Openly admitting to ignoring the players

[Boizinho]

Because people aren't playing it to have a complex rotation, they're playing it because they want to heal and support their group and *gasp* don't mind having downtime to their skills.

So with that said *ahem* "Bye Felicia ♡"

If you're actually playing a healer to heal in Final Fantasy XIV, you would be extremely dissatisfied too because healers BARELY heal in this game.

You seem to share the asinine view that the developers have: people will use healing skills more if they have more healing skills, and they will use DPS skills less if they have fewer DPS skills. This could not be further from the truth. 60-80% of casts in any given encounter will be the exact same nuke spell. If you're not spending over half of your time DPSing, you are massively overhealing even in Savage.

I always get the impression from opinions like yours, who are against healers having a more complex rotation at level 80 than they do at level FOUR, that you don't want to "play a healer to heal," you want to play a healer to be the laziest person in the party.

[Deceptus]

You seem to share the asinine view that the developers have: people will use healing skills more if they have more healing skills, and they will use DPS skills less if they have fewer DPS skills. This could not be further from the truth. 60-80% of casts in any given encounter will be the exact same nuke spell. If you're not spending over half of your time DPSing, you are massively overhealing even in Savage.

Pretty much this.

We have the exact same dps options from lvl 4 to lvl 80 as of now. A 30 second dot and a filler spell we cast in between 12 times.

[Boizinho]

Pretty much this.

We have the exact same dps options from lvl 4 to lvl 80 as of now. A 30 second dot and a filler spell we cast in between 12 times.

Ironically, WHM and AST start out with 18 second duration DoTs instead of 30 seconds. So a WHM's level 80 rotation is actually more shallow than their level 4 rotation. It goes from 11111112 to 1111111111112.

[Saefinn]

Because people aren't playing it to have a complex rotation, they're playing it because they want to heal and support their group and *gasp* don't mind having downtime to their skills.

So with that said *ahem* "Bye Felicia ♡"

Hmm, I don't like the implication here, because I know you've been around these healer forums for maybe roughly the same time as me. So you will know the biggest cause of complaint. You focus on the 'complex rotation' part, but that's only a solution to a problem. Yes, there are alternative solutions, but the making more complex DPS if anything is the most sensible one. Well, I'd say a mix of two things, making DPS more complex and making sure future encounters better utilise the healer kits.

People talk about the high downtime a lot and give huge numbers - sometimes backed with tangible data on how big that is and people often put "70%" as the average for talking points because it is a realistic number.

For those who are playing healers to heal and support (which I would argue alsoincludes many of those complaining) are they having that desire satisfied if they have a big and complex healing kit they don't get full use of because they only need use a healing skill for 30% of the time?

Let's go with how bad it is in things like dungeons, I got Anamnesis Anyder in a roulette the other day on my SAM. The healer DC'd after the first pull. We didn't get a replacement until just before the last boss. We managed the majority of the dungeon with Paladin, Samurai and Summoner. I feel like if we had maybe a Paladin, Red Mage, Samurai and Summoner set up it could have been an easy run with a higher overall DPS than a 2 DPS, 1 tank, 1 healer set up. So when I see things like that I feel the role of a healer if anything is undervalued.


The alternative solution is:

Up the healing requirement. Squash that 70% down to 10 or 20%, you'll find that I'll stop complaining except maybe in solo content.

To me and I think for many others it's acceptable because hey, they get a lot more to do and have more to focus on and get to appreciate the complexity of the healing kits they've already design for us because they're thinking most about how they can use it efficiently to keep people alive. You'll still get those who'll say "it's not WoW, I liked the healing/DPS hybrid concept we had going" but ultimately the biggest complaints are resolved and the complaints from the complaining right now will be reduced.


But there are a few problems:
- Healing is now harder (which is fine for me)
- Healing is now less accessible
- People start complaining because there's healers struggling to keep up
- It'd take a monumental amount of changes for the devs, because encounters and mechanics would need to be tweaked to accommodate this. Not just future ones but existing ones.


However, if we simply make the DPS more complex (and not to DRG or SMN levels or anything ridiculous like that) then we'd find the following:
- It respects existing game design
- Historic encounters can be left alone
- It's a lot less work on the devs to implement
- Healing is just as accessible as it is now.
- Healing remains exactly as it is
- People with long downtimes get more to do.
- Most content doesn't require healer DPS, so people don't have to jump in and embrace the complexity unless they're seeking to optimise DPS.

But if we were to say, take the SCH philosophy of 2.0 for DPS, it wouldn't be a combo rotation, so no pressure to finish it when there's healing to be done, but you keep DoTs topped up and throw in various beneficial moves as and when you can, so it's not actually that complicated.

It's reasons like this that the "complex rotation" idea is pushed. It's not so much that we don't want to heal and support our group like everybody else (and in a game where rDPS is how performance is measured, DPS contribution IS supporting the group), yes, some prefer the idea of a healer/DPS hybrid and started playing this game when that was an option (like me, for example) but hey, it'd be a lot easier to concede if the downtime was a lot lower because we're still having fun.

