New Summoner looks really nice, but...

[Rolder50]

I found this new Larryzaur video (from earlier today) on the subject to be rather illuminating and valuable.

I encourage those with reservations for the rework to give it a watch. It's not even 8 minutes long.

https://youtu.be/-uk-4VaET6A

I find it tough to take the biggest summoner fanboy seriously on a matter like this.

[ChazNatlo]

I find it tough to take the biggest summoner fanboy seriously on a matter like this.

I mean, aren't people who hate the new changes also big summoner fans? They're upset because they're having their beloved job taken away?

Edit: Regarding my personal feelings on the class, I appreciate that looking at it, there is a resonance in the class as it move up in levels. The playstyle stays largely the same, with some mechanical twists and flourishes added in, as opposed to the entire job changing it's identity every ten levels.

[Rolder50]

I find it tough to take the biggest summoner fanboy seriously on a matter like this.

I double checked through the video and it definitely feels like he's choosing very arbitrary cutoffs for what counts for how many buttons you need to press. Like when he's describing how many buttons you need to hit "5 or more times per minute" and says only ruin 3 on existing summoner, but that excludes Egi Assaults and Ruin 4. Or how he doesn't seem to count the DoT skills as actions at all. It all feels very suspicious.

[Rika007]

I double checked through the video and it definitely feels like he's choosing very arbitrary cutoffs for what counts for how many buttons you need to press. Like when he's describing how many buttons you need to hit "5 or more times per minute" and says only ruin 3 on existing summoner, but that excludes Egi Assaults and Ruin 4. Or how he doesn't seem to count the DoT skills as actions at all. It all feels very suspicious.

There is nothing suspicious about it. You don't use those skills at all more then 5 times per minute, at most you're using them 4 if you are playing the job right. You should only need to hard cast your DoTs very rarely, mostly relying on Tri-Disaster resets. Nothing about his video is inaccurate and he's approaching it from not only a raw numbers high level standpoint, but also a overall 'class feel' standpoint.

Also 'biggest summoner fanboy' is being more then a little disingenuous. Yes the dude loves Summoner. He loves the game in general. He's beaten multiple ultimate fights and on more then just Summoner. He plays all casters and Samurai to a very high level that more then probably 99% of the players in this game don't play at. Honestly he's one of the few influencers who I would have trusted to give a proper view, as most of them are more casual (like the rest of NEST) or don't play Summoner much at all (Mr. Happy, Xenos, etc etc).

[rewd]

I double checked through the video and it definitely feels like he's choosing very arbitrary cutoffs for what counts for how many buttons you need to press. Like when he's describing how many buttons you need to hit "5 or more times per minute" and says only ruin 3 on existing summoner, but that excludes Egi Assaults and Ruin 4. Or how he doesn't seem to count the DoT skills as actions at all. It all feels very suspicious.

His entire video is built on false premises. It makes sense, though, his job is to build up pre-expansion hype. No one is going to give real criticism to anything - new jobs in particular - at this time. Honest and relevant feedback will only come later.

The biggest criticism about SMN is not the lack of buttons, it's the lack of mechanics. It's about how old SMN got several things removed without a replacement and how the few things that survived were nerfed to irrelevance (Aetherflow and Ruin IV). He conveniently doesn't mention any of this and bases his video on a random "let's see who pushes more buttons in a minute".

Once you remember he is an influencer first and then a SMN player, it just makes sense.

[CKNovel]

I found this new Larryzaur video (from earlier today) on the subject to be rather illuminating and valuable.

I encourage those with reservations for the rework to give it a watch. It's not even 8 minutes long.

https://youtu.be/-uk-4VaET6A

This is a good video, he really tries to compare the current filler phase to the new SMN and button diversity.
It somehow shows that SQEX learned about players getting bored from spamming the same button 5 times in a row... Hopefully they learned.

I remain on my take:
Wait for the release to get a good grasp of the job and provide feedback.
The rework was inevitable since the 2.0, it had to happen at some point.

