Please implement something to teach players how to play

[Drakonic]

After all, I never intend to come back to this dungeon because I *don't* like group content. And that's MY playstyle...

Honestly, this is the one factor that may force me to go back to WoW...

>plays MMO
>shocked that they have to do content with other human beings.

[Drakonic]

Define 'wrong'

As a tank I keep every mob on me no dropped aggro, but I only did 1-2 packs at a time and not wall to wall. Am I wrong for going at a pace I feel comfortable with and know I will get everyone through the content.

As a DPS am I wrong for singling out that Wasp that has a near OHK first before aoeing everything the tank brought together. Does it take a few extra seconds to get through everything yes, but I killed something that could have messed up how the group was rolling.

As a healer I throw out a GCD barrier a bit more often because I want a little more 'cushion' on the tank's health just incase someone misses a wasp sting or similar, my DPS is slightly down but I minimized the chance of a hiccup, lagspike, etc screwing my healing up by being slightly proactive.

They might not be 'optimal' in many people's eyes, but are those playstyles truly 'wrong'...no.

Wrong, no. Bad, yes.

[SwordswornFox]

Wrong, no. Bad, yes.

Okay so playing with any sort of caution is bad, got it.

[Payadopa]

>plays MMO
>shocked that they have to do content with other human beings.

Exactly. Watch me playing a single player RPG and then complain about it on a forum because I'm forced to play it alone. Throw in the buzzword gatekeeping for maximum internet points.

[MrPresident]

A major problem with putting those indicators in group content is that when a player hits that wall, it affects more than just the player in question.

Meaning 1 or more of the following could happen:

1. Player with the problem assumes it's someone else. Either due to ego or ignorance

2. Player gets kicked from the dungeon by others who want to go faster - meaning the player doesn't get the ability to learn. Maybe the next group will be able to carry them past that part without any trouble.

3. Other players are impacted. Some don't mind with this happens. Others mind. And those groups don't tend to mix well.

I agree with the sentiment of this but that’s exactly WHY it would be a good thing to have some sort of proper in game tutorial early on. Because the problems you suggest are more likely to come up the further you’re into the game.

If a sprout is using the wrong moves or standing in AOEs during Sastasha I don’t think any sane person will particularly care. They’ll just give them some advice and then it’s up the them whether they listen or not. But if you’re running 70-80 content and clearly don’t have a clue what you’re doing you’re much more likely to be faced with hostility.

And you’re more likely to take even non hostile constructive criticism more poorly yourself at that stage too, as you’ve become used to playing the way you play. And as there’s no in game prompt that forces you to not spam Blizzard II for a whole dungeon and nothing else, well then why should you change right?

Having the game encourage you to learn your skill set properly and have a few more road blocks in terms of difficulty to help you do so wouldn’t lead to more kickings, it would lead to less.

[Seera1024]

I agree with the sentiment of this but that’s exactly WHY it would be a good thing to have some sort of proper in game tutorial early on. Because the problems you suggest are more likely to come up the further you’re into the game.

If a sprout is using the wrong moves or standing in AOEs during Sastasha I don’t think any sane person will particularly care. They’ll just give them some advice and then it’s up the them whether they listen or not. But if you’re running 70-80 content and clearly don’t have a clue what you’re doing you’re much more likely to be faced with hostility.

And you’re more likely to take even non hostile constructive criticism more poorly yourself at that stage too, as you’ve become used to playing the way you play. And as there’s no in game prompt that forces you to not spam Blizzard II for a whole dungeon and nothing else, well then why should you change right?

Having the game encourage you to learn your skill set properly and have a few more road blocks in terms of difficulty to help you do so wouldn’t lead to more kickings, it would lead to less.

I have no problems with things being added to the game to encourage players to get better.

They just need to not be things that require other players in order to complete them.

I also think that all characters should have their skill sets adjusted so that every class has an AoE skill that will work in Sastasha. Brand new players are more likely to take the lesson to use AoE's on mobs of 3+ a lot better than someone who is level 50.

Players shouldn't be currently half way leveled up before they even get their first AoE skill - looking at Lancer/Dragoon here. Some of the players who don't AoE as they should may be players whose first character was a Lancer/Dragoon and they spent a good chunk of their dungeon/trial/etc life not AoE's because they couldn't and therefore developed a bad habit.

