Please implement something to teach players how to play

[Wavaryen]

The game is a MMORPG, the expectation is that you will have fun with peers and grow together.
To intentionally make things harder for your fellow man means you not only are disrespecting them and anyone else around you while you are doing said sabotage but you are also a troll. It is clear and cut. Intent matters.
If you played this game you would know.

I'm not sure what that has to do with a MMORPG. In fact, I don't think how someone plays has anything to do with MMORPG. Other players are in your game, and it is perfectly ok for you to play bad or how you want with said players. Now if you join a LS or a custom group that has standards than no it is not. Lets be real here. Just because other players play the game. Does not mean you got to be mindful, or care.


We did not even have that mindset when we played Ultima Online. So not sure why people feel that now.

It's not elitist to not want to take an hour to do a duty when the average time through a dungeon is 30 minutes.

I agree, but I also am understanding that I pick to do content that openly has no standard for players to do it.

That means that if a Black mage wants to RP and only do ice. They have every right to do that in that group. And if the group is not happy with them, and he gets kicked. They have the right to do that as well, and he will find another one (or she.)


My stance on it is. The group got made with no set standard on how players should play. So not my place to ask or even help them. Unless they want it.

[MiaShino]

Annnnnnd just like that, the magic is gone. Just when we were almost beginning to have a productive discussion too, darn.

Oh well, perhaps in several hours the discussion can begin anew.

[Seera1024]

I'm not sure what that has to do with a MMORPG. In fact, I don't think how someone plays has anything to do with MMORPG. Other players are in your game, and it is perfectly ok for you to play bad or how you want with said players. Now if you join a LS or a custom group that has standards than no it is not. Lets be real here. Just because other players play the game. Does not mean you got to be mindful, or care.


We did not even have that mindset when we played Ultima Online. So not sure why people feel that now.



I agree, but I also am understanding that I pick to do content that openly has no standard for players to do it.

That means that if a Black mage wants to RP and only do ice. They have every right to do that in that group. And if the group is not happy with them, and he gets kicked. They have the right to do that as well, and he will find another one (or she.)


My stance on it is. The group got made with no set standard on how players should play. So not my place to ask or even help them. Unless they want it.

When you join a group, the standard is being a team player.

Sometimes being a team player means compromising.

So players entering the DF who are at the extremes should expect to compromise on their preferred play style.

So the players who prefer perfect runs have to tolerate mistakes.

Those who don't play at their personal best knowingly, have to step it up a notch.

No one's expecting the Ice Mage to suddenly go perfect rotation. Just to do a better job at DPS.

[Wavaryen]

Annnnnnd just like that, the magic is gone. Just when we were almost beginning to have a productive discussion too, darn.

Oh well, perhaps in several hours the discussion can begin anew.

People like this is the problem and why people think you are elitist. You can't even disagree without throwing a hissy fit. You also openly admit you are trolling people who don't agree with you.

[Nethereal]

Just because other players play the game. Does not mean you got to be mindful, or care

You are so unironically oblivious of how narcissistic you are I can't even laugh.

[Ralph2449]

Ah yes, the "we know better" and "you're just playing our game wrong, it's actually great, you're just idiots" attitude. Brilliant. Sure, Blizzard hasn't seen a hint of my money for over 3-4 years now and is now facing a mass exodus, but they do know best. How dare we not see that and give them the money they deserve.

If THE COMMUNITY doesnt care about making their own builds and making their own meaningful choices and instead google what is best in an mmoRPG, yeah, they clearly have no clue how to play.

Just like the people brainlessly follow raid clear guides instead of thinking of their own tactics based on their own available comp and its advantages, the amount of clueless people who killed frieda first at the start in Nathria cuz the elite guide told them so when her last effect was mainly a healer/tank check which was incredibly easy to deal with if you had competent healers/tanks (Which is a lot easier to have than literally more than a dozen of mechanically competent dps) proves that, THE COMMUNITY is the problem.

Ion himself repeatedly talks about how players are meant to THINK and make decisions, instead a majority of WoW players never think and brainlessly follow guides which is why they fail so much at some points because guides cannot cover the entirety of the game and all its possible situations.

Learn to deal, or enjoy your 30 min break.. its not all about you.

These mentors sadly feel ENTITLED to the rewards so they will instantly pretend to be the victim if they dont get their way, dealing with it is not an option for them sadly.

