Increasing number of players using 3rd party tools

[Ayuhra]

They've never really been a big part of this games culture.

Add ons are a MASSIVE part of WoWs culture, though, and the WoW community is transitioning to FFXIV in not small numbers. Since there's nothing really stopping the use of add ons in this game, besides some mild inconvenience and an official/unofficial stance against them, I could see a culture shift happening.

Extremely important difference here is WoW has had addons since forever, it's always been compatible with them. And starting around Wrath of the Lich King nearly everyone had Deadly Boss Mods which Ion has said he now designs around since top guilds will of course have DBM.

In other words WoW's encounters are designed with DBM in mind (doable without but much more doable with). That sort of thing will never happen here.

[kaynide]

They've never really been a big part of this games culture.

Add ons are a MASSIVE part of WoWs culture, though, and the WoW community is transitioning to FFXIV in not small numbers. Since there's nothing really stopping the use of add ons in this game, besides some mild inconvenience and an official/unofficial stance against them, I could see a culture shift happening.

While FF devs have mostly been hands off as long as plugins aren’t disruptive, there is a clear stance on use of 3rd party stuff. Since the majority of SE’ JP players are console based, they will absolutely protect that plug-in free environment if necessary.

Not to say there will be some massive threat or whatever… just that WoW players could very well be in for a rude awakening if they get too carried away, especially streamers who might not even realize their breaking rules. (As in they didn’t really read ToS or just think FF doesn’t care about 3rd party apps)

Like they don’t care if you alt tab to use google. They similarly wouldn’t care if you did texture swaps (like replacing your map files with highlighted areas, but if you started showing it off on a stream….could be bad.

[Penthea]

They've never really been a big part of this games culture.

Add ons are a MASSIVE part of WoWs culture, though, and the WoW community is transitioning to FFXIV in not small numbers. Since there's nothing really stopping the use of add ons in this game, besides some mild inconvenience and an official/unofficial stance against them, I could see a culture shift happening.

I do wish more WoW players would try to use the ui that is given to them instead of going straight to using add-ons. Sure if someone uses the base ui a lot and feels something is missing then go ahead and get it. However I have seen quite a lot who search for add-ons when they barely have started the game, complaining it looks too different to what they're used to...of course it looks different. IT'S A DIFFERENT GAME. I was a hardcore player in WoW and I can use the base ui of FFXIV just fine. All I had to do was get used to a new game. It's not complicated.

The worst is when I see someone who has add-ons that actively hide important things in the ui. I saw an ex-WoW player streaming and their ui was set up in a way that they could only see three buffs/debuffs on each party member...if they ever heal they will quickly find out what a terrible idea that is. Sigh. I saw someone else hide their enemy list and then complain that they can't see the castbars of anything that isn't their target lol.

I just want players to give the ui a chance and give themselves a chance to get used to it instead of immediately thinking something is wrong with it for the simple fact that it looks different.

[Avidria]

They've never really been a big part of this games culture.

Add ons are a MASSIVE part of WoWs culture, though, and the WoW community is transitioning to FFXIV in not small numbers. Since there's nothing really stopping the use of add ons in this game, besides some mild inconvenience and an official/unofficial stance against them, I could see a culture shift happening.

Eh, people have been coming here from WoW for years. There's just more folks now.

The difference is that WoW is designed with add-ons in mind, and FFXIV is not.

And, admittedly this is just my personal opinion, WoW's base UI is hot ugly spiced garbage. It's not half as customizable as I'd like, a lot of the defaults just don't look good, and the font scaling options leave a lot to be desired. I have godawful eyesight and had to spend FAR too much time just trying to find an add-on that would change WoW's quest text into something I could read without leaning in and squinting at my screen. I had to get an add-on to make the chat log text bigger too.

I don't have that problem in FF. Partly because the font they use in the quest log is actually readable, but also in large part because it already has a lot of customization and scaling options built in.

Most of my add-ons in WoW weren't even really oriented toward combat at all, outside of the small handful that also make a pretty darn big difference in raiding (even then I only used a handful... Dbm, decursive, and details were all I really needed beyond basic UI stuff). It was mostly cosmetic and fun stuff anyway, like transmog and achievement trackers, rare spawn maps, adding coordinates to the map, etc etc.

I don't use add-ons here because I don't need to.

[Imoye]

Add ons are a MASSIVE part of WoWs culture, though, and the WoW community is transitioning to FFXIV in not small numbers. Since there's nothing really stopping the use of add ons in this game, besides some mild inconvenience and an official/unofficial stance against them, I could see a culture shift happening.

Add-ons in WoW have been a massive detriment to the game as a whole. Actually, a lot of people are advocating their removal (Asmongold for example who said it was very freeing to play FFXIV and not having to install add-ons). If you want to raid in WoW, you are required to install various add-ons or you won't even be allowed to raid with a guild without. You're also making life difficult yourself because every fight is designed around add-ons. The lesson we have from WoW is that add-ons are nice on paper but eventually they turn into a crutch and become required third-party installs. It also creates segregation between players who may or may not want to use add-ons.

That's not okay and not something we want in FFXIV.

[drtasteyummy]

[...] Actually, a lot of people are advocating their removal (Asmongold for example who said [...]

Absolute state of why devs almost never listen

[Puremallace]

They've been in use since coil.

Nothing has changed.


The only ones people got real up in arms were the radars for hunts. That really pissed people off, and rightfully so.

Basically this. Square Enix pretends like noone is using them and chooses not enforce their own TOS so everything falls under grey area as long as it does not end up with harassment or hacking. FF14 does not have built in addon support but it does have plug ins and overlays.

[Dogempire]

They've been in use since coil.

Nothing has changed.


The only ones people got real up in arms were the radars for hunts. That really pissed people off, and rightfully so.

If I recall correctly there was also a tool at the start of Shadowbringers that automatically placed markers for safe spots from certain mechanics that people were using to basically trivialize content by having a tool read the game for you and tell you what to do, and they ended up patching that out by not letting you update markers after the start of a fight

[ForteNightshade]

If I recall correctly there was also a tool at the start of Shadowbringers that automatically placed markers for safe spots from certain mechanics that people were using to basically trivialize content by having a tool read the game for you and tell you what to do, and they ended up patching that out by not letting you update markers after the start of a fight

Not quite. Paisley Park is the tool in question that got so much attention. It didn't automatically place markers but rather could save an unlimited number of presets that you could then alt-tab to and swap placements. The backlash it received was honestly ridiculously overblown because it didn't impact TPS' World First clear in the slightest. All it did was save the SCH having to replace markers constantly, which they did during downtime anyway.

Now there were other programs that could auto place markers but Paisley is what caused the backlash.

[Arabellez]

Not quite. Paisley Park is the tool in question that got so much attention. It didn't automatically place markers but rather could save an unlimited number of presets that you could then alt-tab to and swap placements. The backlash it received was honestly ridiculously overblown because it didn't impact TPS' World First clear in the slightest. All it did was save the SCH having to replace markers constantly, which they did during downtime anyway.

Now there were other programs that could auto place markers but Paisley is what caused the backlash.

It isn't overblown. It gave advantages. ACT and Paisley are different. ACT just calculate numbers, Paisley literally helps you perform better by helping you place markers faster, during a mechanic that matters the most.