Idea: Commendation Coins

[ItMe]

This is a great idea, but what about the poor DPS? I'm half-kidding, half not. Any coin prices would have to be low enough that DPS don't get priced out. I've been playing for years and have only received 128 commendations since I haven't played a tank or healer since ARR, and only then when I had a wild hair to level all my jobs to 50.

Perhaps it would change the way people com each other.
If not, they could always weigh the number of coins you get based on your class. 1 com doesn't have to equal 1 coin.

[Breakbeat]

Yeah, agreed. Personally, even playing as DPS, I find it hard to have a reason to give commendations to DPS. I... I don't know how much one is actually contributing, since - for the most part and commonly - there are no DPS meters to look at. In any given dungeon I run, I could be doing 99% of the DPS, 1% of the DPS, or it could be any split in-between. Did the run feel slow? I dunno, it's my first time through for most of these places. Even in the future, if the run is five minutes longer or shorter, there's really no way to chalk that up to 'awesome DPS' unless we refer back to those pesky meters I mentioned.

The tank or heals doing their job satisfactorily is obvious to the whole group; a DPS doing their job means, what, the duty completion time was acceptable? The completion time was quick? We're already finishing with 75 or 85 minutes left on that timer. It's difficult to quantify.

It's a cool system, I suppose, but it's a bit broke. I've begun to give commendations to DPS solely because they are, in fact, DPS, and I know how much less frequently they'll get commendations.

Plus, and I know I am still leveling up, but folks just bail straight out of the instance before I can even hit ESC and skip a cutscene... and if I want to look at the loot and do rolls first, then forget it. Everyone else is gone by the time I click 'greed' on two greens.

I think it would be cool if I could possibly think for two seconds about who deserves it, then hand it out regardless of whether the person exited the instance or not.

[Jojoya]

The more reasons you create for players to get commendations, the more they award them for the wrong reasons and the more bad mentors the game gets.

Remove commendations from the mentor system requirements and I wouldn't object to turning commendations into a currency.

But it would also be a system subject to abuse. Get your friends coordinated to solo queue for the same duty at the same time so you could "win-trade" commendations with each other, as an example. Right now, there's no reason to do it unless you're trying to help a friend to get the last few commendations they need for their BK crown. Add more rewards to the system, and it will happen frequently.

I think it would be cool if I could possibly think for two seconds about who deserves it, then hand it out regardless of whether the person exited the instance or not.

You'd be more likely to get the chance to think about it if by sticking around, the player might get something they want from it. Right now people don't stick around because they weren't there to get commendations in the first place.

[ItMe]

But it would also be a system subject to abuse. Get your friends coordinated to solo queue for the same duty at the same time so you could "win-trade" commendations with each other, as an example. Right now, there's no reason to do it unless you're trying to help a friend to get the last few commendations they need for their BK crown. Add more rewards to the system, and it will happen frequently.

Honestly... if that's the worst it could get abused that's kinda small potatoes (said one Lala to another). I'd deal with friends slowly gifting each other coins for a temporary buff to beast tribe reputation and the like if it means we can even have this nifty coin system at all.

[Liam_Harper]

but there's no denying that we all love getting commendations as recognition for our efforts. It's an ingenious system, and I think every MMO should have something like it. However, I think the reward system currently in place could be improved.

Hard disagree.

Commendations are a joke and rarely go to the player who performed the best. They go to the best glam, random tank/heal, the player who plays a class you like, someone who remembered Peleton exists, 0 dps healbots and so on. I don't blame the players either, random dungeon sprouts just aren't qualified to judge who put in the best effort or contributed most to the team, especially when any metrics regarding performance is carefully hidden in this game.

Comms could serve well as a "this player was friendly" token of appreciation, but tying them to mentorship was already a terrible idea, never mind adding rewards to that too.

[Breakbeat]

You'd be more likely to get the chance to think about it if by sticking around, the player might get something they want from it. Right now people don't stick around because they weren't there to get commendations in the first place.

Fair enough and true, if they don't want one, it doesn't matter whether or not I give them one. For my own personal pleasure, I'd still like to be able to give a commendation to the person who deserved it, regardless of whether or not they stick around. /shrug

By the same token, I literally don't want a commendation just because I'm the only one left who didn't exit. I can earn enough commendations via actual effort (communication, good vibes, etc.) to get the achievements or titles or vanity stuff that's available.

The intentions behind this system are honorable and positive. In practice, though, it doesn't work properly. You've got the things I brought up, and the points you brought up, either of which negate the intent. DPS can't normally demonstrate that they actually deserve a commendation, and the people that end up receiving them are just whoever's left in the instance last, or, indeed...

