How fitting

[Sqwall]

It's too late to deny the fact after you look at the patch note and you see what WAR community asked for has been granted. It is just not your wish that has been granted.

I have been playing FF since they're just a pixel 2nd game long before Yoshi and You lot came and twisted it.

WARRIOR NEVER HAVE LIFE DRAIN ABILITY BEFORE. IT ONLY HAPPEN BECAUSE YOSHI THE WOW FAN CORRUPTED FINAL FANTASY LEGACY THAT CREATED BY HIRONOBU SAKAGUCHI THE FATHER OF FINAL FANTASY AND YASUMI MATSUNO THE GENIUS!

You said you want to share the power but you can't even stand being behind GNB by 500 potency?

WAR's dps even beat PLD's dps in Diamond EX. PLD Never came close to be a god like WAR in this patch. Ask around.

I can contest to this. PLD doesn't even touch WAR DPS in Diamond EX

[Sqwall]

PLD changes I would love to see in 6.0:
Sheltron his a 30 second duration with maximum of 1 min. Oath is basically useless unless I have something to spend it on. So for 50 oath and 6 seconds of blocking is kinda kattywhompus exchange.

PLD magic phase is...lackluster and doesn't have anything CLOSE to what the other tanks have. Holy spirt can't hold a candle to continuation or Inner Release. It just lacks punch and feels ultimately weak. Confieor feels ok

[DaulBan]

snip

I don't know if I'd necessarily frame my complaints about WAR the same way you have, but I do hope we get some variety back in our kit. The Shb iteration isn't exactly my favourite.

So having dev answered to your beck and call since 5.2 isn't enough? WAR in this patch is only less than 500 in dps behind GNB but defensive kit is far far FAR superior because the Life Drain and Convalescent it took from DRK and PLD. Warrior do not deserve to have DRK and PLD iconic ability in the first place.

I don't know if I'd describe Conva as being PLD's iconic ability bud.

[Voidedge_Ragna]

My problem with warrior is how it feels like a gutted drk ... its to similar in playstyle and yes there is obviously differences but the base idea remains very similar

Lets start with this, both classes have a dmg buff they somewhat juggle, both in a very simplistic way
War has 4 combo skills, Drk has 3 and both have a 2 step aoe ... this is pretty much the same across all tanks and is fine but other similar things are not fine
Wars center arround the idea of Inner Releases and Fell cleave as its the main burst, for drk its virtually the same.

Inner Release = Delirium
Fell Cleave = Blood spiller
Decimate = Quietus

So its comes down to what else is there ... and this is where war has a problem

Onslaught which is a dmg down unless its used during inner Release
Upheaval which is pretty good all around

What does Drk have to make up for those?
Edge of Darkness/Shadow
Flood of Darkness/Shadow
Salted Earth
Plunge
Carve and Spit
Abyssal Drain
Living Shadow

So both tanks try to get as many Bloodspiller/Cleaves out as possible and align it with a raid window but wars idea is like "omg i can spam my most powerful move and have it crit and direct hit" but now Drk has the very same buff (yes it does not crit and direct but the idea is the same)

Which makes war play ... slow, there's hardly any weaving, War feels slow and not as satisfying. I was war main from 2.0 till 4.5 and it was my first job to 80 ... now? My tank prio goes Pld>Drk>Gnb>War. All tanks have a fun mechanic or toolkit ... wars is Inner Release and if i want that ill play drk which has more ogcd.

Maybe its just me but it bothers me that the tank buster mitigation war has ... which is Raw Intuition but its usually not worth to use as nascent flash would heal you for more which makes Raw Intuition useless you might as well merge them or upgrade into them via trait.

The War toolkit needs to change, or we accept that its basically a starter tank with less buttons and no own identity.

[Ozalius]

It's not about damage, it's about having half assed new skill because "well, warrior balance is alright, we don't need to work on it much, just make it easier", and making warrior easier for them, is making the job more boring to play, and losing 10 IQ during the same patch.