[BooPoo]

Up the healing requirement. Squash that 70% down to 10 or 20%, you'll find that I'll stop complaining except maybe in solo content.

Lol what about Sage then. If everyone needs to heal 70% of the time but sage either:

1. Can both heal and DPS during that time, then it becomes the only choice of healers.

2. Needs to focus on spamming GCD healing abilities during 70% of the time. It invalidates half of Sage's kit but most importantly, destroys Sage's identity as a healer that heals by damaging enemies.

I don't see that as a good solution for a large group of players that want green DPS tbf.

[Saefinn]

Lol what about Sage then. If everyone needs to heal 70% of the time but sage either:

1. Can both heal and DPS during that time, then it becomes the only choice of healers.

2. Needs to focus on spamming GCD healing abilities during 70% of the time. It invalidates half of Sage's kit but most importantly, destroys Sage's identity as a healer that heals by damaging enemies.

I don't see that as a good solution for a large group of players that want green DPS tbf.

Well yes, they stripped SCH a chunk of its identity, made WHM's identity redundant and watered down AST's, so what's one more, eh? I mean, heck healers don't use much of their kit most of the time anyway, so welcome to the healer experience?

Putting he facetiousness aside, in actuality, no, you wouldn't need to change how SGE heals. Because SGE's DPS kits heals people, so in a way this is where SGE ends up just adding a layer to this, if you're DPSing an enemy to heal somebody that I would say that doesn't count as downtime and counts as healing uptime. It's when you're DPSing to DPS that it is downtime. With SGE this becomes harder to measure.


However, I already acknowledged this method doesn't respect the game's design. But I state it is 'a' solution (and in the context of the "healers heal" argument, this would better fit those desires), but I do not think that it is the right solution but it is a better solution than twiddling thumbs and may result in interesting healing play. But if you want to make healers engaging with their current design, that's how you're gonna do it. And I think if people are enjoying playing their healer job, they're more amenable to that change and compromise and less likely to complain. But there are problems that I listed with this approach (and is not an exhaustive list).

Breaking up the downtime with a variety of DPS-related moves is really the most sensible way to go. Because the only thing that will change is how many abilities are available to us in our downtime and how our rDPS is balanced.

[BooPoo]

Putting he facetiousness aside, in actuality, no, you wouldn't need to change how SGE heals. Because SGE's DPS kits heals people, so in a way this is where SGE ends up just adding a layer to this, if you're DPSing an enemy to heal somebody that I would say that doesn't count as downtime and counts as healing uptime. It's when you're DPSing to DPS that it is downtime. With SGE this becomes harder to measure.

Not meaning to disapprove of your final solution, I very much want it, but just want to add another reason against upping healer uptime to 90%:

Assuming no changes to healer kits, if healers have 90% uptime but sage is the only one that's able to consistently output damage during it (aside from Assize, Star etc. since those are like 400 pot per minute) then it becomes way too OP. Sorry but I can't fathom how SGE can exist in a world where everyone needs to be a curebot with balance in mind.

[Eclipse12187]

Thank you, I fixed it. Though, the "water shield" is Divine Benison, it just looks slightly different. The slides confirmed they gave Divine Benison a charge system. Hence why the Trailer shows 2 shields being used within 30s.

They actually use 2 divine benisons AND a water shield. Benison has a flowy sound and animation but it was used twice and near the end there’s a more watery shield used on the party member.

[Allegor]

Yeah, it's what people thought would be Fluid Aura II (Flood?). Hopefully whatever that spell/ability is it replaces its spot as the lv 15 cnj quest reward, rather than leaving it empty. ARR whm is already barren enough as it is

[Axxion]

Compared to the other versions of it. Imo it is bad. They took out a lot of the things that i fell in love with it. such as the dots, pet management and the lost of the haste , aoe esuna and the learning curves. yes i do know it was pain, however there where macros that solved some of the issues with it.

Loved how i could use my fairy, placed it near the party , place a shield on it and spread that on the party. Wish selene had more due to eos had better heals, but she did have her uses. Great for during low level content with under geared tanks The thing i mad about about is that they did not put a lot of effort into it. Well it feels like it. really? we get a buff that increase movement speed and helps lowers damage we take? what stopping me from using swift cast succor and sprinting? Just a few button press.

Unless this buff also give other effects, but i doubt that.

I understand people like 5.0 i do to but it could have more, and i mean more. They could have kept bane and let it combo into art of war. that would solved that.

For those said people bye Felica and salty players( i don't understand this logic, does that mean my concerns from a job I used love is not valid no more while your are?) . Please show us the numbers. back in hw they actually showed an official census and not once they showed us what was going on.

all in all to say that i know they can do better with the sch changes and make feel better so that bother styles are relevant.

And i only speaking for myself when i say this