Please implement something to teach players how to play

[Ralph2449]

Ah yes, the "we know better" and "you're just playing our game wrong, it's actually great, you're just idiots" attitude. Brilliant. Sure, Blizzard hasn't seen a hint of my money for over 3-4 years now and is now facing a mass exodus, but they do know best. How dare we not see that and give them the money they deserve.

If THE COMMUNITY doesnt care about making their own builds and making their own meaningful choices and instead google what is best in an mmoRPG, yeah, they clearly have no clue how to play.

Just like the people brainlessly follow raid clear guides instead of thinking of their own tactics based on their own available comp and its advantages, the amount of clueless people who killed frieda first at the start in Nathria cuz the elite guide told them so when her last effect was mainly a healer/tank check which was incredibly easy to deal with if you had competent healers/tanks (Which is a lot easier to have than literally more than a dozen of mechanically competent dps) proves that, THE COMMUNITY is the problem.

Ion himself repeatedly talks about how players are meant to THINK and make decisions, instead a majority of WoW players never think and brainlessly follow guides which is why they fail so much at some points because guides cannot cover the entirety of the game and all its possible situations.

Learn to deal, or enjoy your 30 min break.. its not all about you.

These mentors sadly feel ENTITLED to the rewards so they will instantly pretend to be the victim if they dont get their way, dealing with it is not an option for them sadly.

Fun fact, most people that are giving advice are actually nice, its those on the receiving end behaving toxic - kicking and screaming, see this thread for example.

Fun fact, vast majority of gamers do not know how to communicate because their insecurities and dependence on video game achievements for self worth leads them to be insulting, offensive, condescending or thinking they are a great leader that should be followed and get offended when people ON THE INTERNET dont listen to their commands, like who do they think they are lmao.

Their inability to communicate is the problem which is sadly why mentors should never have been a thing outside of very select few people that have proven their ability to talk and are placed on a higher standard unlike the behavior we see here from the average mentor who is so entitled to rewards and dont want to MENTOR that it shows how flawed the entire idea is, most gamers are simply not capable of communicating and are lacking many interpersonal skills.

again, what's the point of the unneeded vitriol and toxicity? can't you say it without insulting an imaginary enemy? always having to blame someone
if someone from the "bad players should git gud" group

I mean he is merely speaking the truth, any player who goes around using the term "git gud" is instantly in that category because no mentally healthy individual that honestly wants to help uses that term because it knows it is both insulting and it shows a great deal of insecurity, like he said "smug neck beards looking down on others and refusing to help just to make their mediocre achievements feel greater"

Sadly many gamers do that because their self worth is based on video game achievements and if you dont have actual irl achievements looking down on other people in video games helps you make you feel like you have achieved something big, it is a common method of indirectly boosting one's weak ego.

[Jojoya]

Ion himself repeatedly talks about how players are meant to THINK and make decisions, instead a majority of WoW players never think and brainlessly follow guides which is why they fail so much at some points because guides cannot cover the entirety of the game and all its possible situations.

Another good example of how Ion doesn't understand what the average player wants.

They're not playing the game to THINK. Most people have to spend way too much of their day thinking at their job or at school.

They're playing the game to HAVE FUN. If you're engineering the system to be complex and requiring thought instead of simple so it's intuitive, you've removed fun from the equation and turned the game into a second job.

[Miracle_Diva]

They're not playing the game to THINK. Most people have to spend way too much of their day thinking at their job or at school.

They're playing the game to HAVE FUN. If you're engineering the system to be complex and requiring thought instead of simple so it's intuitive, you've removed fun from the equation and turned the game into a second job.

I bet, you didn't think before you wrote this. Probably because thinking isn't fun.

[Jojoya]

I bet, you didn't think before you wrote this. Probably because thinking isn't fun.

I thought very much before I wrote it.

Thinking absolutely can be fun for some people. I'm one of them. I like solving puzzles.

But I also like other things. I don't want to be spending all of my time solving puzzles when that's taking time away from other things I also want to do.

Not everyone finds THINK to be fun. They just want to relax after a stressful day doing other things. But perhaps your own ability to THINK is too narrow to understand that.

[Miracle_Diva]

I thought very much before I wrote it.

Thinking absolutely can be fun for some people. I'm one of them. I like solving puzzles.

But I also like other things. I don't want to be spending all of my time solving puzzles when that's taking time away from other things I also want to do.

Not everyone finds THINK to be fun. They just want to relax after a stressful day doing other things. But perhaps your own ability to THINK is too narrow to understand that.

Well just don't do stressful or hard content if you want to relax? But I guess we now need to cater towards "tired" people when we make games. Right.

[Jojoya]

Well just don't do stressful or hard content if you want to relax? But I guess we now need to cater towards "tired" people when we make games. Right.

When did this turn into a discussion about stressful/hard content? The OP was addressing all content that wasn't being done solo.

You're the one who believes THINK is so important. Try engaging it. Game companies are profit driven in the end. That means they need to think about all the potential customers they are trying to attract, including people who are tired after a long day of work. They absolutely need to cater part of their game to those people.

Part does not mean all, though. I've already stated if you run into someone joining a Savage/EX/Ultimate group that does not meet reasonable expectations for performance in that content, by all means remove them from the group.

But those same standards cannot be expected of players doing normal content. That content is intended for everyone.

