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  1. #1
    Player
    Kaurhz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    3,527
    Character
    Asuka Kirai
    World
    Sagittarius
    Main Class
    Dancer Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Shurrikhan View Post
    Consider what goes into that willingness, though.

    Or, consider it from the opposite end: What point is there in expending that effort? If I have ostensibly nothing to gain from doing so (assuming, even, the path were clear -- which it usually is not), and the effort itself is not enjoyable... why would I bother?

    That's the problem the devs have increasingly set for themselves. They've diminished the rewards, obfuscated the path, and made the early-level combat experience increasingly a slog.

    If they want the community to behave differently, then they should give them contexts that warrant different behaviors.

    Yes, there is by now a huge sense of inertia, or generalized expectations, they'd have to push back against, but once they get the boulder rolling to turn those expectations around, the community cannot help but snowball the changes the devs will have impelled.
    Again, incorporate or encourage this process of learning into the solo duties through the creative use of mechanics or systems that help to encourage the process of learning. It should be something that has no bearing on other people, especially if it is something that seemingly does potentially punish other players.

    If we want to look into a direction that involves encouraging learning, whilst still incorporating them into the dungeon then a bonus exp/tome checkpoints could be included to help encourage this. E.g. you hit the goal of doing x, y, or z then you get a checkmark that provides bonus exp or tomestones. This could be anything from the execution of an ability a certain amount of time, or a limitation therein. Then you have the point of expanding that effort from a personal perspective without necessarily involving mechanics that seemingly punish players for bad play, but rather rewarding people for good play.

    My issue with the suggested list is it wasn't rewarding players for good play, you were effectively punishing them within the duty itself for not performing up to a baseline.

    I'm all for a new context that encourages different behavior, but forcing this process, or punishing for not meeting this behavior baseline won't sit well with players. EXP multipliers to individual bosses for correct, proper, or efficient execution of mechanics, be it fight or job mechanics would be a great way to start.

    I don't want to have to worry about that healer potentially killing themselves or the tank, just because someone decided that adding a stacking mechanic to GCD heals was a great way to try and force players into something. Especially when more often than not more damage on the bosses will translate to faster kills, which means the boss does fewer mechanics and overall a smaller window for mistakes. So this rides as much on the DPS playing their job correctly in addition to the tank, yet someone wanted to propose the bizarre idea for potentially punishing the healer, or potentially making their life even more difficult for trying to compensate?
    (2)
    Last edited by Kaurhz; 07-10-2021 at 10:26 AM.

  2. #2
    Player
    Shurrikhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    12,842
    Character
    Tani Shirai
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaurhz View Post
    Again, incorporate or encourage this process of learning into the solo duties through the creative use of mechanics or systems that help to encourage the process of learning.
    That is of course where it should come into play first, but if those mechanics don't come into the content unlocked down the road from those solo duties, you naturally divorce that learning from the apparent intent of the game.

    My issue with the suggested list is it wasn't rewarding players for good play, you were effectively punishing them within the duty itself for not performing up to a baseline.
    Again, I share many of your concerns with Lezard's list. I just don't believe the general ideas the list seems to follow are going in a fundamentally wrong direction, so long as the implementations (the individual fight designs or its mechanics) are well situated.
    (0)