Thoughts of Samurai Changes

[Shurrikhan]

You realize you're making a pretty big deal out of something very minor, correct? The negative impact of this change is quite literally next to nothing, and will likely just translate to less damage lost over the long term across the playerbase.

Present considerations unique to AoE:

• Remember that combos are only 2 steps long.
• Position radial AoE at center of mob pack.
• Position conal AoE at edge of mob pack
• Aim conal AoE to an enemy who will center the cone around the mob pack.
• Be sure to be positioned within the hitboxes of any enemies at the base of the cone. You will aim at a more distant enemy, but you can still strike any enemies whose hitboxes are intersected by any space between the center and 'frontal' edge of yours.
• Target-swap in order not to lose auto-attack uptime even when casting Tenka on enemies out of range to maximize its coverage.
• Use large mobs(' hitboxes as cone base) to minimize distance that most be moved between optimizing conal and radial AoE.
• Predict tank positioning as not to let more distant centering Tenka targets move out of cone. (Generally, be around 90 degrees from tank, on the side they're more likely to dodge to, such that they cleave you but also don't run mobs through and past Tenka, especially before lv74, or outrange Tenka).

Most of the nuance of our AoE spam was quite strictly because of having those switches between conal and radial AoEs. We retain that partially with Tenka, but that's it; the frequency of that engagement has gone 4 in 5 GCDs to 1 in 5.

Is it a small change? Yes. Is it a bad one? Imo, also yes. And it most definitely perpetuates design concepts I think are damaging to the game.

For context:

Imo, good "QoL" changes: Ten Chi Jin changes; Gnashing Fang combo consolidation (you literally could just swipe your finger over the keys for all three and queue the next usable one); removal of BotD (at least since it stopped having any impact in combat -- i.e., Shadowbringers), etc.
Imo, "QoL" changes arguably good or bad: Buffs from Oka/Mangetsu (assuming accordant rebalance), Enochian being basically just removed rather than turned into a gameplay-affecting trait (wherein losing AF or UI drops progress towards next Foul/Xeno), etc.
Imo, bad "QoL" changes: Shadowfang being turned from a rotational element into Sonic Break v2, then removed; this change to Fuga; etc.

[Ryaz]

Huh, didn't notice before, but Senei and Guren only cost 25 kenki now.

[Acece]

Samurai feels great tbh. I thought we would have less kenki but with Hissatsu being 25 kenki instead of 50 and third eye granting 10 kenki It doesn't feel like I'm missing 3 less Shintens. the added flexibility of double tsubame makes it a lot less punishing on messing up which is nice. I have not gotten double meikyo or ogi but it'll probably make the experience even better! Samurai feels like it only got better going into end walker which nice compared to some other jobs. It might not feel as great to optimize but we'll see when raids drop.

[Kahnom]

SAM got a lot of QoL this expansion and I like that, reminds me of the old SAM in SB again.
I’m only level 83 but I will look forward to get to max level.

[Shurrikhan]

reminds me of the old SAM in SB again.

So... when your Sen-cleanse was on a 40s CD, Oka/Mangetsu granted no buffs, and Shifu/Jinpu were only 30s durations?

[silentwindfr]

right now the sam feel nice, but i have a few concern for make it great...
they are called tenka goken and hissatsu: guren. with endwalker we did get a lot of QoL for our AoE, oka and mangetsu giving buff, mumyo shoha for use our charge in aoe phase, and Fuko making our whole combo a 360 degree.
sadly like said tenka goken is not the case, you need to target something for deal a charged aoe in cone if your target die, you need to retarget another and recharge tenka goken. ii must'nt be the only one that had his target die while charging a tenka goken... and let's be honest the target system of ff14 is far to be the best around. but i digress, the trouble is we was aoe with the combo and we need to move from the group for use efficiently tenka goken.

and outside the charge time for tenka we can say the same for guren...

sadly i don't see any change coming before the next expansion... but well at least all the other change did make our cycle more stable and fluid.

