Whats the deal with tanks recently?

[nebby00]

Ok, I'm new to the game, so it may be that, but since I did a lot of stuff as DPS, tank and healer already, I say... Men, it's not that hard.
I mean. I pull one pull. If my health is down to 20% too many times, they did a lot of dmg, so one-two pulls at a time. If it stays over 30-50%, I pull the whole bloody dungeon at once. That's the first run. Throw my tank skills (it's pretty obvious everything that says "INCREASE YOUR DEFENSE" is a tank buff), and since they don't stack and have long CDs, I have to throw them in order to mantain the DMG in check. Also, area attacks, let the DPS do their thing, use my main rotation against bosses/when there are 1-2 mobs, otherwise AoE. Like in every game everytime, boss needs to be turned around, areas must be avoided but I should not move unless I have to, better eat something myself than DPS/healers, mechanics need to be consulted BEFORE entering the dungeon (that's what Google is for, and YT too) and instant kills (or tank busters as you call them here) needs to be confronted with specific skills...
So don't know. I always try to go as fast as posible. It's what tanks are for, pull as many as posible without being killed. As posible, of course, I will not pull 4 pulls if I'm struggling with 2, but for now I haven't got any complains.
I mean, encounters can have specific mechanics that are hard, but the general lines... It's pretty much the same thing. I go as fast as my equipment allows to. And I always care of having the best gear possible for my role.

You're doing an excellent job then and I commend you for your efforts. Pretty much by what you're saying, you're better than a good percentage of new tanks that have joined the game. Of course, I'm all for people going into dungeons blind, but the fact that you look up ahead of time is nice as well. Hopefully you'll continue to have a good time and fun in your dungeon runs and get excellent groups as well. Best of luck to you friend!

[Mirikh]

I keep getting groups with tanks who NEVER aoe even on trash packs of 5+ and NEVER use their CDs. Its driving me insane. I should not be pulling hate with a gravity while healing because they don't know how to aoe... And don't get me started on the ones who never aoe AND pull 1 mob at a time making a 15min dungeon 40mins long.

So few things
1. YOU HAVE AN AOE COMBO AND IT IS GENERALLY BETTER ON 3+
2. IT IS OKAY TO WIPE. IT IS BETTER TO PULL BIG AND MAYBE WIPE THAN GO AT A SNAILS PACE. "Im new to this" Cool follow the heals or dps then that have done it before and pick everything up.

Toxic "You pull it you tank it" needs to stay in other mmos it has no reason to be in FF its much easier for me to pull as a healer weith my dot and stand next to the tank than the tank trying to target inside a pack of 5mobs.

New tank here. I love it if healer stands next to me and pulls stuff over. Please continue. Been leveling alt dps also, and tanks doing single target rotations on packs are about 50% of my runs. Then dps AoEs and gets all the aggro. So one thing the Hall of Novice does tell you is tanks use AoE. Maybe they need to yell it louder?

[Claire_Pendragon]

In plenty of cases, its just better to tell them to "always AoE for 2+ mobs" (instead of 3+)

[Penthea]

And don't get me started on the ones who never aoe AND pull 1 mob at a time making a 15min dungeon 40mins long.

Uh...not even my Trust dungeon runs last for 40 minutes...and I do those while half watching something on my second monitor.

If a dungeon is taking 40 minutes to do then there is more than one problem player in the group.

So either you are greatly exaggerating how long it takes or you're putting all the blame on one player instead of two or more.

[LaughingBanana]

Every once in a while I have had tanks doing funky things in my party during dungeons/raids/trials but not to the degree that I would call "often".

I main healers, and it's a bit fun dealing with the fallout most of the times, hahahah. Perfectly done content can be boring sometimes, lol.

[hynaku]

Tanks are really bad now. Alliance raid did not long age none of them had there tank stance on and first area of the crystal tower raid 90% of the whole alliance group died from it. If your a healer this makes it very stressful on you trying to keep everyone alive. How would like it if all the dps never used the aoes on huge groups the tank pulls.

[RitsukoSonoda]

Tanks are really bad now. Alliance raid did not long age none of them had there tank stance on and first area of the crystal tower raid 90% of the whole alliance group died from it. If your a healer this makes it very stressful on you trying to keep everyone alive. How would like it if all the dps never used the aoes on huge groups the tank pulls.

You act like DPS haven't been doing that since 1.0.

[ForteNightshade]

It's the same with "healer mains" proudly stating that they don't heal avoidable damage or let people die to teach them a lesson, slowing down the entire run while playing the little princess everyone needs to bow to.
I've found that many players that act like this are just salty that their oh-so-important role isn't so important after all and their sense of entitlement is entirely unfounded.
If someone picked a role because they like to feel important, "lead the party", "set the pace" or some other nonsense, they're going to be disappointed.
Tanks and healers don't get special attention or a pat on the head for doing their job and their opinion isn't more important than anyone else's.

I'll never understand the whole "teaching them a lesson" concept because now you've given them motivation to be equally petty. If a DPS/Healer were willing to pull ahead of you before, what makes you think they'll suddenly stop after you intentionally let them die? Now they'll do it to purposefully annoy you. If you let someone die because they stood in AoEs, well now they're refusing a raise and you essentially granted them a free AFK spell. And before anyone says, "I'll report them!" Are you going to report yourself too? They're matching their petty behavior with your own.

It just never seems like a good idea. Either kick the person or tolerate them.

