLM I don't want to join a full party of BLMs.. I don't want stuff handed to me. I want a challenge.

Aye its true tho a lot of whm's are stuck in the days of, Don't you have cnj 50? equip cure 3 and cure your self!!!

Also While i don't like the content i think they should force locked jobs in raids like they do in Hamlet defense. I also think a reason behind all the stacking is the constant flow of 8 man content i think once we have more content with like 16 ppl this will change.