"Swift completion" is relative to the game, not the community

[Avidria]

I've seen the massive first pull to the boss in Mt Gulg be done in a PUG situation where the tank was lv 79 while the rest of us were 80. We wiped three times but we still did it, because that absolute unit of a tank kept going and never gave up on that pull. We all believed in that pull, we all achieved that pull and let me tell you it felt absolutely amazing.

Try to have some faith in your parties instead of worrying so much about the dungeon halting, live a little!

Not to be cynical, but if I'm in a pug group I'm not there for a challenge or to have to dedicate a bunch of effort and faith into pressing through something there's absolutely no need to press through. I'd rather split the pull in half than waste a bunch of time dying and running back unnecessarily.

Like, dying isn't a big deal in this game, but that certainly doesn't make it fun. Maybe I'm just negatively conditioned from other games I've played or something lmao. I still cringe thinking about when you needed to run back for WoW dungeons, which sometimes involved running across literally the entire zone or trekking through an actual maze of a cave. Now dying and running back is just irritating to me in general lmao

If the group can handle wall to wall, great, go nuts. But if they clearly can't, I'm not interested in waiting for them to figure out how. The group as a whole sets the pace, imo, and if you want a consistent one then you've gotta go with friends. The only consistent thing about pug groups is that they are not at all consistent.

if the rest of the party wasn't okay with attempting another big pull, they probably would've said something

Or they're like me and just wanted to get through it and be done, and were one wipe away from straight up just leaving the group. Or they did say something, and got ignored, which I've also seen happen.

I've gotten to the point where I expect pug groups to be average to mediocre at best, and keep my expectations low, so I can put up with a lot of godawful play. Commenting, in my experience, isn't always worth it and doesn't always help, and I just generally don't care enough to speak up anymore unless things get absolutely ridiculous levels of bad. Doesn't mean the run was "good" though : p

[Xaruko_Nexume]

The devs have also said that trusts are intentionally made slower than df runs so they don't become the preferred way to do dungeons by the majority.

So they intentionally slowed down the trusts, they do less damage and don't aoe

You mean after I hit shb I don't have to run rouletts with players anymore? Can I do this with pre-shb content? Be still my heart...

[Kaoru_Nagisa]

You mean after I hit shb I don't have to run rouletts with players anymore? Can I do this with pre-shb content? Be still my heart...

Yes and no. You have to unlock Squadrons, which shows up after you hit Second Lieutenant in your GC (I think), so you have to do some seal grinding and a few GC quests which lead you through a couple of side dungeons like Dzemael Darkhold and Aurum Vale.

Once you have them, you have to grind them a bit via normal missions in order to unlock Command missions, which allow you to take your gaggle of AI squadron buddies into select dungeons directly. And even then, they only go up to around level 60 dungeons iirc.

So there's a gap between 60 and 71 (where you unlock your first ShB dungeon with Trusts) where you have to either do regular dungeons, Fate grind, or do the Stormblood Palace of the Dead equivalent, Heaven-on-High. Which I believe unlocks once you get through the story around that little fishing village in the Ruby Sea, iirc.

[Xaruko_Nexume]

OP are you on Crystal? I would be honored for you to tank a dungeon for me and heal you. I am tired of dong content like it is a Japanese Super Mario Bros. level where I might run out of time and die.

[ForteNightshade]

I have healed in FC runs he has tanked, he was competent but cautious. It was his first run of Ghimlyt Dark, and he wished to pull more slowly while he got a feel for the dungeon. A considerate person would have encouraged him to pull a little more, and then a little more than that, and tried to help him build confidence. Had it not been his first run, he would not have felt so tentative. As it was he was insulted and told to quit playing, which he did. This does not make me proud to be a member of this community. In fact whatever it is in the duty roulette, it's definitely not a community. More of an 'eat or get eaten' jungle

I'm going to be a little blunt. If this FC tank of yours is that afraid, then he shouldn't be tanking in DF. It's completely unreasonable to expect three random strangers to go at a snail's pace in a 70 dungeon because a tank is this anxious. I get that he was new to the dungeon but if we're being honest here, they're all hallway simulators. When you've done one, you've done them all. Players aren't toxic for wanting a faster run, especially in old content.

