Please implement something to teach players how to play

[Nethereal]

Yeah I mean I'm all on board for the player base getting less shit and all. But I'm just going to do full light party roulettes and only use pf and just have fun memeing if someone wants to do a roulette that has more than 8 people.

[Dragonblanco]

Gonna get to the rest of your points, but feel its necessary to go after this FIre 1 thing. I knew someone would try to be like oh ITS YOU who doesnt know whats going on. No. They were doing Fire 1s into Despair, Freeze, Fire 3, repeat. Like, dont sit here and tell me.

Like do you think Id make a thread about expected behavior? TO assume this is just asinine imo.

And it is important to look at way I phrased. I asked questions in both things you quoted and responded. Well, first was supposed to have a ? after part about being an alt, but looks like I put a period instead. But it was me asking if an alt and hoping so. Guess I'm getting used to what people are saying is Titanman posts and all, where people create posts just for drama. So I was trying to figure out if that's anything of what this was or where it went.

Then on fire one, I just asked if that's what you meant. If it was, pointed out what rotation might be. Now you've responded that's not the case. So it just is clarification without attacking or blaming each other. Only saying that as your bit about "IT YOU" and "don't sit here and tell me" appeared to me as if you were getting defensive and phrasing like I attacked. Maybe I'm just reading more into it, but trying to address in case, so we can be on the same page and know it's all friendly discussion and trying to figure out solutions.

[Shurrikhan]

I love watching tanks try to big-pull stone vigil, then the inevitable wipe and the tank sheepishly pulling smaller after that.

Yeah that's about the first to really force some splits. For that one, the other Bard and I just slowed the first pack and had them down by the time he arrived at the third pack (in the room past the hallway), and then he did the last two packs separately before the boss. The pulls were about the same size as the gate-to-gate stuff; it just lacked gates to force the pull size limits.

[SniperCT]

I would love an update to Guildhest, or a rebirth of it, that included Savage mechanics. Or maybe a Hall of Extreme/Savage/Ultimate that's more of a simulation room that allows us to specifically learn and practice mechanics from higher tier content, with Trusts as stand-ins for players. I just REALLY want a place where I can familiarize myself with how something works, without first having to get to phase 2 or something of that fight. I can be confident with 93% of a fight BUT this one very specific part.. but in order to get to it again you have to get several minutes or more into the fight just to challenge it again..

I assume this would be in no way easy to program, and as for varying methods on how to handle mechanics there's no way for devs to future proof that. Still it would be appreciated to have.

I would love this as well. When we were doing E4S I was lamenting that we had to do half the fight to get to the stuff we were still learning lol

[SannaR]

This entire thread reeks of the elitism I thought we were supposed to be above.

Also wtf groups have you people been getting, I've almost never run into players who weren't playing decently (or were unwilling to accept some advice when they were clearly new and learning) and I've been mainlining leveling dungeon roulettes for weeks. My negative experiences have been mostly from mentors but that's to be expected lol

Just go and take a deep dive of tales from the duty finder thread. I solo que the DF most of the time and have played since 2.0 Beta. I've come across everything from non aoeing dps, bards that don't use both of their dots on anything but the boss, don't sing, dancers that never pick a dance partner, drgs that never give their eye to anyone even themselves, CD allergic tanks, use provoke halfway into a boss, don't put stance on until half the party is dead on the first pull. People who don't use feint or virus even if it's not at a good time to do so. I could go on listing a whole lot more, but I think you get the picture. You might not notice them, but they definitely exist.

[SannaR]

The job quests should probably actually teach you the job you're playing. Walk you through your abilities and require their use for quest completion.

Some of them do try to teach. The lv15 gla teaches you to use your Aoe skill. The npc even will repeatedly ask you to do so. The sch quest where you used to need to use leaches still will again repeatedly ask you to now use esuna. Now, I do agree not every class/job quest does this and that sometimes people don't pay attention to what gets said in the duties. Even the hall of the Novice tries to teach you things.

[Avidria]

This entire thread reeks of the elitism I thought we were supposed to be above.

Also wtf groups have you people been getting, I've almost never run into players who weren't playing decently (or were unwilling to accept some advice when they were clearly new and learning) and I've been mainlining leveling dungeon roulettes for weeks. My negative experiences have been mostly from mentors but that's to be expected lol

Most groups are decent and unremarkable, but the bad ones really stand out. I've had everything from single pull tanks with long pauses between, to healers that straight?? never healed at all? and weren't casting either like the number of healers I see just doing literal nothing is baffling??? ...To a tank who kept chain pulling entire hallways when the healer definitely couldn't handle it and didn't chill til 3 wipes and a bunch of complaining later, or the healer who ran and pulled ahead of me (the tank) when my sprint was on CD and then proceeded to run in circles around the room so I had to chase them down to pick everything up, to the run where we wiped TWICE on the dog tree boss in don mheg because no one was taking the tethers despite??? so many explanations????

Wait edit to add my favorite - this one time we had like, a ton of wipes to Forgall in Wiping City, and nobody could figure out the zombie mechanic (that I had explained four times, in increasingly detailed ways, with help from others), and it was just taking out half the group every time. And then FINALLY, after like 4 or 5 wipes, we got it. And this guy. This ONE guy. In the chat. Is like. "So how do you survive that mechanic?" I had to take a second to not actually just lie down on the floor and cry.

Anyway yeah, you run enough dungeons you'll eventually run into some wild stuff

Not much to be done for it though. You can lead a horse to water and all that... and I've never played an MMO were I didn't encounter some kind of off the wall nonsense, barring maybe Archeage and ESO purely because I didn't play them all that much and mostly stuck to myself when I did. I've been guilty of playing pretty badly myself before, too. Nobody's really immune. I pretty much just laugh it off for the most part, at this point.

[Fawkes]

I think that the best and most fair solution would be to have dungeons, trials, raids, etc. have an individual minimum DPS objective. If you fail to meet that objective you are not able to roll for loot or it doesn't count for quest completition.

Or add time objectives to dungeons, example finish within 20 minutes and you get bonus gil/exp/items, finish within 21-30 minutes and you get normal exp/gil/items, take more than 30 minutes and you don't get rewards.

The people who need the rewards the most are the ones who take the longest, though. You want to run with people who can't do their rotation AND have worse gear than what a dungeon gives?

- A dungeon where the groups of mobs respawn if you don't pull and kill them altogether (like that Guildhest no one runs) to teach tanks to do wall to wall pulls

They literally do the opposite and put gates/doors in dungeons to prevent bigger pulls, which they've been doing since ARR. They saw how people wanted to run from the start straight to the boss in Amdapor Keep and said "No".

It's under Prohibited Actions of the ToS-> Obstruction of Play. You are preventing people from progressing with the game by purposefully pulling single group of mobs.

But you're compelling a certain playstyle, which is also against the ToS.

[Kes13a]

It's under Prohibited Actions of the ToS-> Obstruction of Play. You are preventing people from progressing with the game by purposefully pulling single group of mobs.

excuse me what? you mean not progressing as fast as you want.... because last I checked, finishing the run is progressing. amount pulled depends on playstyle, so its your view that both healer and tank should be stressed because they arent going fast enough for you?

[Shurrikhan]

But you're compelling a certain playstyle, which is also against the ToS.

And the tank refusing to pull more than a single pack despite needing no more than a precast HoT or shield and a single oGCD to remain healthy throughout... isn't compelling a certain playstyle?