Does FF14 have a button bloat problem?

[Kolsykol]

No.
Imo it's about perfect now, I can't think of any dps that feels bloated.
Unless your definition of bloat is '' it doesn't 99999999% NEED to be separate buttons ''.

Personally I much more enjoy pressing more buttons than just spamming 1 and sometimes 2 and 3 like more or less in WoW ( I am exaggerating, but basically. Lots of spamming the same button. ).
I dunno why some people are always so obsessed with doing as little as possible and pushing as few buttons as possible.
I get it if we're talking about positional with BLM for example and doing as little movement as possible but that's different.
But I don't really get it when people want it to basically be a button masher.

Like turning our basic combo into the button mashing in PvP, I just don't get it.
It sounds so boring to me and not involved at all.

Turning the Gnashing Fang combo into one button for GNB I can kinda understand because it's essentially just one ability split into three, but I still kinda feel a bit meh about it because it makes the rotation feel less varied.
I want my fingers to feel active not like I am just hammering the same three buttons.
And on MNK I'd say it's the opposite problem where it feels too repetitive and like there's not enough buttons.

[Liam_Harper]

Yes. It's not that we have too many buttons exactly, but there's a lot of filler and low-impact abilities that add 1-2% dps and are just there for the sake of pressing buttons.

I wasn't really too impressed with class design for Endwalker tbh. There are a handful of good QoL changes and a few nice abilities, but overall the classes will play the same. Most of the new abilities are traits that are basically normal class balance or system tweaks disguised as a new ability, filler oGCD's that are bland potency, aoe or single target versions of existing oGCD's that don't really change much and blatant copies of abilities from other classes.

I can understand why they do it, it's "safe", it's easy to balance. I like that they don't pull a WoW and try to reinvent the wheel every expansion. But it's too safe and hard to get really hyped for it.

[DPZ2]

I can understand why they do it, it's "safe", it's easy to balance. I like that they don't pull a WoW and try to reinvent the wheel every expansion. But it's too safe and hard to get really hyped for it.

It's comfortable. It means that there aren't going to be weeks or months spent trying to acclimate to changes in how the job you've been playing in the same way for almost 2 years now works on November 25th.

It's how most MMOs work, a tried and true formula. Class design is never radical.

It only worked in WoW (sometimes) because players could try new things in the PTR and write up the next Definitive Guide to Playing X months before the expansion comes out.

[Juun]

FF14 has a kind of button bloat problem but the jobs have IMHO still too few abilities. The problem is, too many abilities are basically the same. As a tank you have a mitigation buff that reduces the incoming damage by 10% and you have another mitigation buff that reduces it by 30% but with a different CD and different duration etc. Those duplicated abilities bloat up the buttons in the UI.

Cheers

This I feel like combo buttons should take over the PvP aspect where it continues all on one button. I dont need 7 buttons just to press 1 to 7 in a row which all do virtually the same aside from looks and it having a combo bonus.

[Dogempire]

Yes. It's not that we have too many buttons exactly, but there's a lot of filler and low-impact abilities that add 1-2% dps and are just there for the sake of pressing buttons.

I wasn't really too impressed with class design for Endwalker tbh. There are a handful of good QoL changes and a few nice abilities, but overall the classes will play the same. Most of the new abilities are traits that are basically normal class balance or system tweaks disguised as a new ability, filler oGCD's that are bland potency, aoe or single target versions of existing oGCD's that don't really change much and blatant copies of abilities from other classes.

I can understand why they do it, it's "safe", it's easy to balance. I like that they don't pull a WoW and try to reinvent the wheel every expansion. But it's too safe and hard to get really hyped for it.

I really wish they would condense the 123 buttons that don't actually have any branching options, something like monk's combos you can't condense into a single button, but with GNB's continuation or MCH's 123 combos I don't see a point to keeping it 3 buttons when literally nothing about the class would change except a few hotbar slots are freed

[Shurrikhan]

I really wish they would condense the 123 buttons that don't actually have any branching options, something like monk's combos you can't condense into a single button, but with GNB's continuation or MCH's 123 combos I don't see a point to keeping it 3 buttons when literally nothing about the class would change except a few hotbar slots are freed

I'd rather just have an equally-numbered (and multiple) choices across each GCD and use that as the basis for consolidation, rather than at best only 1 GCD per combo having actual choice (and only at most 3 choices), but if they actually put the buttons to use on something that isn't similarly bloated, I wouldn't hate further PvP-style combo consolidation.

[Shurrikhan]

Turning the Gnashing Fang combo into one button for GNB I can kinda understand because it's essentially just one ability split into three, but I still kinda feel a bit meh about it because it makes the rotation feel less varied.

I mean, you're free to hit a different button each GCD to progress the exact same unfailable decision (or just roll your fingers across the three relevant keys so that the first applicable one is queued, since the non-options among the GF combo can't even be hit), but it doesn't make the rotation itself any more or less varied. It's just needlessly button-inefficient. Nothing less. Nothing more.

[Theodric]

To a degree.

I think there's a lot of buttons that could be combined into a single button in order to free up room for other, more meaningful abilities. Much like how combo attacks work in PvP.

[Lauront]

I play with an MMO mouse (around 15 buttons) plus a keyboard and on some jobs, even that is a tight fit.

[Esmoire]

For context: I play on PC. Mouse and keyboard, with a MMO mouse with 19 buttons. I main WAR, secondary MNK, but have played all the jobs through cap.

I think there are too many. My biggest culprit are actions like Sonic Break. When I have a CD that's a minute long, I welcome something that feels really awesome for the job, flashy, and alters the flow. GNB... already has a lot of stuff happening every minute that you have to use at the same time because of No Mercy; keep in mind the same job already has another DoT every minute in Bow Shock.

Self-buffs like Inner Release are fine for me because they offer a momentary change in gameplay. Stuff like Riddle of Fire, on the other hand, happen when several other self buffs are already happening. MNK has so many self-buff oGCDs that roll up at the same time. I think, especially with losing two positionals, all of the Riddle of Xs can go away and adding a third one is a mistake. Brotherhood is satisfactory, standing as a neat group buff with a self-buff mechanic.

Lastly, and the ones I can forgive the least, are jobs that get minute CDs that share a CD with an AOE version. Those buttons have a usage, from a design standpoint it's not really worth it. Just make a ST version that has AOE splash. Don't take up two buttons for something we only hit once a minute.