Stop the WoWificaton (ui mods)

[Chawan]

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That would end up a game of cat and mouse as all of those things are easily sidestepped by simply making file modifications to be something the anti cheat isn’t looking for. Kind of like what a lot of current anti cheat has to deal with. They have to constantly be scannin background processes looking for matches of known entered files, file sizes and so forth. They would also have to keep up with the modders make sure they know of the latest versions and break them. Modders often work faster and sometimes turns in to a fun game for them. And if you tune these anti cheat too much they can false flag totally normal processes. It’s kind of annoying to have to disable and sometimes completely uninstall security features on my machine just so i can play a game. I had to deal with that garbage during the days of phantasy star universe..

Besides wasn’t there talk about programs like what they would need being illegal or something where they are, or in some parts of the world?

[Sebazy]

OK, muppets. There is so much jokes here that I have no idea where to start from.

Oh this is going to be fun. I haven't done one of these in a while.

- Most games DO NOT provide you calculated data of your DPS, even your very special and important WoW does not do that, you need Add On even there to do it.

And yet, most games do a far better job of at least giving you some idea of how much you are doing so you can try and figure it out yourself. Precise timestamps, verbose and clear damage feedback, the ability to not have multiple sources of damage merged into one figure etc. WoW had all of these. FFXIV didn't. Go watch a 2.x-3.x SMN PoV and point out where they can keep a tabs on their dot damage. Spoiler: They couldn't. It wasn't even shown in the combat log. It was shown merged in with the Scrolling Text on screen and that was it. GL making any sense of that in any actual content that wasn't the Summerford training dummy.

- ToS are clear about third party tools and crying like baby or not, does not change ToS.

The ToS is also equally clear on calling people muppets FYI. Your point? Any MMO has to have an overeaching ToS to cover their backs. Obviously the extent they chose to enforce it can vary immensely.

- There are ways for SE to find out if you are using third party tools ingame and I belive they do not because for most of the years the community was pretty careful to not allow tools that ruin other players expirience, but that started to change and we may lose any possibility to use ANY kind of modifications because of it if SE decides to go with the normal approach for modern online games and add anti cheat.

This is being brought up in a UI thread because of Ultimate shenanigans in a fight that a tiny minority will ever clear regardless of how much handholding is given. Shouldn't you be raging about gathering, crafting, leveling, fate grinding, eureka farming bots instead? They have a far more significant impact on the game as a whole than anything this thread is addressing.

- You DO not need, never needed and never will need DPS metter to create rotations, become good or whatever in FF. What you need is brain to read the tooltips and dummy. If you are not sure between few rotations "Stone, Sky, Sea" have a great challanges to check what rotation works best.

Again, go look at SMN in ARR and tell me you could optimise that beyond 'muh fester crits' without someway to accurately understand what your dot damage was. Dots were much more important for many jobs back then and SE set the bar by making it comically difficult to track what they were doing.

- All battles are completed by minimum two groups in Square enix without any third party tools before release, so the argument that you need them to complete anything in FF is a childish joke. I was personally in a group cleaning savages on Minimal Item Level for two years and you can imagine how many "data mining" I was using to clear content on PS4, we never had a battle that we were unable to clear.

Yoshida has clarified how internal testing is handled many times over the years. I suggest you go have a read. And grats I guess? Savage doesn't even come close to the the complexity and precision that this Ultimate seems to require, especially not the jokes we've had in the last few expansions.

Go on and cry like a babies about your addons for a bit longer and SE will end up with anti cheat and you will forget about all your NSFW mods too

Or maybe SE could actually spend some of the 200 mill earnings to actually improve their UI and offer players some basic level of feedback so that they don't feel so obligated to step foot onto the slippery add-on slope

[Saraide]

Besides wasn’t there talk about programs like what they would need being illegal or something where they are, or in some parts of the world?

That part of the statement always felt like an excuse to me. Tons of games force you to follow their strict anti cheat programs and are available world wide. Not that I'm in favor of starting that arms race in ff14 but I have no doubt in my mind that SE could legally do it if they really wanted to.

[Deedlit]

Imagine wanting a game UI with features that were outdated in 2010.

[Chawan]

That part of the statement always felt like an excuse to me. Tons of games force you to follow their strict anti cheat programs and are available world wide. Not that I'm in favor of starting that arms race in ff14 but I have no doubt in my mind that SE could legally do it if they really wanted to.

Idk I just remembered watching a video with them talking about it. It could very well be an excuse because they just dun wanna.. I personally am impartial to the whole thing.. so long as i can still play in linux idc really. I just tend to post when i think i can add information.