[Shurrikhan]

Onslaught which is a dmg down unless its used during inner Release

Prior to Enhanced Infuriation, its actually a very faint dps increase, iirc. Even after, it's a smaller dps loss than its closest analog, Gyoten (another 10s CD gauge-spending gap-closer). That also means you have an actual gap-closer, whereas Plunge is to be spent, both charges, inside raid buff (i.e., Trick Attack) windows.

Inner Release = Delirium
Fell Cleave = Blood spiller
Decimate = Quietus

Inner Release, in its current functionality now cloned onto Delirium, predated that functionality on Delirium. Fell Cleave predated Bloodspiller. Decimate predated Quietus. Maybe I'm reading too much into the ordering in "Warrior... feels like a gutted DRK", but the latter seems more the iconic victim of homogenization or the like here.

Granted, if we could go back to 2.0, knowing what we do now of what that first easy step towards capacity --while ignoring means thereto-- would mean for WAR's future homogeneity towards Paladin and, in turn, among all tanks, I think we would have been more cautious in accepting an easy "solution" over one that retains more identity.

Which makes war play ... slow, there's hardly any weaving, War feels slow and not as satisfying.

Agreed, and that slowness feels kind of contrary to its Berserker concept. It feels like Warrior could benefit from a greater sense of momentum, or at the very least some chaos on which to capitalize (without feeling like proc whack-a-mole).

[NeoDivinity]

yo winning about damage on the Tank Role when the difference between them is less then 1k is kinda cringe, even more when WAR is almost Meta with his Invul low cooldown and lets not forget that for those that do not step on Savage/Ultimates that Warrior is by far the best Tank do to Dungeons with his regen and AoE abilites.

Classes changes every expansion, every Job lost something from its kit, what do you want back?
The No Mercy that stays untouched untill the final phase of the boss.
The old version of Fell Cleave where u had to build Abandon stacks.
The Pacification after Berserk?

WAR is the most fun its even been to play, and easy to introduce players to the tank role, even more than PLD i would say.

I do miss having a DoT to keep the damage up when i need to disconnect or maybe removing the gauge cost from the gap close but besides that WAR only got QoL changes over the years.

The Damage output difference is minimal and i never heard about someone being kicked or denied in a group because "Oh he plays X tank and this one hits less than Y tank".

[Lyth]

Momentum isn't too hard to do. Build up a stacking speed and damage buff, and then have a hitstop move that consumes some of your stacks.

But if you want to build unique tanks, you really need narrower concepts for each. It would also be cool if WAR had a jetpack and could teleport and and could shapeshift and could turn undead. But maybe it's fine for them to be the BLM equivalent of tanks and do the slowest but the biggest hits so that we can develop some other unique tank concepts in the future.

[aodhan_ofinnegain]

While I do like the back and forth, I'll admit that HS spam is... really dull for those 10 seconds of Req.

As for Confiteor, have it share a button with Req, with a 1-GCDs ICD or so to prevent accidental double-hits that'd instantly end the phase.

Personally I don't mind PLDs Requiescat window, it's only as dull as Wars, Fell Cleave spam or DRKs, Bloodspiller spam. But at least on the optimization side of things, PLD has a lot more freedom with Requiescat, substituting Holy Spirit(s) for Atonement(s) under the right conditions.

Also from optimization stand point, the 1 GCD delay on Requiescat swapping to Confiteor is a terrible suggestion, since it would prevent scenarios like P1 of e11s where, Requiescat come off cooldown just in time to get Confiteor off. Or just in general if you are middle of fight or Flight and Requiescat has just come off cooldown and either, the fight is about to end or any prolonged downtime is coming up, for your last GCD, you can Requiescat into Confiteor which is a significant gain.

[Shurrikhan]

Personally I don't mind PLDs Requiescat window, it's only as dull as War's Fell Cleave spam or DRK's Bloodspiller spam

That's pretty dull then, no? Especially if compared against the likes of 4.1 Inner Release burst window or even 4.3 DRK's Delirium interactions? Theirs degraded since, but that hardly means PLD couldn't benefit from something less spammy.