Stop the WoWificaton (ui mods)

[MintnHoney]

Damage metres are effecting other players and the community . "why arent you doing enough damage?" Additionally its giving you advantages over others.

You wanna know how I know that you're not doing enough, even though I don't have parsers or particularly care whether or not you're doing enough?
Because you're last in the aggro order, that's how.

[LittleImp]

Because you arent supposed to look into the gaming code / damage numbers of others.

Actually, the game itself explicitly offers us this data in the combat tab.

And i dont even get why players need it. Are you guys so damn bad at the game that you need extra damage metres like that to display yourself if you are bad at your damn rotation and equipment?

The impact of certain niche optimizations can be hard to determine without access to data. The game actually provides the data itself; Parsing is simply a way of taking that already available data and formatting it in a more human-friendly way, hence YoshiP's various statements comparing parsing to using Excel.

Additionally, for newer players it can be difficult to get a clear gauge on exactly how well you are performing in comparison to more experienced players. Parsing can help you assess yourself, and focus on areas where your play can be improved. It's also a way for players to share fight-specific execution without having to record / upload every single pull; If you wanted to see how a high-end Black Mage optimizes around a certain movement heavy mechanic, you can simply review their log timeline and see exactly how they're playing.

Just play the damn game and not the gaming code and numbers. Enjoy it for what it is, and dont try to change it.
Sorry, but its pathetic. If you want to work with numbers all day long you guys can do my job, i am working with numbers and Excel sheets all day long..

I have zero doubt you are more toxic than most of the hypothetical people you are insulting in this post. Putting people down for putting effort into something they enjoy is really gross.

[Tonkra]

Actually, the game itself explicitly offers us this data in the combat tab.

It doesnt offer you the option to sum up all the damage of yourself or your party members..
to track like if you are controlling what your party members are doing is personally not a community friendly behaviour.

The impact of certain niche optimizations can be hard to determine without access to data.

"Without" data, you sound like me - in real life i am working as a performance marketing manager handling tons of data and numbers every day.

You sure you are playing the GAME or the numbers? Shouldnt people play to enjoy RP / the world / the experience / the battle instead of DATA.. that we shouldnt have access to? (in that form)
Just saying.

Additionally, for newer players it can be difficult to get a clear gauge on exactly how well you are performing in comparison to more experienced players.

I wonder how i ever could feel that i have to improve myself at certain points without a parsing tool...monitors controls what i and how well other players are "performing". so i dont actually know how that is "needed"... everyone feels if they perform poorly. There are tons of tutorials on youtube how to do your rotations, if you dont have a brain. But you dont need a dps metre for that and you dont have the right to give yourself that advantage over other players (read the EULA)

And yes, i am "aggressive" against this kind of behaving. Since its against the game rules which we complied with (the EULA is there for a reason)... and it gives you advantages over other players as well.
And i personally dont want the community which WoW has (due to things like these, that surely play a role in it)

If you cant accept how the game was designed or you can not accept the EULA quit the game, easy as that.

[Menriq]

It doesnt offer you the option to sum up all the damage of yourself or your party members..
to track like if you are controlling what your party members are doing is personally not a community friendly behaviour.

In the video, Yoshi-P actually gives an example of those who know how to do it could take the combat log, put it in Excel, and have macros parse out the data for you to do the exact same thing. So sure, you could do the exact same thing as ACT if you wanted to.

You sure you are playing the GAME or the numbers? Shouldnt people play to enjoy RP / the world / the experience instead of DATA.. that we shouldnt have access to? (in that form)
Just saying.

I keep score when I golf. Am I playing the game or the numbers when I am trying to improve on my own personal performance by improving my handicap? Taking that hobby into this one, perhaps I enjoy seeing the numbers and my personal performance improve.

I was once a new player myself, too. And i didnt need a "cheating" tool which controls what i and how well other players are "performing".
I wonder how i ever could feel that i have to improve myself at certain points without a parsing tool...

And yes, i am "aggressive" against this kind of behaving. Since its against the game rules which we complied with... and it gives you advantages over other players as well.
And i personally dont want the community which WoW has (due to things like these, that surely play a role in it)

Just to confirm. If I take my combat log, and do exactly as Yoshi-P in regards to Excel, you have no issues right? Because I am using the data the game provides in the combat log, and manually calculating everything. If you say no, then it's not ACT you are against and it's also not against the game rules.

[LittleImp]

Someone else already effectively rebutted most of your points, but I'm going to throw in my two cents.

Parsing virtually only comes up as a topic of discussion in premade parties, due to this games stringent harassment policy. Parsing is actually incredibly widespread; You're constantly placed in parties with people who use parsers, you just aren't aware simply because almost noone talks about it publicly. There is no threat of a growing problem around parsers, as SE's harassment policy has proven to be extremely effective in curtailing parser related toxicity.

"Without" data, you sound like me - in real life i am working as a performance marketing manager handling tons of data and numbers every day.

You sure you are playing the GAME or the numbers? Shouldnt people play to enjoy RP / the world / the experience / the battle instead of DATA.. that we shouldnt have access to? (in that form)
Just saying.

I work with data professionally as well, including frequently writing programs which parse and convert between various data formats. Fortunately, someone else has already written comprehensive software for us on this game, and we can simply reap the benefits as the end-user. Again I'd like to emphasize, the game gives us access to this data already, it's simply the role of the parser to ingest that data, present it in a way that is human-friendly, and help us draw conclusions about said data.

