Please implement something to teach players how to play

[Shurrikhan]

Reminder that this is a VIDEO GAME, not the source of your self worth, this obsession with video game ""skill"" and high end content from some people screams a lot of negative things about one's ego.

Hint: Video games are designed to be beaten.

By effectively later patching out mechanics or making them irrelevant through massive reductions to a fight's requirements? Where did I see that in Super Mario back in the day, Dragon Age: Origins, Mass Effect, or any single-player FF game? Hmm...

[Wavaryen]

This is what I don't understand. You have tough content you could do. Why do you want all content to be tougher?

Why is it that content that lets people play how they want, and not need to be "good". You want to take that away from people. So you can have MORE content for yourself while taking away content that is design with these people in mind?


I already got the answer to the problem. Like 4ish pages ago. If you want players to be better. Just let people duo Trusts, and it can be used as a teaching tool for people who want it. Instead, you got people want players to be PUNISHED for not meeting a standard.


You all care so much only because you want content that is harder and you want your DF runs to be faster. It has nothing to do with players getting good for that player sake. It has everything to do with you wanting people to play at a certain standard so the content gets balance around it. That will NEVER happen.

By effectively later patching out mechanics or making them irrelevant through massive reductions to a fight's requirements? Where did I see that in Super Mario back in the day, Dragon Age: Origins, Mass Effect, or any single-player FF game? Hmm...

That list is flawed. None of them games are a service like MMORPGS are.

[Shurrikhan]

That list is flawed. None of them games are a service like MMORPGS are.

Then, I repeat, what is it about "being a video game" that necessitates that fights be hugely nerfed the moment they require some novel thinking?

Day one, Steps of Faith was not outright difficult. It was merely different. Following its own very simple tasks, the fight was no harder than the trials before or after it.

[Wavaryen]

Then, I repeat, what is it about "being a video game" that necessitates that fights be hugely nerfed the moment they require some novel thinking?

Day one, Steps of Faith was not outright difficult. It was merely different. Following its own very simple tasks, the fight was no harder than the trials before or after it.

The steps of progression makes it a game. A game does not have to be hard or requires thinking to be a game.

Myself, If I am going to do content over and over again. I rather it not be hard, and get through it quickly through the grind. Tougher content is fun for the first few times, but once you done it. It becomes tedious.

Quickly being key part, as even my personal feelings that I want to get things done fast. I'm not going to be upset if players prevent that, or want content taking away from them because they not good enough to make the run fast.

[Faafetai]

Myself, If I am going to do content over and over again. I rather it not be hard, and get through it quickly through the grind. Tougher content is fun for the first few times, but once you done it. It becomes tedious.

This is a huge problem I have with final fantasy 14 in general. I recently finished shadowbringer and possibly go into bozja. I went to look at all of the gear and what it took to get it, this is before the tombstone cap was increased. It kind of feels like a mobile game with a cash shop. There are currencies upon currencies you have to keep track of for some unknown reason that are weekly capped for some unknown reason. I suppose it is to keep people playing the game for long periods of time, but it really just makes me irritated. I do not need grindy content to keep me playing the game, but I guess that is how some are incentivized at least how the company must see it.

Maybe it is not this way on the jp servers, but the na servers this grindy content has bred a whole horde of crazy speed running mind numbing individuals who are using third party software to queue dodge any alliance raid that is not labyrinth or syrcus tower all whilst putting on lower level gear so they do not meet the i level requirements for anything but crystal tower series. Those same people will never wait for sprouts to exit a cutscene, early pull bosses if people are not going fast enough, and could never be bothered with saying hello or goodbye just silent in silent out single player co op mmorpg experience. It makes me super turned off on the later content. If I have to grind for months to get memories or whatever you need to upgrade relic weapons I wish there were an alternative.

If I wanted to work while off from work I would just put in more hours. I also did not wish to be back in high school again which was why I left swtor in the first place. Clicks here clicks there, thirsty dudes getting lost in their characters slut glam while everyone dies around them because they would rather fap to their 'toon' than heal the party. No joke someone told me 'sorry, I didn't see what was happening I was looking up my characters skirt'...bruh

[Wavaryen]

Jeeeeez this thread is going from discussion to ouch my brain to living breathing meme in record breaking time.

Some people commenting here just need to play a fricken single player game with cheat codes on. I would hate (love) to see how they deal with actually challenging content in anything. I recently discovered a term most amusing "baby rage" and I believe it adequately describes what would happen.

Group C from my previous post, having a stroke because they want it their way but we cannot have it ours because they cannot have it their way because we want it our way because they want it their way. Perhaps I am having a stroke but this is the only discussion even happening anymore. I am not surprised at'all only mildly amused. One 47 page long point of reference any time this topic arises. Waaaahh you just want the thing because you are selfish let us have the thing instead because "we are not selfish".

Reality casts introspection > introspection misses

I'm having a hard time understanding this little rant, but how does difficult content have anything to do with being a mmo or single player? Your logic makes no sense.

This is a huge problem I have with final fantasy 14 in general. I recently finished shadowbringer and possibly go into bozja. I went to look at all of the gear and what it took to get it, this is before the tombstone cap was increased. It kind of feels like a mobile game with a cash shop. There are currencies upon currencies you have to keep track of for some unknown reason that are weekly capped for some unknown reason. I suppose it is to keep people playing the game for long periods of time, but it really just makes me irritated. I do not need grindy content to keep me playing the game, but I guess that is how some are incentivized at least how the company must see it.