[Shurrikhan]

there is now a super popular ui modification.

So and so has made for themselves a more intuitive-looking user interface than I have! Ban them! The sickness must be purged!

Feels like there's be a good dozen or so threads with roughly the same call to action, yet the only one of them to make a lick of sense was the one about actual cheaters in PvP.


More seriously, though, (A) the game should straight-up have better UI or customization options and (B), no, lacking that cleaner UI is not a "significant disadvantage".

Personally, I hate the look of ElvUI, which I would guess is the "WoWified" interface appearance you're referring to; it's blocky, spends far more space on personal and target HP bars, overly separates your DoT timers from your own buffs (Disciplined Fist, etc.), which are things that are far more often considered together, within a given job's rotation, than in WoW.

That "WoWified" interface, frankly... is not great for XIV. What's good, though, is just being able to set up one's UI as personally works best in this context, for the given player, such as via this heretical addon you mention. I'd far rather it light a fire under the dev team to improve their own UI and/or customization options than see it banned.

[georgiams]

It isn't an option for those on console and I expect console players to only go up in numbers as PS5's become easier to get and the inevitable xbox version next year. Even taking the console argument away, SE has historically done a great job making addons not feel necessary to make good progress. But the more people who use them, the more people expect others to use them and it becomes a gatekeeping issue to progress in high end content. I know it for a fact, I've seen it in other games and it's already becoming a problem that will only grow. Don't use damage meters? No invite. Don't use addons to automark things? No invite. It's time to put the foot down.

What game wont invite you if you don't have a damage meter or addons for automarking? That's ridiculous, it has nothing to do with performance.

[georgiams]

kind of a cope, but I don't see how it affects to you, wow will probably die soon.
it's the streamers own business if they want to potentially get in trouble lol.

WoW never dies. Let's be real here.

[CaptainFishSticks]

Man, I just want Square-Enix to develop official chat bubbles. I can't have a conversation in any public space full of people without completely losing track of who I'm talking to because there's no way to tell who is saying what without physically looking at their faces.

And also to not reset that chat log to the bottom of the page every time someone posts something so I can actually read a long response.

[Grebeny]

And yet, most games do a far better job of at least giving you some idea of how much you are doing so you can try and figure it out yourself. Precise timestamps, verbose and clear damage feedback, the ability to not have multiple sources of damage merged into one figure etc. WoW had all of these. FFXIV didn't. Go watch a 2.x-3.x SMN PoV and point out where they can keep a tabs on their dot damage. Spoiler: They couldn't

Spoiler, you don't need to, the system was easy "if skill with Cooldown is not pressed, you do bad job" too hard for you?

The ToS is also equally clear on calling people muppets FYI. Your point?

Muppets is fluffy, not offence, and we play FF, most of the people are fluffy around.

This is being brought up in a UI thread because of Ultimate shenanigans in a fight that a tiny minority will ever clear regardless of how much handholding is given.

- Allows you to see player hitbox
- Can automatically find and relay hunt mobs
- Condenses combos to one button
- Allows macros to be daisy-chained
- Allows mouseover targeting without macro delay
- Gives player realtime information about mobs in PoTD
- Shows different damage types visually (magic/physical))
- PvP auto targeting of Ninja when LB is done.
- Auto heal when someone HP droppes bellow given %.
- Auto targeting enemies bellow 50% and auto LB on them with ninja.

And yes, bots are bannable, they are getting banned all of the time, the difference is nobody stand up for them as a white knight pretending they don't understand the ToS to protect them.

Again, go look at SMN in ARR and tell me you could optimise that.

Especially when DPS metters don't actually provite perfect information on the matter too. The DPS you provide to the party with your personal buffs is really poorly calculated, how do you sleep with this information?

Savage doesn't even come close to the the complexity and precision that this Ultimate

Actually savages and Ultimates are not that different on difficulty if we are talking about DPS specifically. Ultimates are hard because you need to survive 15+ minutes without doing mistakes.

Or maybe SE could actually spend some of the 200 mill earnings to actually improve their UI

Lazy players will go to DPS metter always even after "improving" the 100% customizable UI. If you want "basic" feedback, just turn on only your numbers on enemy hit. Players were not feeling obligated to use addons, but as someone earlier said, when some start using it, others follow. "World first race" grouos on first day were not using logs, except few. In the next days more and more started, because Yes, exactly, ADVANTAGE. There are party finders with "logs" in the name, suggesting that they will not take players without DPS metter installed.