Remove Extremes from Mentor Roulette

[ZedxKayn]

Going to stop you right there, you're not a mentor are you? I am a mentor and I have seen people who do exactly that and it isn't because they're being malicious it's because they're new, don't care, don't know, or aren't using the same language.
You're massively projecting.

I haven't even read the rest of your post but based off the fact your argument revolves around a false equivalency I don't think there's much to see.

Hopefully you learn to be less hateful of facts.

It's a troll, best ignore him

[Misplaced_Marbles]

I think mentors should stop excusing their own laziness and either stop doing the roulette just for the rewards if they're unwilling to do their job, or quit blaming others for their own shortcomings and help others do their best while they do their own. Multiple times i've seen a bunch of mentore, as in multiple mentors, in a duty and none of them explain jack, so their job fall on someone elses shoulders who didn't even sign up to help. They just did it because it would help everyone complete the duty and they got no extra rewards for doing it. Unlike you pompous lot, i won't say that all mentors do that, but many do. "Anecdotal evidence"? Yeah, exactly like your unbelievably unrealistic claims.

[Eien713]

I think mentors should stop excusing their own laziness and either stop doing the roulette just for the rewards if they're unwilling to do their job, or quit blaming others for their own shortcomings and help others do their best while they do their own. Multiple times i've seen a bunch of mentore, as in multiple mentors, in a duty and none of them explain jack, so their job fall on someone elses shoulders who didn't even sign up to help. They just did it because it would help everyone complete the duty and they got no extra rewards for doing it. Unlike you pompous lot, i won't say that all mentors do that, but many do. "Anecdotal evidence"? Yeah, exactly like your unbelievably unrealistic claims.

Allow me to share my experience as a mentor. Whenever I got an extreme trial, the first thing I'd ask is: "Do we need to explain the fight before we start?" or "Do people know what to do?" (Sometimes I'd ask if people watched a guide beforehand.)

There are 3 types of answers I usually got:
1) Yes, please explain. (fairly common)
2) No, I didn't watch a guide. (very common)
3) Silence and/or instanpull. (extremely common)

I never start by explaining the mechanics immediately. I ask first if people want them explained because I honestly don't wanna type walls upon walls of text if there's no need to (not to mention that some fights can't be explained via text only). There's also the language barrier. I don't speak German, so when I see most of the party has only D highlighted as their language and they don't respond to anything I write in chat, I know it's a lost cause.

People are very negative toward mentors and expect too much of them. You call mentors lazy, but what of the people who don't make an effort to watch a guide before queuing or don't wanna watch one even after you ask them to at the start of the fight? I had instances where I asked people to watch a guide (while we waited to get new members, so we were doing nothing anyway) because there were too many mechanics in the fight to explain clearly via text, and do you know what their response was? Silence for a few minutes followed by a swift leave.

I never understood people who don't wanna watch guides. If you're not good enough to pick up on mechanics on the fly and learn a fight decently quickly, then you're holding everyone else back. What's the difference between watching a guide that explains things very clearly using footage, and inconveniencing another person by making them type walls of text that don't explain things nearly as well as a video? Either way, you're not going in blind to discover the fight--you're being fed the mechanics. But in case one, you make an effort. In case two, you're too lazy and you inconvenience another person and/or are expecting to get carried.

The way I see it, by getting a mentor in your extreme trial, you are guaranteed (hopefully) a person who knows what they're doing, so they won't hold you back. If you're someone who did their homework and looked up a guide beforehand, this mentor will definitely help you clear. They can also help you by explaining a few things you might be struggling with here and there. I don't see why it's a mentor's job to carry you. You do your part by making an effort before queuing or after being asked to watch a guide, and the mentor will do their job by not being a dead weight and by supporting you to get the clear. It's a shared effort.

[CKNovel]

I'd say keep them.

It's great that sprout tries a content a minimum hard, it's not what will help them learn the game but it might set barriers.
Yeah I avoided mentor roulette like plague until now and cleared a few but going to older EX trials when I have nothing to do is... Pleasant.

You see sprout learning, of course some people claim that we needs to remain positive, then "wtf guys are u serius".
I did not saw Niddhog EX for years and clearing it again with sprout is fun.

However I wish people would stay in the party, most "mentors" quit after only 15 mins. At least increase the Extreme trials rewards, makes it count for 10 clears toward the achievements or something.