You are not the grand arbiter of what people are allowed to find fun. People are allowed to like different things.

I wonder how i ever could feel that i have to improve myself at certain points without a parsing tool...monitors controls what i and how well other players are "performing". so i dont actually know how that is "needed"... everyone feels if they perform poorly. There are tons of tutorials on youtube how to do your rotations, if you dont have a brain.

I've spent hundreds of hours teaching other players how to raid, and I can emphatically tell you that the vast majority of people are incapable of assessing their own performance internally, especially when they are newer to the game. If you have no established framework for what 'good' feels like, it can be pretty difficult to assess how you are actually doing. Analytical tools aren't necessary, but they can be really helpful for some players.

And yes, i am "aggressive" against this kind of behaving ...

If you cant accept how the game was designed or you can not accept the EULA quit the game, easy as that.

Calling people pathetic, stupid, or telling them to quit the game is also against the games ToS. You seem very selective about which parts of the games ToS you follow.

[ForteNightshade]

It doesnt offer you the option to sum up all the damage of yourself or your party members..
to track like if you are controlling what your party members are doing is personally not a community friendly behaviour.

In a team based game, my party member's performance impacts my overall gameplay. You know what isn't a "community friendly behavior"? Players who have absolutely no idea what they're doing jumping into Savage and 6-7 other players have to put in a greater effort to push through.

"Without" data, you sound like me - in real life i am working as a performance marketing manager handling tons of data and numbers every day.

You sure you are playing the GAME or the numbers? Shouldnt people play to enjoy RP / the world / the experience / the battle instead of DATA.. that we shouldnt have access to? (in that form)
Just saying.

Different strokes for different folks, my dude. I'm someone who enjoys chasing numbers or "data" if you prefer. I spent hours combing through logs to see exactly what better players than I do and attempt to replicate their performance all for a pretty number. And you know what, I had tons of fun figuring it out and learning from them. What I do doesn't impact you in any way. I'm not using this data to dunk on other players but for my own enjoyment and improvement.

I wonder how i ever could feel that i have to improve myself at certain points without a parsing tool...monitors controls what i and how well other players are "performing". so i dont actually know how that is "needed"... everyone feels if they perform poorly. There are tons of tutorials on youtube how to do your rotations, if you dont have a brain. But you dont need a dps metre for that and you dont have the right to give yourself that advantage over other players (read the EULA)

And yes, i am "aggressive" against this kind of behaving. Since its against the game rules which we complied with (the EULA is there for a reason)... and it gives you advantages over other players as well.
And i personally dont want the community which WoW has (due to things like these, that surely play a role in it)

If you cant accept how the game was designed or you can not accept the EULA quit the game, easy as that.

You do realize all those rotations on YouTube were made using ACT, yes? Every single guide you come across uses parse data to determine the best rotation. Boss timelines you find on google come from FFlogs. Basically, anything and everything that gives you information on how to play the game better comes from third party programs. Even our materia melding is all determined through parsers. Frankly, a lot of this information should be accessible in game but that's another argument.

At the end of the day, Yoshida acknowledges the raid community's preference for ACT and while he dislikes it, he allows it to exist in a grey area. Don't harass others and they don't care. You just won't be invited to the Media Tour lol

[Roeshel]

snip

Yeah, you are wrong.

You do have the right to have numbers shown in front of you calculated. It is a basic feature in most games. It is QoL upgrade for many.

I will not quit because I want to play. That's not how this works. SE gives some general guidelines (aka ToS) to follow and ultimately they decide when to stop providing their services to you. I am pretty sure they can terminate any account and come up with a valid excuse saying person X violated Y rule of the guidelines dating 3 years ago and that's the end of the discussion.

Parsing is part of the game for many people and they know that. They don't want to make it official to avoid stressing their casual player base but they also don't want to remove parsing from the game in order to keep the majority of the raiding player base in the game. There is nothing more boring than repeatedly clearing the same content without being able to track your progress. I don't know how people are doing that but I stopped doing it after completing ARR MSQ. Soon after The Praetorium. And initially, I was wondering why it is not a default feature of the game already. I was doing a lot of Frontline roulettes and there at the end screen, you can check your own DPS and the DPS of everyone else and that makes perfect sense. I couldn't do that only in PvE content automatically if I am relying on the game to do the calculations instead of a third-party app. I found it extremely confusing at first to the point where I had to google "How to check DPS in PvE content FFXIV". I didn't even need to get to level cap content or savage content to want that information. And that information is actually vital in some parts of this game, yet the game refuses to provide it to you directly.

I don't get people saying "you don't have the right to do know your DPS, you will get banned". In my mind it sounds like "I don't have the right to know my grades, we will kick you out of school". It's just a bizarre concept for me. It's legit the same thing with different words. "You couldn't beat the enrage timer" = "You made a lot of mistakes on your test". Thank you, I learned a lot.

everyone feels if they perform poorly.

Completely incorrect statement. Poor performance is an entirely subjective criteria in the mind of people when they lack actual data to draw conclusions from.

[GaiusDrakon]

How are you affected by UI mods?

They're just a Karen.

[redheadturk]

My issue is that them cracking down on UI mods [which I honestly don't give a dang if people use, I don't raid so I have no dog in that race.] they would crack down on texture mods and that is one game I do have skin in.

[Conundrum]

Don't fall for the troll people....