Fun fact, most people that are giving advice are actually nice, its those on the receiving end behaving toxic - kicking and screaming, see this thread for example.

Fun fact, vast majority of gamers do not know how to communicate because their insecurities and dependence on video game achievements for self worth leads them to be insulting, offensive, condescending or thinking they are a great leader that should be followed and get offended when people ON THE INTERNET dont listen to their commands, like who do they think they are lmao.

Their inability to communicate is the problem which is sadly why mentors should never have been a thing outside of very select few people that have proven their ability to talk and are placed on a higher standard unlike the behavior we see here from the average mentor who is so entitled to rewards and dont want to MENTOR that it shows how flawed the entire idea is, most gamers are simply not capable of communicating and are lacking many interpersonal skills.

again, what's the point of the unneeded vitriol and toxicity? can't you say it without insulting an imaginary enemy? always having to blame someone
if someone from the "bad players should git gud" group

I mean he is merely speaking the truth, any player who goes around using the term "git gud" is instantly in that category because no mentally healthy individual that honestly wants to help uses that term because it knows it is both insulting and it shows a great deal of insecurity, like he said "smug neck beards looking down on others and refusing to help just to make their mediocre achievements feel greater"

Sadly many gamers do that because their self worth is based on video game achievements and if you dont have actual irl achievements looking down on other people in video games helps you make you feel like you have achieved something big, it is a common method of indirectly boosting one's weak ego.

[Wavaryen]

You are so unironically oblivious of how narcissistic you are I can't even laugh.

I'm going to give you some advice...Grow up. Notice how I said that is how I feel, and that I don't push my standards on others? I also speak from someone who played Mud games, and older MMORPGS. Never once did we have this view of. Well we need to play our best because of others.


I think it is a very childish mindset, and selfish one at that. It seems like the only reason people want players to play better is because they want harder content to be design, and they want to get the DF groups faster done without having to deal with said players.


The ego behind the statement that people got to meet your standards in a pug or that people should "care" because they group with others is amazing. It even goes against the nature of what an RPG is.

[Ralph2449]

The ego behind the statement that people got to meet your standards in a pug

It speaks to their feeling of entitlement, anyone with a functioning brain knows to never ever have high expectations of pugged groups in any game, the possibility of a slower run is always possible, but these people somehow have not only managed to have this ridiculous expectation that defies reality, they also feel ENTITLED to it lol.

[Caurcas]

It speaks to their feeling of entitlement, anyone with a functioning brain knows to never ever have high expectations of pugged groups in any game, the possibility of a slower run is always possible, but these people somehow have not only managed to have this ridiculous expectation that defies reality, they also feel ENTITLED to it lol.

I don't know Ralph, that statement is kind of entitled. All most of us want is for people to get good, which is to say actively try to overcome the obstacles in front of them and win the game, not be a passive hanger on that achieves off the backs of others. Have some pride and self worth.

[Faafetai]

Correct, that content is design around players like them, and they are having fun even if it takes you longer. You get a reward for dealing with said players. Wanting them to play better is just silly. A failed group is not that big of a deal, and I think it is very toxic to try and force a standard in a pug group that the game makes. If it was a group you made. You have every right to do it.

The key word here is HAVING FUN. It is not fun to be berated within a mandatory Trial I waited 30 minutes to get into for the first time. The ice mage/black mage was being a jerk to the party of people who were new to the duty because of not passing a dps check that they themselves were contributing to with their low debuffed ice skills, after they died more times than I could count. They were the one flaming the party, no one knew how to vote kick I literally never had to do it before and no time to look it up due to rapid pull 'main tank' who was playing red light green light with their stance.

There is a huge difference in completing content slowly and actually being able to have fun and completing the content. COMPLETE THE CONTENT. I already know you are going to say build your own social network or something about the social balance of the duty finder like some weird guru. What is the point of duty finder? Not everyone wishes to build a social network. There may not even be people to enter into a party in party finder. It is a story trial why can't people pass a story trial?

I am not there for my first time to take over for the 'main tank' which I did because the healers were getting beat on because I didn't notice the main tank was assuming their stance was a ogcd or something, and carry an idiot black mage so he can get his trial roulette reward. He clearly 'I've cleared extreme a hundred time' he was not new just doing things his way. No problem, at least I got the clear right? Should have built that social network. What I should have done was wait till endwalker so I could play shadowbringers content without the need for a party after grinding to level 90.