They go to the best glam, random tank/heal, the player who plays a class you like, someone who remembered Peleton exists, 0 dps healbots and so on.

[Fyrebrand]

This is a great idea, but what about the poor DPS? I'm half-kidding, half not.

Perhaps it would change the way people com each other. If not, they could always weigh the number of coins you get based on your class. 1 com doesn't have to equal 1 coin.

This is a toughie, to be sure. I know DPS tend to (somewhat unfairly) get less commendations, but if you implement a system where DPS get more rewards for doing the same thing I fear it could provoke backlash. Some people might refuse to comm DPS out of spite, or simply adopt the impression that DPS don't need to be commended as often because of it.

I think it would be cool if I could possibly think for two seconds about who deserves it, then hand it out regardless of whether the person exited the instance or not.

I'm with you! It sucks when you want to commend a specific person, only to find they've left the group. Obviously the game still knows who you were grouped with, and the party chat logs are still there -- I don't see why they can't just keep the full party list available in the commendations window.

The more reasons you create for players to get commendations, the more they award them for the wrong reasons

I think people should grant commendations for whatever reason they want to. Whether the player performed exceptionally, or was helpful in explaining mechanics, or was just fun and pleasant to have around, or they were a newbie who was honestly trying to learn and had a good attitude, it's not that important. We're not voting for the next world leader here, it's essentially just giving somebody a cookie. In fact, forget the whole idea of Commendation Coins, from now on it's Commendation Cookies!

Remove commendations from the mentor system requirements and I wouldn't object to turning commendations into a currency.

I mean, I've never engaged with the Novice Network or Mentors, and every anecdote I've heard about it has been negative or toxic in some way. Do we really need this system at all? I think people are perfectly capable of figuring things out, using Google, or just asking around in game. We have plenty of friendly players who are willing to help out newbies, and I'd wager most of them aren't even Mentors or seek to become one.

it would also be a system subject to abuse. Get your friends coordinated to solo queue for the same duty at the same time so you could "win-trade" commendations with each other, as an example. Right now, there's no reason to do it unless you're trying to help a friend to get the last few commendations they need for their BK crown. Add more rewards to the system, and it will happen frequently.

Does this really work reliably? I feel like you can easily just not wind up in the same instance as your friends, and even if you do, now you're running some dungeon that at least some of you really don't need and wasting a lot of time. If this became a widely-used exploit, how about if you can't give a commendation to anybody on your Friends list or who is in your FC?

[ItMe]

This is a toughie, to be sure. I know DPS tend to (somewhat unfairly) get less commendations, but if you implement a system where DPS get more rewards for doing the same thing I fear it could provoke backlash. Some people might refuse to comm DPS out of spite, or simply adopt the impression that DPS don't need to be commended as often because of it.

Ah frick, thats a good point.
This is a toughie to be sure.

[Jojoya]

I mean, I've never engaged with the Novice Network or Mentors, and every anecdote I've heard about it has been negative or toxic in some way. Do we really need this system at all? I think people are perfectly capable of figuring things out, using Google, or just asking around in game. We have plenty of friendly players who are willing to help out newbies, and I'd wager most of them aren't even Mentors or seek to become one.

Google search only works if you know the right keywords to use and if the sources it directs you to are current and reputable. I just started a new FC and one of the new players who joined was talking about how they were working hard to get Archer to 15 so they would be able to unlock Black Mage once their Thaumaturge reaches 30. I closed my eyes, internally sighed "oh no" then said "stop, you don't need to". "But this guide I found online said..." "It's outdated. The game has changed."

A player resource to turn to is generally going to be better (assuming you don't end up with a troll). Active players have current information and frequently can bridge the terminology gap through shared game experiences. They can also recommend things the new player may not even realize exist and so wouldn't know to search.

The idea behind the Mentor system is great. Theoretically, having the Mentor icon enabled means "Hi, you can come to me with your questions about the game". New players can talk to those individuals instead of filling up shout chat or bothering someone who doesn't care to help.

The mentor system isn't working well because there are people who are joining for the rewards, not because they're interested in helping others. Some like to say "I'm helping fill queues" but the reality is that roulettes are filling the queues for everything but EX trials and the ones who are "filling queues" will drop if placed into an EX via Mentor Roulette.

Remove the rewards from the system and those who enjoy helping others will continue to join, while it will rid the system of those clogging up the system who only care about the rewards. The rewards can always stay in the game through other means. The mount could be moved to completing 4000 roulettes in general instead of 2000 Mentor Roulettes, as an example. That way those who have already been working toward it will still get credit from the Mentor roulettes they've already completed. Leave the crown attached to earning 1500 commendations since commendations are more about vanity than anything else. It's very fitting with the number of players who want it solely for vanity's sake.