[Shurrikhan]

right now the sam feel nice, but i have a few concern for make it great...

sadly... we need to move from the group for use efficiently tenka goken....

When "great" just really means "obliges less gameplay." /sigh

The only change I want to Tenka and Guren is the same change I want for all targeted AoEs -- to make it follow character facing instead of requiring a target.

[silentwindfr]

When "great" just really means "obliges less gameplay." /sigh

The only change I want to Tenka and Guren is the same change I want for all targeted AoEs -- to make it follow character facing instead of requiring a target.

it's not less gameplay, it's make it more fluid... it's different. with fugo you can go in middle of the melee and the time you spend to replace yourself for get an efficient tenka goken or simply for target the right target is painfull.
plus one important point to note a lot of large enemy make tenka goken simply miss the pack... since it's range is 8 yalm when the combo have a 5 yalms, but since it's circle it's actually covering 10 yalms.
for make simple even if your combo can hit everyone it's not said that tenka goken will do the same.

it's tedious and often handicap the sam when other dps don't have this part to move, don't forget that tenka goken have a charging time where we don't move... making use loose double time, since we need to move in position, then wait that tenka goken charge up and goes. when we had fuka it wasn't a trouble since we was already placing ourself for fuka... but with fugo we don't need to place ourself... making all the situation around tenka and guren uselessly more complicate than needed.

and if you did notice i have said that it's probably something that will not come out before next expac... and honestly right now at this time, what can they add to the samurai?
only a few skill need change or to be look at:
- higanbana, because it don't use tsubame and honestly even if in terms of dps it's welcome i still fail to see it point, since samurai try to slash thing, not make them bleed. don't get me wrong i understand that it did bring diversity to the cycle, but maybe they need to look into it for make it more engaging more than force us to use 3 gcd for add diversity.
- tenka goken (like guren),i have already explained my thought about it
- mokuso, i feel this skill need a bit of flavor...often when the fight allows us to use it we barely need it... i dunno what to do with it for make it more relevant... because right now it feel like a niche skill.

right now for 2 expac the sam did barely change, most of the change was quality of life more than adding true new mechanic that add to the jobs, some will say that tsubame did add stuff or shoha but did the jobs really did change with this two thing? it's only did make the sam feel more complete....
the question is what can they add with the next one... we already have the job with the most button used. and the one i did talk about are usefull (exept mokuso) then scrap them is kinda hard. do we will get one more expac of minimal change? more than less gameplay, i'm more worried to get more of the same gameplay.

but honestly the sam is good, i have a blast with it. i'm even surprise that ogi is something that don't replace the iaijutsu... and the sam is not the only jobs like this, the rdm have the same trouble... and the most the fun it's the two jobs added together that have the same trouble.
i'm for more gameplay, more tool to be used... but if they want to add more tool, they need to make our tool more fluid and smooth. mekyo and tsubame with two charge are a good way to do it. change tenka goken and guren another one. maybe like you said to remove the need of target someone, yes. we are here for talk and share our mind about it. i don't say my is more relevant or more just than your, just give my piece of mind. whatever they decide if it work i'm for it.

[Shurrikhan]

it's not less gameplay, it's make it more fluid... it's different.

It's literally less. You've gone from obliged movement to... nothing.

By your logic, positionals have no gameplay element.

Again, I'm all for all targeted AoEs being changed to instead use the character's or camera's facing, since that'd be less finicky and more intuitive, but that does not necessitate that every AoE in the game is turned into a radial AoE. I prefer the obliged movement brought by having a mix of AoEs.

[Kahnom]

So... when your Sen-cleanse was on a 40s CD, Oka/Mangetsu granted no buffs, and Shifu/Jinpu were only 30s durations?

I mean the flow of gameplay.
If you pkay SAM long enough, you'll get what I mean.