That's because, listen closely because this is important, they are the majority not the minority. You don't make a game for the tiny 1% of endgame raiders who are absolutely amazing at everything they do. You design a game around the average player who regularly makes mistakes, forgets to dodge an AoE, hasn't quite mastered their heals or their buffs, or is simply new to the content and doesn't know the mechanics. That's who you cater for, because that's the majority of your audience.

I do love these extreme arguments. Wall pulling isn't "hardcore endgame raider" caliber. It's making the tank and healer actually have any relevance because single pull trash mobs can be tanked and kills by DPS. They're that weak. Hence why at least medium pulls are standard nowadays. Likewise, expecting tanks to use their AoE isn't endgame game level skills but basic common sense someone should know if they bothered reading their tooltips.

And no, "pull everything" is not just for penta-melded players or those with capped current tome gear. You can wall pull every single dungeon in the game with the minimal ilvl requirement. Hell, I wall pulled from Dong Mheg on at the release of Shadowbringers with the only exception being some of the super pulls like in Qitana or Mt. Gulg since I didn't know about them yet. Expert dungeons is even more of a joke. As are practically every 50-70 dungeon nowadays due to them all being nerfed. Bardam's Mette and Doma Castle are the only ones that can be a bit spicy if you're rocking full Shire but they're about it. Dungeon mobs as a whole are ridiculously weak. Even if you want to be a little cautious, then pull two packs.

[Arkdra]

This is why I don’t tank. I am new to FF14 but not MMO. Yes I plaid wow but back in the day, in wow I healed and rang dps. With the “GO GO GO….” Mentality I was hesitant to tank.

In FF being able to have a main that does every job I thought it would be cool to tank. My main is BLM and I love it, no desire to really play anything else (currently, I want to get max level and raid as BLM but that could change in the future).

I thought about tanking but just doing the MSQ I have seen how “new” tanks are treated by some players, I don’t want to deal with that so I won’t tank or heal in this game, it looks fun but dealing with the “GO GO GO…” and “YOU NEED TO AND MUST PLAY THE WAY I WANT YOU TOO…..” crowd makes me cringe.

Tanking is easy as hell, that's why. Like here is the complete newbie guide to tanking.

1. Put your tank stance on.
2. Inspect your healer, is their weapon's ilvl reasonable for the dungeon you are in? Do they at least have something in the rest of their slots?
3a. If so, pull at least 2 groups, more if you like.
3b. If not, single pull and gauge.
4. Once you've aggro'd that second group (or just the 1 if you're single pulling), use one, singular tank cd.
5. Push your aoe attacks until there are <4 monsters still standing.
6. If the defensive cd wears off and the fight still has a little bit to go, use a 2nd one.
7. Go back to 5.

That's it. That's all you have to do. Nobody will care about literally anything else you do and this is why it is so galling to everyone else in the group when prima donna tanks pitch a fit. Compared to what the healers and dps are doing this is babycakes, doable by an apkallu drinking bird tier difficulty.

[Gyson]

I keep getting groups with tanks who NEVER aoe even on trash packs of 5+ and NEVER use their CDs. Its driving me insane. I should not be pulling hate with a gravity while healing because they don't know how to aoe... And don't get me started on the ones who never aoe AND pull 1 mob at a time making a 15min dungeon 40mins long.

So few things
1. YOU HAVE AN AOE COMBO AND IT IS GENERALLY BETTER ON 3+
2. IT IS OKAY TO WIPE. IT IS BETTER TO PULL BIG AND MAYBE WIPE THAN GO AT A SNAILS PACE. "Im new to this" Cool follow the heals or dps then that have done it before and pick everything up.

Toxic "You pull it you tank it" needs to stay in other mmos it has no reason to be in FF its much easier for me to pull as a healer weith my dot and stand next to the tank than the tank trying to target inside a pack of 5mobs.

I don't know if you're exaggerating to make a point or being realistic, but if your dungeon is (assuming no-wipes) taking 40 minutes to clear it's not because of your tank.

Quick dungeon runs are typically 18-20 minutes long. I can't remember the last time I've seen a wipe-free dungeon run go more than 30 minutes. They probably happen but it just hasn't been my experience. And the difference between wall-to-wall pulling and pack-by-pack is maybe a savings of 5 minutes at best, in most cases (and the wall-to-wall pulls lose that time advantage with just one wipe).

When I'm in a run with jobs being driven by good players, where packs of mobs are getting decimated quickly, then wall-to-wall pulls are definitely the way to go. But sometimes you get a group of players that just doesn't do AOE well, and those large pulls end up saving no time or (worse) end up costing you more time because the healer has to focus more on healing than damage, the fight is dragging on so long that the tank's exhausted all their cool-downs, there are so many PBOEs being cast that your melee is having to spend more time dodging than attacking, and so on. It isn't as cut and dry as people tend to make it out to be.

I just ask the healer at the start if they prefer big or normal pulls. Either answer doesn't bother me because I know the difference between them is usually a handful of minutes. And usually if you get a good group that kills quickly and things are too easy, a cautious healer will usually say they're comfortable with trying larger pulls out for the remainder of the run.

If I end up in a group with people who have never been in the dungeon before, I usually just go pack-by-pack unless someone says differently. Because I know you only get to experience a dungeon for your first time once, and I would rather spend an extra 5 minutes letting them sight-see than racing them from one wall to the next. Again, it's just a few extra minutes.. not 25+.