RIP MNK 1.x - 5.x

[ssunny2008]

Nothing wrong if monk loses more positionals. bla bla

Really, i´m so tired of this, what´s wrong?

Pick another class? "No, i like some aesthetics."
Don´t play positionals? "No, i won´t do damage or whatever else is hindering me from ignoring stuff i dislike anyway."

Man seriously... you and the most of the guys, which cry about playing positionals, don´t even play the endgame. I´m convinced that you´re not even a proper gamer or that you´ve ever played another MMORPG.
You´ve fun smashing 3 buttons and watching your character doing awesome stuff to overheat your graphic card? Fine... it´s up to you. But not everyone is like you or another positional-hater out there. There are ppl who like some form of a challenge, engaging gameplay and a bunch of movement. MNK had this always more than any other class. Don´t play MNK if you don´t like it, that´s an easy solution. Not every class is made for everyone and any content which is not called "savage / ultimate" is so hard braindead, that you don´t need to take care about the DPS anyway. Don´t use Dots, don´t play positionals, whatever.

Guys like you are the reason why so many games out there got dumb´d down into nowhere and are plagued with microtransactions or battlepass systems. "Press 1 button, getting rewards or give me the option to buy it." How do you even call that a "gaming", when everything is going to be the same? Why does FF14 even has 18 different classes?

Not every game is made for everyone. Not any class is made for everyone. It can´t be so hard to accept that.


And how do you know that summoner got fixed? Have you played it yet?
SMN is nothing but some animations you could change with anything else. Instead of a Midare, Ifrit appears and does a skill... wow... carbuncle is still there to be there. No coop or combo skills, nothing to play around with different summons or which really helps yourself or the group. Just some "finisher-moves" behind a summon animation by clicking a button.

If anything, SE should get some impressions from this scam-game about summoners: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0j5CBeJ08hw
It is atleast a real summoner game with different summons, where each of them fits a role, have active and combo skills and well, you can summon 2 at once and switch them midfight!
(Even FF11 had a real summoner compared to FF14.)

[Kahnom]

Nothing wrong if monk loses more positionals. I dont know why some monk players are so hell bent on them keeping the 6 they have. Two is enough.
Always saying it wont be monk if the positionals go etc etc. We all know that is nonsense. Squares main job should have been to remove as many positionals as possible while making the job more engaging, positionals aren't engaging the way they are implemented on monk, and in fact drives a metric ton more players away than it attracts.
What I find HILARIOUS, is that when i said take away DoTs from summoner, i got raged at like i get raged at here for saying take away the positionals, and guess what???? They took away summoner DotS, and not a single blasted complaint. Why? Because they fixed the damn job to make it more engaging to play with good QoL changes. This community is something else sometimes man, like really, unbelievable...

You don’t even play MNK and yet you spouting non-sense how the job should be ?
What a joke.

[Navnav]

No one thinks positionals are hard. I actually LOVE THEM on Dragoon. They are not something that adds a ton of skill, a bit of thought sure, but lets not call it skill. They are NOT hard to land at all, but they are for the most part, pointless.

They are mostly staying for monk, so you can breathe I guess. I would have liked them to go except on bootshine and dragon kick, but oh well. I guess a middle ground was found and it's fine.

[ssunny2008]

No one thinks positionals are hard. I actually LOVE THEM on Dragoon. They are not something that adds a ton of skill, a bit of thought sure, but lets not call it skill. They are NOT hard to land at all, but they are for the most part, pointless.

They are mostly staying for monk, so you can breathe I guess. I would have liked them to go except on bootshine and dragon kick, but oh well. I guess a middle ground was found and it's fine.

So you "love" positionals on DRG and call them overall easy to play, but you dislike them on MNK and want to get ride of them? Doesn´t make sense to me unless you call "staying behind the boss 24/7" playing positionals on DRG.

And i still higly doubt that you´ve played any serious content to call "positionals on MNK are easy". There are a bunch of melee and positional unfriendly mechanics out there and you get really busy if your burst window alines them. And mistakes from other players are not even included. Maybe you´ve some footage from your MNK performance in the current savages or atleast EX? I´m curious.

For those that play monk only for positionals. Maybe you should play another class?

It was so obvious, that a dumb statement like that coming from you, no matter if it´s just sarcasm or not.
This game only offers ONE positional-heavy class, which is MNK. You don´t like positionals? Feel free to play 1 of the others. We MNK-mains don´t have that choice.

[dezzmont]

This game only offers ONE positional-heavy class, which is MNK. You don´t like positionals? Feel free to play 1 of the others. We MNK-mains don´t have that choice.

Sam literally loses more DPS to positionals than Monk, assuming the Monk just sits in rear 24/7. Its like a 5% DPS loss if you literally never leave rear on monk. Monk currently has the second least impactful positional abilities of any melee job right now from what I understand. It was positional oriented when missing a positional dropped your combo, but right now outside of bootshine it basically doesn't matter, while SAM loses out on essentially its burst window for not hitting positionals outside of its window, and NIN missing their window will usually be a larger DPS loss than monk missing a bootshine or two in theirs.

This is part of why a Monk rework was sorta inevitable, and why the job was so confusing to new people: A huge part of its supposed identity was basically untrue and only existed to add to a job that was essentially all white noise. The actual interesting part of Monk that demanded anything of you was balancing your buffs and debuff rotations, which still appears to be in the job.