[zcrash970]

This is a good video, he really tries to compare the current filler phase to the new SMN and button diversity.
It somehow shows that SQEX learned about players getting bored from spamming the same button 5 times in a row... Hopefully they learned.

I remain on my take:
Wait for the release to get a good grasp of the job and provide feedback.
The rework was inevitable since the 2.0, it had to happen at some point.

This is one of the few times I disagree with Larry.

My problem with his logic is he really not counting egi assaults, fester, ed, and ruin 4s with ruin 3 in 5.0 smn filler phrases.

Ultimately what 6.0 filler phrase will be like is gem shine or brilliance spam, astral flow and your 3 summon buttons. You literally traded one spam for another.

And at least with current summoner, you can weave a few more oGCDS in

[MrJPtheAssassin]

This is one of the few times I disagree with Larry.

My problem with his logic is he really not counting egi assaults, fester, ed, and ruin 4s with ruin 3 in 5.0 smn filler phrases.

Ultimately what 6.0 filler phrase will be like is gem shine or brilliance spam, astral flow and your 3 summon buttons. You literally traded one spam for another.

And at least with current summoner, you can weave a few more oGCDS in

His logic is mostly sound since he mostly talks about buttons you press more than 5 times in a min. Most of the time you only press egi assaults 4 pre min, you only press r4 to avoid over capping but most of your r4 uses are in Bahamut, fester I believe is maybe 2 per min and the other two is saved in your demi summons/trances. You see gem shine and brilliance as the same as ruin 3 but they really not, at least I dont see them the same. Depending on the primal you have they are slightly different from each other and completely different from r3. But hey if you don't want to look at it that way or just cant that fine. You have the right to disagree with me or larry.

This is mostly to every doomsayers on this thread and to the balance discord but you don't have to like new smn but the way I see it complaining about it anywhere isn't really going to make much of a difference other than just venting into the void. The devs have made their decision and 6.0 smn is the smn we getting, like it or not. As it was said devs didn't have much choice in the matter either bc the job was on a breaking point so this rework was coming no matter what. Give it a try before judging the job is you dont trust in those who played it before us, and if you end up hating it or find it boring there are so many other jobs to pick from in this game. I know I have two backup jobs just in case I don't like the new smn and I think everyone should do the same tbh.

[aveyond-dreams]

The people who are the biggest summoner fans have largely been celebrating across all social media platforms that they're no longer poison mages with disobedient pets, like Larryzaur, etc. Their beloved job wasn't taken away, it was finally added to the game after 8 years. The same less than 10 people however continue complaining that they're job has lost its "complexity!" and "knowing how to manage my pet ghosting was a sign of skill!" They represent an extreme minority who would rather hold the class back rather than see it improve further on these new systems which people by and large enjoy.

New summoner is easy to understand and straightforward with enough decision making involved to make one need to think ahead when it comes to more difficult fights, it isn't braindead as some would say nor is it "casuals ruining the job." Thank you to Larryzaur for putting that video together and debunking what little remained of these bizarre arguments.

Edit: 4.4k likes to 56 dislikes. I think its clear where most people stand on this issue.

[CKNovel]

New summoner is easy to understand and straightforward with enough decision making involved to make one need to think ahead when it comes to more difficult fights, it isn't braindead as some would say nor is it "casuals ruining the job." Thank you to Larryzaur for putting that video together and debunking what little remained of these bizarre arguments.

The previous points stands, it seems you're really difficult to accept valid criticisms.
Likes and dislikes is not a valid metric, a lot of people are just here for Larry's videos, not for the SMN rework itself.

The job still lost a lot that some SMN mains loved, you need to understand that.
Taking MCH as an example again, Wildfire rework, how it was a dopaming shot in HW/SB and how IQ draining it is now.

Again since you can't seem to understand it:
The rework is welcome and necessary. Its playerbase is free to have concerns and to be disappointed about certain aspects being gone.
Claiming your feedback is the only rightful one and the others are wrong and bizarre is a terrible behavior.