[SomeRandomHuman]

At least increase the Extreme trials rewards, makes it count for 10 clears toward the achievements or something.

So mentors will just leave everything not an EX trial because they'd rather fish for the 10 clears per roulette? Most of the mentors out there are only mentors for the achievement rewards. They only want the mount and then they'll discard the crown forever.

[CKNovel]

So mentors will just leave everything not an EX trial because they'd rather fish for the 10 clears per roulette? Most of the mentors out there are only mentors for the achievement rewards. They only want the mount and then they'll discard the crown forever.

Nah. They'll stay for the simple thing because every step, even small, is a step.
But at least if you manage to clear the EX, even if it takes an hour, it will be worth the hour. If you leave a full party you can't queue again for 30 mins.

Currently mentors fish for simple content and leave if they see it will take the whole hour. Making Extreme a massive rewards will make it look like a no-brainer and they would try to complete it.

[Ralph2449]

Nah. They'll stay for the simple thing because every step, even small, is a step.
But at least if you manage to clear the EX, even if it takes an hour, it will be worth the hour. If you leave a full party you can't queue again for 30 mins.

Currently mentors fish for simple content and leave if they see it will take the whole hour. Making Extreme a massive rewards will make it look like a no-brainer and they would try to complete it.

But according to certain "elite" mentors who keep queing for extremes somehow keep meeting those ultra bad scary casuals that never improve and keep dying to the same mechanic every fight while that not only is absurd, it shows how clearly biased they are to believe those dirty noob casuals never improve. (Which btw, if you think about it, implies them improving is something pretty great so indirectly boosting their own self worth by believing those ultra noob casuals that never improve are a thing)

Increasing extreme rewards wouldnt be a bad idea at the start, but you know if they cant get their way and because they feel entitled to the rewards just like they feel entitled to quick roflstomp runs, in that case they ll start trying to kick everyone who doesnt listen to their superior advice and do exactly what they say, especially since they often fail to communicate appropriately and think they are somekind of leader that gets to command people so of course that attitude will piss people off which might decide to just troll them for their bad behavior.

When I qued for HW extremes even though we had wipes most of us really wanted to beat the boss so we got it down after a few wipes because we learned the mechanics better, everyone improved and beat it, that includes those sprouts and casual players who have no reason to keep failing mechanics since it becomes pretty clear what needs to be done, and there's no elitist going around attacking them or trying to command them.

[Nethereal]

But according to certain "elite" mentors who keep queing for extremes somehow keep meeting those ultra bad scary casuals that never improve and keep dying to the same mechanic every fight while that not only is absurd, it shows how clearly biased they are to believe those dirty noob casuals never improve. (Which btw, if you think about it, implies them improving is something pretty great so indirectly boosting their own self worth by believing those ultra noob casuals that never improve are a thing)

Increasing extreme rewards wouldnt be a bad idea at the start, but you know if they cant get their way and because they feel entitled to the rewards just like they feel entitled to quick roflstomp runs, in that case they ll start trying to kick everyone who doesnt listen to their superior advice and do exactly what they say, especially since they often fail to communicate appropriately and think they are somekind of leader that gets to command people so of course that attitude will piss people off which might decide to just troll them for their bad behavior.

When I qued for HW extremes even though we had wipes most of us really wanted to beat the boss so we got it down after a few wipes because we learned the mechanics better, everyone improved and beat it, that includes those sprouts and casual players who have no reason to keep failing mechanics since it becomes pretty clear what needs to be done, and there's no elitist going around attacking them or trying to command them.

[ForteNightshade]

So mentors will just leave everything not an EX trial because they'd rather fish for the 10 clears per roulette? Most of the mentors out there are only mentors for the achievement rewards. They only want the mount and then they'll discard the crown forever.

EXs are far too inconsistent to ever be worth fishing for through Mentor Roulette. If you're just after the reward, getting dungeons and guildhests will be much faster even with the suggested boost. It would, however, make staying more worthwhile because hey, if you pull it off, you get a huge boon. Right now there is literally zero reason to stay in EXs unless you just want to help. Even genuinely good mentors often get frustrated over time because people simply don't listen.

There needs to be something to better incentivize EXs or they just shouldn't be there.

[FudoMyoo]

lolmentors ....