TOS Clarification:Third Party Program

[Alaray]

If it's not being used to cheat who cares.

Reporting literally anyone borderline suspected of utilizing a third party program is just weird, childish, petty behavior. That's it. There's no further discussion to be had on the point that's worthwhile.

[Caurcas]

Anything that interfaces with the game in a meaningful way or alters files is a no go.

[TaleraRistain]

There really isn't any clarification needed. Third party programs are against the ToS. Now, they can only take action on what they can prove is in use. That's where the "Don't ask, don't tell, don't post nude modded screenshots" ideas come into play. They don't have sniffers to see what is in our systems. And they haven't seemed to be consistent about taking action against streamers unless said streamer was being a jerk so they seem to reserve a little judgement on when they do and do not want to act there. But their official stance is that they are against ToS and that strengthens the actions they can take when they do take them.

[Wavaryen]

I don't care about the developers wishes. I'm going to be real here. The TOS is just design to protect them from legal troubles. It is not a rule I have to follow unless they are willing to enforce said rules. On this subject they can't.


I like the developers, but Im not friends with them. This is a business not my friend. So I will respect rules they enforce aka chat rules and not talking about it in game, but if I have ways to improve the game that does not hurt other players, and they can't do anything about it. I am going to do it, and I don't care how they feel about it.


That is how most gamers are, it is nothing to do with respect, at the end of the day it is a video game. Some people take it too serious, or jealous because they are not on pc and can't make the same choices.

[kaynide]

How much more clear could the devs be? They've said, repeatedly, don't use mods. Full stop.

Now, if you want to continue to use them, that's on you.

Think of it like speeding in a car. It's illegal- the end.

But....cops probably don't care generally speaking if you're doing it in a place where there's no likely accidents or you're not going THAT much over..but if you're an idiot about it yeah, tickets for you.

[Artemiz]

A heck of a lot of people projecting their own views onto what Yoshi-P said. Yes, he said dont use mods, but he also said they don't check if you are using them. He also said what constitutes as a mod is a huge can of worms he didn't want to deal with. They even used porn as an example of their views, if its on your computer thats your business, just don't publish it.

If you want to use mods that's up to you, but for the love of all that is holy stop talking about them.

[Xaruko_Nexume]

A heck of a lot of people projecting their own views onto what Yoshi-P said. Yes, he said dont use mods, but he also said they don't check if you are using them. He also said what constitutes as a mod is a huge can of worms he didn't want to deal with. They even used porn as an example of their views, if its on your computer thats your business, just don't publish it.

If you want to use mods that's up to you, but for the love of all that is holy stop talking about them.

I don't think they can avoid talking about it or taking a hard stand one way or another for very much longer. Streamers and youtubers are brining wayyyy too much attention to them now and getting away with using them like they aren't against TOS. They are. Even if Yoshi P said they are fine (he didn't) the written legal document you click accept on takes precedence over even what he says.

[Raiya]

His issue with the character model mods was primarily due to the nude mods, which can get both Unit III and SE itself in significant legal trouble due to their rating, and the game may even be required to have the rating raised if they become too publicized. So again, if you use them, keep your mouth shut, don't post modded photos on your social media, and you will have no issues.

Actually thats not quite true. SE cannot get in trouble for the likes of mods even NSFW because they didnt create either the assets or mods. They're not made by the company in any way.

Some might think this is an issue because of the infamous "Hot Coffee" mod in GTA years ago but the reason behind and the rerating shenanigans that was because the mod code was already in the game itself and was later enabled by a coder. It wouldn't be the same here as any mods are by 3rd parties not endorsed, created or under the control of SE.

[MilkieTea]

Actually thats not quite true. SE cannot get in trouble for the likes of mods even NSFW because they didnt create either the assets or mods. They're not made by the company in any way.

Some might think this is an issue because of the infamous "Hot Coffee" mod in GTA years ago but the reason behind and the rerating shenanigans that was because the mod code was already in the game itself and was later enabled by a coder. It wouldn't be the same here as any mods are by 3rd parties not endorsed, created or under the control of SE.

It’s more of an image issue, if I’m hearing and seeing things correctly.

If some facebook mom sees inappropriate pictures of this game her “precious little Jimmy,” is playing on twitter, and goes to all her other facebook friends saying that this game is unsuitable for children, and they spread the news, it’s likely to become the next big thing of “Are games too scandalous for children? this game is extremely easy to mod, and you never know if little Jimmy is nuded on someone elses screen… they could be doing harmful things to *your* children’s characters too!”

It’s a PR NIGHTMARE. This stuff happens all the time, because parents *like this* don’t understand how games work at ALL. Especially online games.

[Saraide]

It's really simply: dont harrass people. That's the main problem yoshi-p has and it is only semi related to third party tools, which are by his own admission a huge grey area. He puts out a blanket no but refuses to specify what counts as third party program and what doesnt. Simply put, it's not worth having that discussion. This approach by the devs is honestly not bad, they look at the actual issue related to ACT, harrassment of players over damage numbers, and not any and all third party tools.

Dont forget that he's also telling the people who dont use third party tools (again: term with a huge grey area) to not worry about it. Dont start report wars, dont be vindictive about it.

There are downsides with this approach of course as the game by itself doesnt make it easy to see if you are improving or not as even an official ACT but only about your own damage numbers got a hard "never" from the devs so that it cant be used to gatekeep PFs. Although even that could be side stepped with enough dedication with just ingame tools. What's functionally the difference between a PF saying "provide proof of your dps numbers being high enough" and "provide proof you can clear a certain SSS dummy with atleast x seconds remaining"? There's also another thing, if you know the job someone is playing well, you really dont need ACT to see if they are performing well or not.

This general no is not as clear as some people think it is, simply because yoship refuses to specify what falls under it and I dont blame him for it. Harrassing people over their performance is not stopped by going after third party tools, it's stopped by punishing people who harrass others.