Flaws of the combat system

[Illmaeran]

Maybe the game isn't in the right genre for this [anymore].

Corrected with an RL sad face.

[Liam_Harper]

Hard disagree on some of that. What you're describing are symptoms of flaws in the game design, not the actual flaws and also from the point of view of dungeons which are absolutely irrelevant content only designed as a theme park ride to view the story through.

-Tanks are not too sturdy, they're actually not sturdy enough. In any content that matters, the tank isn't going to last that long without a healer. Dungeon bosses do not matter, they hit like wet noodles. This is sealed by the fact that many raid mechanics are designed to simply kill you if too many people are dead or you don't have a partner to soak or you can't swap and so on. The sturdiness that tanks do have, they don't really have to work for.
This creates a role that has little impact on the run, a low skill ceiling and no real reward for playing exceptionally well. As long as you do the basics, cd for busters and do your watered down blue melee dps rotation, you're good.

-Healers issue is group composition isn't flexible and mechanics are so often scripted single big hits that mitigation has a huge impact. It's always 1 healer per 4 players. If you map your mitigation perfectly, gear up with BiS, plan your healing oGCD's, it's still 1 healer per 4 players, which is now completely overkill. They've designed themselves into a corner, because they have to make it possible for a min-ilv semi-inexperienced group to be able to heal through during prog. But due to scripting and rigid party composition, this is naturally going to result in more and more downtime the better the group is.
Sure, we do need more incoming damage to heal, but it would never fix downtime which is why 1 button dps is an abomination and healers have been begging them to embrace healer dps instead and add a little engagement to it.

Healers issue is not tanks. Self sufficiency is great and allows you to add more damage to encounters because players have the tools for it. I love self-sufficient tanks and even a little on dps, there can still be plenty to heal in a well designed encounter. Sadly the devs are afraid to place any responsibility on tanks or dps beyond "hold agro" or "make big numbers". Then, since healers have a sole responsibility, they're afraid to set that bar too high and make it too easy.

-I do fully agree on mobility tax being outdated and excessive and that support dps could do with more support tools. Again, more support tools means they can make encounters a bit harder because the tools exist to handle it. But again, sadly I don't expect the devs to ever require dps to use their utility.

[StriderShinryu]

One thing to keep in mind for topics like this (and we've seen this topic so many times already) is that alongside this we also have topics complaining that tanks don't know what they're doing, healers don't know how to heal and/or dps, DPS players don't know their rotations/how to AoE/etc.

So on one hand the game is too simple and easy and boring to play, but on the other hand the vast majority of the player base doesn't know what they're doing. If the game, according to some people, is already just too damn hard for the casuals to understand and you go and make it even harder, how are you planning to square that off?

[Poporito_Popoto]

One thing to keep in mind for topics like this (and we've seen this topic so many times already) is that alongside this we also have topics complaining that tanks don't know what they're doing, healers don't know how to heal and/or dps, DPS players don't know their rotations/how to AoE/etc.

So on one hand the game is too simple and easy and boring to play, but on the other hand the vast majority of the player base doesn't know what they're doing. If the game, according to some people, is already just too damn hard for the casuals to understand and you go and make it even harder, how are you planning to square that off?

They don't. They only think about themselves.

[Lanadra]

One thing to keep in mind for topics like this (and we've seen this topic so many times already) is that alongside this we also have topics complaining that tanks don't know what they're doing, healers don't know how to heal and/or dps, DPS players don't know their rotations/how to AoE/etc.

So on one hand the game is too simple and easy and boring to play, but on the other hand the vast majority of the player base doesn't know what they're doing. If the game, according to some people, is already just too damn hard for the casuals to understand and you go and make it even harder, how are you planning to square that off?

People will often only look from their own perspective. Rarely do I see 'all these dungeons are so boring and easy' people acknowledge that it may not be 'boring and easy' for everyone. In fact.. it'll usually be higher end players who then also try to make the point that 'make it all at least twice as hard and punish people for failing' will supposedly make people less bad.. all the while mocking people who do find some things more challenging.

I would argue that it would make people quit due to not being able to progress.. which SE does not want. All in all there's not much that can or will be done pertaining anything to do with MSQ content, leveling dungeons, MSQ mandated trials. They are kept manageable even by 'bad' players by design because they are primarily the medium through which SE wants us to experience the story. There's a reason we have Extreme, Savage and Ultimates, that is where challenge is the focus, even if one could argue about the difficulty of Extremes as some would.

[Rinhi]

People will often only look from their own perspective. Rarely do I see 'all these dungeons are so boring and easy' people acknowledge that it may not be 'boring and easy' for everyone. In fact.. it'll usually be higher end players who then also try to make the point that 'make it all at least twice as hard and punish people for failing' will supposedly make people less bad.. all the while mocking people who do find some things more challenging.

dungeons are boring and easy and should either get harder or get harder variants
sincerely, a casual, non-higher end player

[_Pigzig]

basically this is a game too easy post

[Mezzoforte]

The combat system in this game is flawed... Thanks for coming to my TED Talk.

A lot of these issues are non-issues because the game is specifically and intentionally designed to be exactly this way. The game is made for people who can't hold aggro, who can't properly heal, or cant do good damage. They focus exclusively on "accessibility" and will never change this. Yoshi has said this many times that the core focus of the game is exactly that. Some of these issues aren't a problem at higher areas of play, do some savages, do some ultimates, and such. They become less of a problem and little enough of an issue you can overlook it. However, all the other content that is made specifically to be super easy and super casual with almost no thought is always going to be that way. This is a super easy and super casual oriented game made for the "average person." If constantly having a challenge and having to burn calories using your brain is something you desire, this is not the game.

[Caurcas]

Dungeons don't matter for role balance as they are just their for fluff content.

[SeverianLyonesse]

As a tank new to the game I agree with the sentiment in this thread.

I don't mind that aggro is easy to maintain for trials and other boss fights...it turns them into a different sort of experience for tanks that revolves more around aoe dancing and timing mitigation. I think the change up is great and important for tanks to have varied experiences.

But dungeons, for all of their aesthetic flair, are so boring. Unless I was substantially undergeared, I never had an issue maintaining aggro. And to me, the whole appeal of tanking dungeons is going out of your way to lure aggro, the constant herding of cats. That simply doesn't exist in the XIV dungeon experience right now.

While I am sure some portion of the playerbase would complain if dungeons were slowed down by aggro shuffling, and some other portion would quit tanking altogether due to higher stress levels...I would love the game to shift at least some of the content in that direction.