[Kes13a]

I also think that all characters should have their skill sets adjusted so that every class has an AoE skill that will work in Sastasha. Brand new players are more likely to take the lesson to use AoE's on mobs of 3+ a lot better than someone who is level 50.

Players shouldn't be currently half way leveled up before they even get their first AoE skill - looking at Lancer/Dragoon here. Some of the players who don't AoE as they should may be players whose first character was a Lancer/Dragoon and they spent a good chunk of their dungeon/trial/etc life not AoE's because they couldn't and therefore developed a bad habit.

I believe part of the issue is simply people.

I would be willing to bet that a number of people dont aoe simply because its not BIG NUMBERS and so dont see the point
yes, I know the numbers add up, but not for die hard BIG NUMBER dps people, they want those huge numbers on the screen in front of them, aoes are for other people who are useless like healers or maybe a tank so they can get somethings attention.

everyone who is anyone in the dps world knows, its the deeps that keep the games running, its the deeps that kill things and heals and tanks are just someone they have to give a chance to so they can get into a dungeon or raid. lets face it, tank lb? what does it do? protects dps... healer lb? raises dps so they can kill the boss.

aoes are for the dps supporting roles... NOT dps.

(I wish to the gods that I wasnt sure there are some out there that think this lol)

[Imora]

Casual can be used either way, but casual as time investment is a completely worthless description. It's only useful if it means the type of content you engage with. If you would call someone who only logs in for an hour a week to clear Ultimate a "casual" then the word casual doesn't tell you anything about what type of player they are and there's no point in ever using the word. If someone describes themselves as a casual I'm going to think there is certain content they don't engage with, most likely because of the difficulty. Because that's what it means.

Gonna hard disagree.

That guy playing an hour a week and clearing ultimate is just more efficient with his time.

This is a hobby.

Anyone that doesn't take hobbies seriously enough to want to get decent at them should maybe find something else. It just boggles my mind. How can anyone not want to be good at things they enjoy?

And yes, I know folks that raid log. *Shrugs* i don't call quality of content the differing factor here.

All we end up with in the end is people crying they can't get PF groups or they got kicked or whatever and it's solely because they can't be bothered to take a hobby seriously enough to not be a hinderance.

I just do NOT understand it.

[TaleraRistain]

Anyone that doesn't take hobbies seriously enough to want to get decent at them should maybe find something else. It just boggles my mind. How can anyone not want to be good at things they enjoy?

"Don't you dare read a single book unless you're committing to reading 20 this week!"

People engage with their hobbies at a variety of levels. That's why they are hobbies, not jobs.

[Shurrikhan]

Anyone that doesn't take hobbies seriously enough to want to get decent at them should maybe find something else. It just boggles my mind. How can anyone not want to be good at things they enjoy?

"Don't you dare read a single book unless you're committing to reading 20 this week!"

People engage with their hobbies at a variety of levels. That's why they are hobbies, not jobs.

A more apt analogy would be to read a good psychological drama by skimming through it haphazardly, noting by its end only that you, "Heh, got some chuckles, at least," and then asking that the author better milk their comedic aspects, even if at the expense of all else... despite those aspects being the least of what was great about the book to anyone who read the whole thing.

Or, say, calling yourself a "drone enthusiast", but your only actual involvement in that is saving up several grand, buying a high-end drone, and seeing if you can fly it more than a hundred feet before wrecking it, for a change. No actual learning how to fly, no actual knowledge about or interest in the drone itself, just spending and crashing, because the thrill of potentially not destroying your hard-earned money is, for you, entertaining enough in and of itself.

By experiencing the entertainment so differently from was intended, one inevitably ends up split from everyone else and ends up having interests and preferences at odds with anyone who experienced the subject area as intended. Expect backlash.

Nope. Relatively new phenomenon in MMOs, and an atrocity.

And a reason your DPS queues get longer.

Literally present from the start, and across DnD before that. "Healer" as some mutually exclusive task set is the far newer idea -- albeit one that doesn't actually exist in the class designs themselves, but simply in the minds of those who want an excuse for time spent idle.