New summoner is unacceptable

[Riusvell]

Or I dunno just play another game. The entire player base isn't chasing 100s.

Log in perform average collect your loot come back when you have more to do. Seems pretty straightforward and something even Yoshi said was perfectly fine.

There's a ton of straightforward jobs. The entire prang is basically ez pz. Rdm and Blm are pretty chill now. Reaper is pretty chill. Pretty much all the tanks are chillaxation.

Summoner was basically an outliers with it being overly complex. New summoner is about on par with all the other others now. You might argue a few complex jobs are still out but those appear to be getting tuned down over time.

Wow, every raider surely only logs in to the game just raid. Totally!

Grow up, please. Just because players do the Savage content and Ultimates, doesn't mean they don't do other content as well.
It's only a select portion of the raiders that do the raid logging thing.

It sure is lovely that the one magical class that appealed to me is now a hollow, unfinished mess that it is right now with false promises of being fixed.
"Go play something else", sure. Like what? Oh wait, I just said that this the only magical class that appealed to me! Aethestetically and gameplaywise. Ranged? No thanks. Healers? Nah, boring. Tanks? Only Dark Knight, but I miss being a magical damage dealer.
Melee? Nope, not for me either.

There was only one class I legitimately enjoyed the battle content from and now thanks to this "rework" which I do not even wish to call a rework because it simply isn't complete, there's nothing left.

Another thing, a level 80 class shouldn't be feeling like 60.

[Nighthawky2010]

Even though RDM is my main, I have played SMN since 2.0.

After leveling SMN to 90 & using it considerably in the 90 dungeons...i don't know...it's just MEH to me. This is just my opinion.

I miss shadowflare. I miss the DOTs. Fester means nothing to me without the DOTs. I would have settled for the for Ifrit, Garuda, Titan slapped on a DOT when they are first summoned

I think the stat squish didn't help any. Bahamut/Phoenix DPS seems a little weak.

Don't get me wrong, I love the aesthetics & I enjoyed leveling the job to see the changes but the job doesn't pop for me like it did in ShB.

I keep forgetting that I have a Ruin 3 or 4, barely use it.

I guess i miss the busyness of the ShB SMN. Just my opinion.

[Tanis_Ebonhart]

Okay. I doubt you'll be missed.

[Laphicet]

Guess I'll just copy-paste my remarks from a discord discussion into here now that I've actually gotten my hands on SMN. Ignore the fc banter in the screenshots, I guess.
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This feels like it should be a tank class
or what a healer DPS kit SHOULD be, certainly not a kit for a DPS.
nothing compared to old summoner.
and it's just as empty feeling as MCH is, if not worse
radiant aegis is also very useless due to low duration combined with usable with carby only. (should just make it 60s duration since it'll be difficult if not occasionally impossible to time this to be useful with raidwides)
the class also does not change from 80 to 90, so this is how it's gonna play at level cap
for those who don't believe me

the only 80-90 stuff is traits, and none of them actually change things, only up potency and toss in some pretty FX.

Take away the FX and this job is very shallow.
HOWEVER, at least it's not lore-destroying changes like all the healer ones have been for two expansions.

and before anyone goes "but they're going to build off it"

ShB MCH and healers since SB prove that wrong, right there. as well as general dealings with other classes. things are not built off of in this game when it comes to these simplification reworks, what you see is what you get and what you're going to be stuck with unless JP raises hell or the devs change their ways, and I can tell you right now the latter is never going to come to pass.
TL;DR, I am both angry and dissapointed. And what happened to me with SB AST has happened again with ShB SMN, where my favorite class that I only got really into near the end of the expac was gutted going into the next one.
Also, it's button bloated, and noticeably at that, you could compact the summon trio down to one button that goes ifrit>titan>garuda, Energy Drain+Siphon could be turned into a trait that adds fall off AOE, same for Fester/painflare, and you could merge searing light with the level 2 shield and it wouldn't change a thing. Ruin IV also might as well not exist with how little you get to use it OR be a temp upgrade to Ruin 3. Astral Flow, too could just not exist as a separate button and be merged with the summon skill that it effects. The Gemshines could also be merged with your ST and AOE filler, too.