[Aiscence]

As nightshade said above me, do one dungeon post 50 and you've done them all, worse case you pull 2 groups and then you see.
And I don't understand how tanks feel like their job is difficult or pulling more is anything different than pulling one, let me describe both gameplay:
1 pack: Run to the pack -> press a CD or two and aoe -> keep a cd rolling
2 packs: Run to the pack -> aoe -> go to the next one -> press a CD and aoe -> keep defensive cd rolling.
And as unbelievable as it looks, 3 packs is the same! Nothing you do as a tank outside of pressing a cooldown actually affects anything.

Then yeah, your healers and dps must actually press buttons and learn what they do, elementary knowledge is hard, like prime numbers as we see in ridorana.

If you were seeing someone doing a 100M sprint by walking instead of running because "it's more comfortable", you'd wonder what kind of clown it is and that it's not for them. Here, we have the same case: the game is made for multipulls but you just do single target pull because you don't want to put any effort and then you complain when people say something about it with a "they are toxic".

You won't learn unless you actually do it, same for healers, and if you fail, it means you need to learn because you are not up to par and not cower and only go for single pull because "it's scary someone died in a videogame and we lost 60 sec", which is still less than doing single target pulls. You learnt million of things in your life, that's just another one, you don't have to put less effort in it because it's an "online game", that's just selfish for the others.

[Omedon]

if I'm in a pug group I'm not there for a challenge or to have to dedicate a bunch of effort and faith into pressing through something there's absolutely no need to press through. I'd rather split the pull in half than waste a bunch of time dying and running back unnecessarily.

Like, dying isn't a big deal in this game, but that certainly doesn't make it fun.

DINGDINGDING We have a winner! I should have included this in the OP, but yes, so very much this!

I do not play with strangers to be challenged. I establish for myself a set of parameters that pretty much guarantees success and renders the experience "idiot proof" (not to call y'all idiots, it's an established turn of phrase) in case of new players or those less comfortable with the pressure role of healing. I err on the side of "take'er easy," because I know that will end in success, and because, to be quite frank, every healer-player I've ever known personally has greatly appreciated and trusted in my care for their stress levels.

And, once again... I am still getting "swift completion" credit and therefore objectively going "fast enough." So for those healers that do crack the whip... no, this works. And the whip-cracking healer might be overconfident and still wipe us.

[Rokke]

This was the first xpac I got every job to cap for the amaro and learned tanks are just dps tha can survive getting punched longer. What is it about tanking that scares everyone? Does running slightly ahead of the others really tie your stomach in knots?

[DeaconMoore]

DINGDINGDING We have a winner! I should have included this in the OP, but yes, so very much this!

I do not play with strangers to be challenged. I establish for myself a set of parameters that pretty much guarantees success and renders the experience "idiot proof" (not to call y'all idiots, it's an established turn of phrase) in case of new players or those less comfortable with the pressure role of healing. I err on the side of "take'er easy," because I know that will end in success, and because, to be quite frank, every healer-player I've ever known personally has greatly appreciated and trusted in my care for their stress levels.

And, once again... I am still getting "swift completion" credit and therefore objectively going "fast enough."

OR you could just ask a simple 2 word question "Pull big?" And see what others want to do. You are one of four, not THE one.

Not that you should really need to ask, as such an experienced and competent tank, simply pulling the first two packs and seeing how well the group performs should tell you all you need to know about the pace you can keep.

[Omedon]

OR you could just ask a simple 2 word question "Pull big?" And see what others want to do. You are one of four, not THE one.

Not that you should really need to ask, as such an experienced and competent tank, simply pulling the first two packs and seeing how well the group performs should tell you all you need to know about the pace you can keep.

My fault for editing this in while you were responding, so I’ll repeat it here:

So for those healers that do crack the whip... no, this works. And the whip-cracking healer might be overconfident and still wipe us.