I understand this point also. And I'm going to add to this.



To the people who want to teach, and harder content in the base game, and dailies. Do you all understand just what that would lead too? I don't think you do. Players will always game the system, and will always take the shortest route, and or gatekeep players that does not meet your standards. Do you understand just how toxic the game would become? Wow mythic is proof of that, but lets not even talk wow. We seen in this game itself how people gate classes before, and what players do when harder content becomes the normal.



So here in your perfect FF14 you gatekeep players and have an intense program that teaches them. Ok, Now picture DF content that you do everything. Balance around that. Do some of you understand just how tedious the game would be? If we are going to grind for months on the same thing, it being mind numbing easy is MUCH better than it requiring full attention. If it required focus all the time, you understand just how much worse the grind would be?

[MiaShino]

I'm having a hard time understanding this little rant, but how does difficult content have anything to do with being a mmo or single player? Your logic makes no sense.

Hmm.

I'm having a hard time understanding anything.

Better, much better.

[Faafetai]

So here in your perfect FF14 you gatekeep players and have an intense program that teaches them. Ok, Now picture DF content that you do everything. Balance around that. Do some of you understand just how tedious the game would be? If we are going to grind for months on the same thing, it being mind numbing easy is MUCH better than it requiring full attention. If it required focus all the time, you understand just how much worse the grind would be?

I should hope the devs at least have their heads screwed on straight to know if they added teaching things within the game it would be tailored to those learning and hopefully even the content they wish to do. I am assuming that was how this thread started. I would think they would just fix the early class quests to actually allow for you to test abilities to know what they do rather than kill opo opos a million times and light a torch to summon more opo opos, this just taught me someone on the dev team really hated opo opos for some reason. I played other mmos so I kind of understood cooldowns and the like, but for someone who has never played an mmo or tanked before showing or teaching things called tank busters exist, maybe not giving you a tank stance at level 10 and right when you pick up the class would also be kind of them.

There should just be an option for content like they have for class quests but just put it into other things, so everyone can get what they want. People can already undersize content so they can do things easier at a higher level than what it would have been going in to the content synced. They had this for swtor you have , story mode, veteran, mastermode content, all of the same things just at different difficulties.

[Larirawiel]

To the people who want to teach, and harder content in the base game, and dailies. Do you all understand just what that would lead too? I don't think you do. Players will always game the system, and will always take the shortest route, and or gatekeep players that does not meet your standards. Do you understand just how toxic the game would become? Wow mythic is proof of that, but lets not even talk wow. We seen in this game itself how people gate classes before, and what players do when harder content becomes the normal.

This is true. But IMHO it is more the fault of the game mechanics/class design that players start gatekeeping other players. In WoW this toxic behavior started already with Tbc when the badges gear/wellfare epics came out. Suddenly the tanks had to have 20k HP or more for a simple heroic 5-man instance even when 10k HP were enough. My tank paladina had "only" 16k HP because i had more avoidance stats on my gear and i did not stack hitpoints and i found hardly a group for 5-man heroics. And the funny thing was, many instances were with an avoidance tank far easier than with a 25k HP punching bag tank.


WoW vanilla did not have those problems at all. Because there were no wellfare epics and the classes had far more usefull utility outside of their roles. This is something that i miss in FF14.


The FF14 devs copied many things from WoW WotLK and Cataclysm and the game has the same problems.


Cheers

[Shurrikhan]

The steps of progression makes it a game. A game does not have to be hard or requires thinking to be a game.

Myself, If I am going to do content over and over again. I rather it not be hard, and get through it quickly through the grind. Tougher content is fun for the first few times, but once you done it. It becomes tedious.

It becomes tedious because you're doing it over and over... which is in turn because there is little variety among efficient means or content by which to meet the weekly caps.

For my part, I'd rather do the content at the difficulty I actually enjoy, with due reward for my efforts, so that my relative pool of choices is wider.

Ideally, as an average player, I should have, say, three levels/styles of content in PvE itself by which to farm out my weekly caps.

• I've got a choice that gives about 2 tomes per minute spent.
• Another that, given the likely occasional wipe or (excessive) caution, would take about twice as long, but still takes about 2 tomes per minute spent in my case. (For less skilled players, it might be a bit less efficient, and for more skill players, more efficient.)
• And, I've got a final choice that I can enjoy when I want zero stress, but gives a bit less per minute. (Again, for players who'd otherwise be making pivotal mistakes if they went into harder content at that time, maybe this will actually be the most efficient option by a slight margin.)

Why the assumption that the average player would be not only forced into more difficult content, but also that the content would be proportionately less rewarding of their efforts (more effort for the exact same reward efficiency).

The chances are, the less the content has to offer you -- i.e., the easier/shallower it is compared to your own skill level and/or preferred depth of engagement -- the faster you will get bored of it. At no point does the Savage raider look at the likely shallow-as-a-dry-pond Expert Roulette and think, "Yes, I want more of this. And everyone else should have it too, in amounts which would consume slightly more time for me -- even if that means far more time required for them."