The experience with duty finder in NA is just a mess, honestly I have gotten a decent amount of nice people, but it truly is a dice roll. For every super fun run with sprouts with no expectations there is another with some weirdo freaking out on people. Then there is the person I had in Qarn who just skipped all of the loot when the sprout was there for the first time. I think leveling a dps is cursed. I just wished to level dps so I knew what to expect when going into content. I wished to know what the ground aoes dps put down so I do not mistaken it for an enemies. What other classes may be viewing from their portion of the battle field. What mechanics they have within their class such as ninja's needed to refresh their pinwheel and not to chain pull because you can not become hidden during combat like in other games I have played that had separate skills for being able to hide in combat. Maybe NA data centers themselves are cursed. I just wish to relax, and not get into something every other time with someone with a bad attitude. I honestly thought it was a meme about people blaming healers too, a tank actually blamed the healer for their death in sleepy snowcloak.

Or it's more a problem with a specific data center. It's extremely rare I run into issues in Duty Finder. I'm even leveling a new character right now and the number of players being welcoming and helpful to all the sprouts has been great to see.

I'm not going to say the bad experiences never happen on Crystal but they're so uncommon from my experience I never walk into an instance fearing the group will have a nightmare player.

[SomeRandomHuman]

But those same standards cannot be expected of players doing normal content. That content is intended for everyone.

So expecting someone in the Qitana Ravel to know what their basic combo chains are and perform them is too high of a standard?

[Shurrikhan]

When did this turn into a discussion about stressful/hard content? The OP was addressing all content that wasn't being done solo.

You're the one who believes THINK(ing?) is so important. Try engaging it(your ability to think?). Game companies are profit driven in the end. That means they need to think about all the potential customers they are trying to attract, including people who are tired after a long day of work. They absolutely need to cater part of their game to those people.

:: Parentheticals my own, to ensure I'm understanding your retorts to Diva here. Emphasis (underline) also my own.

There are plenty of games that already profit plentifully by attracting players who are too tired to think. Find them on Steam. Find them on Google Play. There's a veritable trove of them.

So why do we need to increasingly turn XIV into Candy Crush? The relaxing parts are already there, and most investment in system design (Trusts, for instance) have increasingly catered to (made further allotments for) that span of players.

Again, when the game was released, dungeons as a content type included instances which could appeal to those looking for more than just a relaxing experience (i.e., those who actually wanted to engage with the systems of the game at a level that'd give those systems pertinence). Because the game has done so little to increase its efforts to facilitate learning even as the number of pieces of content have increased twofold, threefold, fourfold, content types have, in effect, begun to exclude player interests they used to include. "You want cognitive engagement? Go fight in a boss arena. You want depth in a job kit? Sorry, but you'll have to find something other than MCH now, no matter how that aesthetic may be your favorite. We don't serve your kind here anymore."

The kind of exclusion you're fearing is what's been subtly happening over the last 7 years, with some points of change far more noticeable than others, to those you'd accuse of encroaching on your preferred style of content design.

[Miracle_Diva]

When did this turn into a discussion about stressful/hard content? The OP was addressing all content that wasn't being done solo.

You're the one who believes THINK is so important. Try engaging it. Game companies are profit driven in the end. That means they need to think about all the potential customers they are trying to attract, including people who are tired after a long day of work. They absolutely need to cater part of their game to those people.

Part does not mean all, though. I've already stated if you run into someone joining a Savage/EX/Ultimate group that does not meet reasonable expectations for performance in that content, by all means remove them from the group.

But those same standards cannot be expected of players doing normal content. That content is intended for everyone.


Or it's more a problem with a specific data center. It's extremely rare I run into issues in Duty Finder. I'm even leveling a new character right now and the number of players being welcoming and helpful to all the sprouts has been great to see.

I'm not going to say the bad experiences never happen on Crystal but they're so uncommon from my experience I never walk into an instance fearing the group will have a nightmare player.

I was literally replying to your own comment.
Even if Game companies are profit driven, doesn't mean that they have to cater towards everyone. Just the majority. If you want something specific, there're plenty of games that are made for "tired" people where you don't need to think.
FFXIV is an MMO. A game, where you WILL encounter other players and you WILL engage in activities with them. It's up to YOU to do your best (no, it's doesn't mean you need to perform like everything is at Ultimate level play, I'm so tired of repeating this, I don't understand why you people are so dense) to provide your support for your team, which includes doing your job as DPS/Tank/Healer. This doesn't mean that you have to be top parser score in anything you do. This means that you have to respect others' time the same way they respect yours. Therefore not being lazy.
This thread was started with an idea to add more tools to teach people literal basics. You will be surprised how many players out there want to learn the game, their class and not just mush random pretty buttons. Especially new players.
For some reason, part of this community thinks that you are allowed to be a burden for your team. If you're not interested in learning, it's fine, no one is forcing you. But you also need to avoid forcing others to work twice as hard because they didn't pay their sub to carry you through content. (And I don't mean You Jojoya, specifically, just in case)

[Rinhi]

I'm not going to say the bad experiences never happen on Crystal but they're so uncommon from my experience I never walk into an instance fearing the group will have a nightmare player.

maybe it says something about the data center when the majority of the people who defend said selfish and toxic "playstyle" to death come from a certain one, while the people from the other "camp" come from various different ones?
maybe I'll make a crystal alt and see for myself how different it is!

When did this turn into a discussion about stressful/hard content? The OP was addressing all content that wasn't being done solo.

huh?

TO clarify: I'm mainly concerned about level 70-80 characters having these issues.