Please implement something to teach players how to play

[MiaShino]

Holy cannoli am I happy this forum allows for post history to be browsed. I only wished checking occurred sooner, I would have said less (thank you kind other Lala). I am sleepy but many thanks for engaging my feist and allowing me to vent some of it. Friends are sleeping and I already burdened them enough!

English speaking mentality is most unusual indeed! The term is theory of mind and I am struggling here with it. Perhaps it was upbringing or cultural stuffs but when I first started playing this or any game I learn as much as I can. I do not wish to be a burden to my team so I must play as best I can play. That there are some out there not using powerful or useful abilities because.. they do not like the way they look or chose not to read their skills astounds me. All that time I was queuing as my worst class (black mage), each time I let my umbral phase drop my stomach would follow. The whooooole day I played it each mistake brought sadness. My friends pushed me to continue playing it or I would never learn so I did, my first fight at level 60 after not playing it for months was the The Soul of the Creator.

I had only completed this once so was attempting to remember the mechanics while forming my 60 rotation within the mind, I was so so very nervous. I completely botched the opener, forgot to sharpcast my first thunder, forgot for a moment I had fire four and missed several fire 4 casts. I also forgot to remember Fire 4 and Blizzard 4 can only be cast under enochian which means I missed casts under enochian losing more deeps. "I am only five on aggro, I am wasting everyone else's time and failing the team. I am wasting my partner's time." I thought to myself.

We wipe to the phase where the tanks must limit break and laugh, the group twas super fricken friendly. We all forgot about that because many fights do not require the tank lb3 at all. I feel relieved because now I can remember what I learned during our first wipe. This time I will not forget my opener and I will not miss those two fire 4 casts. Annnnnd, I did it! Sure, I dropped enochian during phase transitions or by attempting to sneak in that extra fire 4 before fire 1 (I had no fire 3 procs ) because the add I targeted died before cast finished.

It was not towards the end of the fight that it all began to click, the rotation suddenly made sense in my mind. All because I listened to family and friends and pushed myself. I stayed alive too and avoided all avoidable damage, I only perished when we wiped yet still I felt I had done awfully. I did not even wish to look at the "damage logs" yet I did and.. I did top damage!

All that worrying, all that fear of letting the team down and now I have this thought that for all those times I felt this way someone on my team was not pressing their buttons because "I do not like how that spell looks". Huh. Thanks, I hate it?

[Jadedsins]

We wipe to the phase where the tanks must limit break and laugh, the group twas super fricken friendly. We all forgot about that because many fights do not require the tank lb3 at all. I feel relieved because now I can remember what I learned during our first wipe. This time I will not forget my opener and I will not miss those two fire 4 casts. Annnnnd, I did it! Sure, I dropped enochian during phase transitions or by attempting to sneak in that extra fire 4 before fire 1 (I had no fire 3 procs ) because the add I targeted died before cast finished.

It was not towards the end of the fight that it all began to click, the rotation suddenly made sense in my mind. All because I listened to family and friends and pushed myself. I stayed alive too and avoided all avoidable damage, I only perished when we wiped yet still I felt I had done awfully. I did not even wish to look at the "damage logs" yet I did and.. I did top damage!

All that worrying, all that fear of letting the team down and now I have this thought that for all those times I felt this way someone on my team was not pressing their buttons because "I do not like how that spell looks". Huh. Thanks, I hate it?

I never understood how people worried or felt like this over a game, but hey as long as that your way of having fun. Who am I to judge? If you want to beat yourself up over making mistakes and "failing" a group. I'm not going to judge at all. However, if you worried about grouping with players such as myself. Just build a social network and group with people you know you can depend on. That is part of the mmorpg.


If you don't have the time, and just want to use the convenience tools that builds you a group. Well just understand that a huge part of the community has players such as myself. It is not that bad

[MiaShino]

Pfffffffffffff, I figured out that Jadedsins was the wife before even finishing reading through the posts. Same style, same talking points.

Balmung > Crystal. Now I understand the meme, I thought it might be one of those things that people say and it is not really true but holy jeebus. I am tapping out "who cares as long as we complete the duty" broke the mind. It is over for me.. Mia. I will be M.I.A.

This is the only multiplayer game I have ever played where people act this way, never in all my time have I seen something so patently absurd.

World of tanks - Do not scout as light tank, party will not be pleased.
Left 4 Dead 2 - Run around throwing Molotov's at the party and you will be kicked.
CS;GO - Do not buy or get body armor and just toss smoke grenades at your own team? You will be kicked.
Overwatch - Queue as Mercy or Lucio and never heal the party or play poorly in ranked? You guessed it everybody! Kick.
Aion - Did not do many of the dungeons or "raids" here buuuuut, healers were expected to do damage and not doing it caused feist. One of the strongest pvp classes was Cleric (end game stuffs was all PVP even the raids).
Swtor - Queue as deeps into flashpoints and stand around barely doing anything? You will be yelled at then kicked.

I mean.. name one other multiplayer team based game where "playing your way" and "well we won who cares how?" would be accepted. I am too sleepy for this nonsense. I stay with what I originally said, this community has issues that transcend games. Do these players do this in all facets of life, job included? I am sorry for anyone who must work along side them.

I never understood how people worried or felt like this over a game, but hey as long as that your way of having fun. Who am I to judge? If you want to beat yourself up over making mistakes and "failing" a group. I'm not going to judge at all. However, if you worried about grouping with players such as myself. Just build a social network and group with people you know you can depend on. That is part of the mmorpg.