[GrumbleBeard]

Interested in the new changes. Playing monk has felt pretty much the same in pretty much every expansion except while everyone else is getting something new we get a new button to save greased lightning and lose some skills. I guess my biggest disappointment was seeing any of the old stance skills. After so long, they should all get a trait to upgrade into something else. Losing GL and those two positionals doesn't even change anything since by the end you never lose GL and your second positionals are the same as the first anyway

[Morzy]

Nothing wrong if monk loses more positionals. I dont know why some monk players are so hell bent on them keeping the 6 they have. Two is enough.
Always saying it wont be monk if the positionals go etc etc. We all know that is nonsense. Squares main job should have been to remove as many positionals as possible while making the job more engaging, positionals aren't engaging the way they are implemented on monk, and in fact drives a metric ton more players away than it attracts.
What I find HILARIOUS, is that when i said take away DoTs from summoner, i got raged at like i get raged at here for saying take away the positionals, and guess what???? They took away summoner DotS, and not a single blasted complaint. Why? Because they fixed the damn job to make it more engaging to play with good QoL changes. This community is something else sometimes man, like really, unbelievable...

I am sick of square making things easier as if we are a bunch of babies like you and others make us out to be. Do not play the class if you are so fed up with the characteristics that monk has had since 2.x (if not 1.x). If you want monk to be more like DRG and SAM which have less positionals.. then go bloody play your SAM or DRG.

[Kolsykol]

I am sick of square making things easier as if we are a bunch of babies like you and others make us out to be. Do not play the class if you are so fed up with the characteristics that monk has had since 2.x (if not 1.x). If you want monk to be more like DRG and SAM which have less positionals.. then go bloody play your SAM or DRG.

Don't bother with that guy tbh, just look at how he talks in other threads.
He plays the victim and acts like anyone who disagrees with him is like insulting him personally or something.
He at least seems to understand that what he's saying is unpopular amongst MNK mains but he always frames it like '' poor me I am going to get called a moron and be bullied for my hot take '' while at the same time talking shit about the community.

Nothing anyone says or explains to him actually sticks it all goes in one ear and out the other.
Luckily the removal of Raptor form at least comes with some justification on the devs side in that MNK is going to be busier.
Personally I still think it's kinda pointless, POSITIONALS ARE NOT DIFFICULT JUST WAT WHY ARE PEOPLE HAVING SUCH SEVERE ISSUES WITH THEM??????

But... If that's really how the devs feel and it's not going to be done overall later then I can accept it along with the rework.
It still feels totally pointless tho and I might even do them anyway it's just going to feel odd to me especially with how fast it moves.
It's not like DRG where your gcd is slow and it's more methodical.

Edit: Merged posts.

Brotherhood should just be a 60s CD imo, same with Riddle of Fire.
A 120s CD almost feels like a '' waste '' of a button to me, it's like you press it and oh great now that button is just useless for 2 whole minutes.
90s is far worse tho imo it needs to be even with the rest.

[VentVanitas]

Aside from the completely unnecessary axing of two positionals, there are other changes among the EW kit that concern me and I hope they're cleared up or rectified by the media tour:

- Why is Brotherhood 120 seconds on cooldown? I appreciate that it means there's less buttons to cram into a burst now, but I hope it's buffed accordingly for the longer cooldown.
- Why an Arm of the Destroyer replacement? I don't think anyone in particular ever complained about how it looked. I hope Blitz gives it some use outside of AoE at least.
- Riddle of Wind???

[SpeckledBurd]

Aside from the completely unnecessary axing of two positionals, there are other changes among the EW kit that concern me and I hope they're cleared up or rectified by the media tour:

- Why is Brotherhood 120 seconds on cooldown? I appreciate that it means there's less buttons to cram into a burst now, but I hope it's buffed accordingly for the longer cooldown.
- Why an Arm of the Destroyer replacement? I don't think anyone in particular ever complained about how it looked. I hope Blitz gives it some use outside of AoE at least.
- Riddle of Wind???

As long as the potency isn't massively out of place elsewhere, 120 second Brotherhood is actually an improvement. One of the issues with Brotherhood at a top end is that a 90 second burst window doesn't align with most raidbuffs since they're in 1 or 2 minute increments. This lets Monk work better with other jobs.

Riddle of Wind looks like a replacement for something at a lower level since they've gutted a decent amount of the kit at lower level to rework it. There's a possibility that the "Fists of..." still exist at lower level, but now as buffs and they get upgraded to the Riddles at later levels, however that's just speculation on my part and it could just be a replacement for something that's completely gone.

As for replacing Arm of the Destroyer with an upgrade... well they sometimes do that to throw in a trait. Since Monk seemingly has a lot more in store than the standard 80-90 3 skills and 2 traits I'm willing to look past a changed animation. Plus it's massively better than the last time they did this with Tackle Mastery which didn't even change the animation.

Overall I'm still just waiting for the liveletter. Compared to Shadowbringers/Stormblood what they've showed is really promising, there's no major red flags that I can see, and they've given us decent explanations of what's going on with nearly everything but Anatman. I'll save flipping out until then.