Take those out, replace them with OGCD heals, and you'd have a good healer, lol.
It also feels like shit because they got rid of the back-n-forth combo thing that added more variety to things. It's now just 1spam the class or 3spam the class. The ONLY, and I mean the ONLY saving grace that'll probably keep people form bitching too hard is the pretty FX, but like I said, what's left when you take those away... something pretty shit if you ask me.
And you're going to hear me bitching for two years about this only for them to fix nothing, so you better get used to it now.
because god knows they didn't pay attention to healer concerns and that was an ENTIRE role, a single class' concerns are certainly going to be ignored comparatively
Also, all the clowns who told me they were going to build off of ShB healers and make them more interesting, especially on the DPS side. They owe me sub time cards. Since the proof is in-game now that such was a lie.
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I could organize it for more clairty but I think it's fine like this.

[Vivix]

I liked SMN exactly how it was before. They could have changed it's named and invented an entirely new job with this rework. I don't care if people didn't like dots or felt like the rotation was janky. They didn't need to like the job as long as someone else did. What's the point in claiming to design an mmo that has something for everyone then reworking the job as soon as it develops a niche audience. Just look at the removal of monk positionals.

[aveyond-dreams]

I liked SMN exactly how it was before. They could have changed it's named and invented an entirely new job with this rework. I don't care if people didn't like dots or felt like the rotation was janky. They didn't need to like the job as long as someone else did. What's the point in claiming to design an mmo that has something for everyone then reworking the job as soon as it develops a niche audience. Just look at the removal of monk positionals.

Because Summoner is too iconic of a job to have it reduced to a niche audience who likes dots. They should have given dot-enjoyers Necromancer or something instead of co-opting Summoner and twisting it into a failed version of Affliction Warlock.

[Riusvell]

Because Summoner is too iconic of a job to have it reduced to a niche audience who likes dots. They should have given dot-enjoyers Necromancer or something instead of co-opting Summoner and twisting it into a failed version of Affliction Warlock.

No thanks, I wouldn't be able to touch that job without a 10-foot pole at the minimum because it makes me *very* sick.

Imho, Summoner feels even less of a Summoner now because the summons don't even impact your stuff anymore.

[Vivix]

Because Summoner is too iconic of a job to have it reduced to a niche audience who likes dots. They should have given dot-enjoyers Necromancer or something instead of co-opting Summoner and twisting it into a failed version of Affliction Warlock.

Summoner had summons that you could control and even decide when to use which one. That could have been fleshed out more. BLM has dots so does that make it a warlock or necromancer? Are healers? No. Using elements that do damage over time could easily have been expanded (fire?) and doesn't necessitate necromancy. Last I checked in most FF games summoners did a whole lot more than just summon. If it is due to popularity however I guess hrothgar should be completely reworked because they aren't popular enough? No obviously not.

[MagiusNecros]

Energy Drain/Fester/Painflare seem archaic to me. Fester and Pain I can work with but Ruin 4 just seems out of place. And the CD for it is too long. Once the novelty goes away you'll see it for how barebones and shallow it actually is.

And as stated previously you will run into MP problems making Lucid mandatory. Because a full rotation is going to cost you half your mana the ability to raise is going to be drastically reduced.

The damage shield overall is a nerf in both percentage and availability. Previous shield was 30% HP and on a 30s recast with 2 charges.

Devotion is twice as long so that's alright I guess.

An issue I have with Bahamut and Phoenix is you must use Bahamut and then Phoenix. You have no choice and you'll want Bahamut for big burst damage. And Phoenix for heals. It is VERY restrictive. Bahamut and Phoenix should be different buttons IMO.

[SnowVix]

And as stated previously you will run into MP problems making Lucid mandatory.

gonna be honest, it doesn't seem like it's MP negative with Lucid factored in, so i don't see the issue. Just because you're used to spending 3 MP over the whole fight doesn't mean that was the plan.