A request for Endwalker Dungeons (No more Undertuned)

[RitsukoSonoda]

So what I'm getting from this whole conversation is: for content in FF14 to be capable of supporting quality exploration... it needs to both be decoupled from levelling and needs to (somehow) discourage players from running it repeatedly (thus reducing the desire for it to be streamlined).

What kind of content like this would they be able to make?

IMO the biggest deterrents to quality exploration are the over abundance of teleport locations in the overworld that eliminate most needs to actually travel to locations once the story puts you there the first time and the whole instanced duty system. MMO's I'd played in the past lacking these things I would typically find people exploring frequently since people were more prone to have various landmarks and things seen on a map catch their attention when they're actually travelling through the area and not stuck on duty timer with someone screaming "ESPORTS 420 SPEEDRUNZ"

[Roda]

No thanks. I am casual player and I don't want to get stuck in dugeon trying to complete MSQ
Not all of us live in this game. We got life outside.

"Casual" does not mean "person who plays at a less than average level of effectiveness."
"harder dungeons" does not mean you'll need to form a prog group to finish the dungeon. No one is asking for extreme+ level dungeons to replace story dungeons.

But when I can post on the forums between gcds and still call the run a speed run, we've got a problem here. I'd personally like it if dungeons could once again take my eyes off my second monitor for the duration.

And honestly, If they manage to have an ex level dungeon somehow, you have trusts. You will never be blocked from a dungeon complete.

But as someone who has been wanting to have something to casually do in the game when I have some surprise free-time, I'd really like it if my low-stakes instanced content had a bit of novelty to keep me awake and actually entice me to do it outside of extrinsic rewards.

Fair...
Also, those timers can get pretty spicy and exploring can be real dangerous in deep dungeons.

Yeah, and that's the other part of it. Risk can be fun!
But,
when you're doing exploration based content, you kind of want screwups to have less of a punishment to encourage experimentation. (It's a big problem I had with eureka)

IMO the biggest deterrents to quality exploration are the over abundance of teleport locations in the overworld that eliminate most needs to actually travel to locations once the story puts you there the first time and the whole instanced duty system. MMO's I'd played in the past lacking these things I would typically find people exploring frequently since people were more prone to have various landmarks and things seen on a map catch their attention when they're actually travelling through the area and not stuck on duty timer with someone screaming "ESPORTS 420 SPEEDRUNZ"

Honestly, I don't know about that. HW and onward have very few teleports per sq ft of map and how many people have taken the time to explore the tomb of king manfred? Found the hanging dragon in western coerthas? There are some secrets in the overworld, yes, but then what? There's no gameplay with exploration in this game. No secret quests. (or if they are secret, they are VERY well hidden) No environmental interactivity. Nothing. The overworld is just a backdrop for the MSQ, sidequests and fates.

I think SE did the game dirty when they slapped duty timers on eureka and bozja, and had them be instances you queued for. Big openworld content, at least in my eyes, is fun when you can just stumble into it while you're doing something else, or waiting for a queue. Eureka/bozja just will never scratch that itch 'cause they're about fate farming and only about fate farming (and like one siege).

I guess, let me put it this way. I had more of a sense of exploration when I found the magic pot, than I did looking for the magicite that krile told me was ~over there somewhere~ and then it was next to a conspicuously placed wrecked house.

Give me a broken tablet thrown on the ground next to an inconspicuous tree. Make the missing words reappear during a certain phase of the moon with certain weather. Have those words tell me to go to a spot and emote. Have that emote trigger an unmarked fate to spawn. Have the completion of the fate trigger an npc to send me (and all other participants) a mail. Have that mail tell me to meet that npc at a certain time in a certain location and do a emote to them (don't tell the name, give us a visual tell). Have that npc send me on some other random questy stuff, idk write a story, I'm not the critically acclaimed rpg here. Puzzles!

[ItMe]

Yeah, and that's the other part of it. Risk can be fun!
But,
when you're doing exploration based content, you kind of want screwups to have less of a punishment to encourage experimentation. (It's a big problem I had with eureka)

Hahaha especially when Deep Dungeon runs can take so loooong.
That's a very good point.

[Nikki]

"Casual" does not mean "person who plays at a less than average level of effectiveness."
"harder dungeons" does not mean you'll need to form a prog group to finish the dungeon. No one is asking for extreme+ level dungeons to replace story dungeons.

But when I can post on the forums between gcds and still call the run a speed run, we've got a problem here. I'd personally like it if dungeons could once again take my eyes off my second monitor for the duration.

My answer is still the same. No thanks to harder dungeons tied to MSQ.