If you don't have the time, and just want to use the convenience tools that builds you a group. Well just understand that a huge part of the community has players such as myself. It is not that bad

"Huge part of the community has players such as myself"

"Just build a social network"

Kinda difficult to do this when see first quote. Also.. pass. I am sure you and your husbando would be happy if we sequestered ourselves away in linkshells and stopped queuing so no one would ever ask you why you do not use half of your skills anymore. I was raised better and I was raised mostly Japanese. It is obvious we do not think the way others do. Painfully obvious.

[SomeRandomHuman]

Sadly no matter how much you nudge people to perform things like Hall of the Novice you can't force them to do it without actually gating DF behind completing it.

It's a picture perfect case of the old saying: "You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make them drink it."

I'm of the mindset that after you get to the level 30 MSQ quests the soul crystal of the corresponding job becomes a permanent pre-requisite to actually do the story. Likewise When it comes to duties. I've seen too many classes instead of jobs in level 80 content.

Being new to a dungeon is one thing, but by the time you're doing ShB everyone is going to have the expectation you know how to play your job's basic rotation. If you don't that's on you and I will never hesitate to kick you if you refuse to shape up.

[Shurrikhan]

Sadly no matter how much you nudge people to perform things like Hall of the Novice you can't force them to do it without actually gating DF behind completing it.

For me, the simplest summary is that group content, even accessed via DF, ought to contain the expectations by which we want to shape the game, but group not should not be where we are first introduced to the means of meeting those expectations.

Let people hit and climb learning walls primarily on their own time and at their own pace. Group content should innovate and realign those lessons, sure, but whatever can be introduced prior via solo content, short of whatever extent would leave group content empty of then-novel mechanics, should be.

We're hoping to enjoy playing a game together, and getting the most out of it requires familiarity with certain practices. If this soccer, people ought to learn how to move and kick the ball basically solo; to pass, in low stake activities (or perhaps even among NPCs, analogously); etc., etc.

[SomeRandomHuman]

For me, the simplest summary is that group content, even accessed via DF, ought to contain the expectations by which we want to shape the game, but group not should not be where we are first introduced to the means of meeting those expectations.

Let people hit and climb learning walls primarily on their own time and at their own pace. Group content should innovate and realign those lessons, sure, but whatever can be introduced prior via solo content, short of whatever extent would leave group content empty of then-novel mechanics, should be.

We're hoping to enjoy playing a game together, and getting the most out of it requires familiarity with certain practices. If this soccer, people ought to learn how to move and kick the ball basically solo; to pass, in low stake activities (or perhaps even among NPCs, analogously); etc., etc.

While I largely agree with this there's more than a few that would rather ignore this and just jump right in and get hard-nosed at any tips and pointers. Which is why I've gotten callous about this subject. I've tried to help many times only to be "rewarded" with nasty attitude.

[Shurrikhan]

While I largely agree with this there's more than a few that would rather ignore this and just jump right in and get hard-nosed at any tips and pointers. Which is why I've gotten callous about this subject. I've tried to help many times only to be "rewarded" with nasty attitude.

Oh, same, absolutely the same. I meant that more from just a design perspective. There's so much room to ready people for group content across the game's mandatory effectively solo play time that it'd be a huge disservice not to use it to reduce otherwise increasingly likely conflicts in group activities.

[Larirawiel]

The usual suspects are out:

- Healer who stands still, doesn't deal damage, cant even keep up with healing
- DPS who single targets mobs when you have like the entire dungeon on you

Now guess why the healer cannot keep up with healing.


Sorry but too many "tanks" vastly overestimate their skill to play their class. The healer then has to mitigate this lack of skill and cannot do damage because the "tank" dropps from 100% to 15% in a fraction of a second.


The tank should always watch his own HP bar and the healer's MP bar and when it dropps fast then the pulls are too big.



Cheers

[Naoki34]

Title. (and no, the smiths outdated tutorial doesn't count)

I'm getting sick of running dungeons, trials, etc. whatever the hell content, and people just don't have a clue.

The usual suspects are out:

- Healer who stands still, doesn't deal damage, cant even keep up with healing
- DPS who single targets mobs when you have like the entire dungeon on you
- Tanks who just sit there and pull 1 group at a time
- People at max level who have no damn idea how to play their class whatsoever (example: Fire 1 Mage at level 80.)

What the hell is going on?

I've been feeling like I'm some crazy elitist just because I have an expectation that you have like an iota of competence.

IDK, detract me. Thanks.

Also, Im not going to bother trying to teach people things in game. Been there, done that. You get screamed at.

TO clarify: I'm mainly concerned about level 70-80 characters having these issues.

Do you know the mentor system?
Well, it doesn't work, because most of the mentors are also noobs who want the rare mount of random dungeons for a mentor.

It must be said that for some players, thinking that it's the game's fault goes before the fact that They are bad.
Proof of this is the number of topics of suggestion or to say that something does not work, threads of this kind are legion.
... must be reworked ...
Learn to do with what the game offers, master it instead of saying it's the game's fault, that would already be an advance.

What do you want? You can't teach people who don't want to learn to play.

[Jadedsins]

Here since people want to use "social elements" and morals as a way to act like they are in the right. I guess I will do the same.

We have older players who don't really understand or have good reflexes and is hard for them to grasp things.
We have disable people who again make it harder for them to react at times.
We have people who are just bad aka like me.


DF content is designed and caters to us. That is why it is simple, that is why harder content is made for players who want it. People want to talk about evil and selfish. How selfish can you be, going into content that is design around how we enjoy the game. Telling us we are not playing the game right! We are ruining your fun because it takes longer! Well, I hate to tell you this...but many of us don't want your help. We get through the content just fine without your feedback. And we also understand that you only giving said feedback for yourself. To get through dungeon faster.


Have you no shame? see how silly this is? Both sides got to understand, We can't meet in the middle. Your fun gets ruined because of me. My fun will get ruined because of you. Them are the breaks. That is the risk we take with DF.