I hope Square doesn't keep deeming certain content unnecessary

[linayar]

Speaking of, I actually don't like when there is content that just stops but is still in the game. Guildhest and combat guildleve are two such contents. I've said in the past that combat guildleve is my favorite type of open world content, but since they're not updating it, I'd rather these two contents be removed and adjust the rewards for other contents to compensate.

I'm not sure how I feel about contents that seem to be replaced, like squadron-trust. If they roll trust to older contents, then I would be fine with removing squadron. Otherwise, I guess it could stay as it has distinguishable features, like being related to the GC.

[Jandor]

I'm not sure how I feel about contents that seem to be replaced, like squadron-trust. If they roll trust to older contents, then I would be fine with removing squadron. Otherwise, I guess it could stay as it has distinguishable features, like being related to the GC.

I really wish they'd mash those two systems together, with the GC recruits as customizable trust options. Set them up at the GC HQ, glams, AI type, etc. and then roll into the duties through the trust menu.

I also think you should get a small squad straight away, I mean I'd basically rework the GC stuff quite a bit, but that's a bit of derailment of the thread so never mind.

[linayar]

I really wish they'd mash those two systems together, with the GC recruits as customizable trust options. Set them up at the GC HQ, glams, AI type, etc. and then roll into the duties through the trust menu.

I also think you should get a small squad straight away, I mean I'd basically rework the GC stuff quite a bit, but that's a bit of derailment of the thread so never mind.

I suppose it depends on what happens post 6.0. Depending on where the story go and who our companions are moving forward, there is certainly a possibility of combining the two systems.

[Enkidoh]

I suppose it depends on what happens post 6.0. Depending on where the story go and who our companions are moving forward, there is certainly a possibility of combining the two systems.

I don't really think it's possible though for technical reasons - the Trust system works because the dungeons in ShB were specifically designed to work with the Trust system from the very beginning, and so their mechanics could accomodate the Trust AI. Pre ShB dungeons however, were never designed for that, and so the GC squad had to work around this, hence the more limited abilities they have, and why you can't just take your GC squad into any old pre ShB dungeon, there is only a very limited list available they can be used, because through much careful testing and experimentation only those dungeons SE has been able to adapt the AI to work with as good as they can, rather than the other way around (they can't mess with dungeon mechanics too much otherwise it ruins it for player parties). It's a catch-22 I'm afraid.

Certainly all new dungeons will be able to use the Trusts, and more characters will become available to be used with it (Estinien after all is confirmed to become a Trust in EW), but I do not see the GC system being ever rolled into it I'm afraid, for the aforementioned reasons.

[linayar]

Guildhests, or at least their promise/concept as curated learning scenarios (perhaps later developing towards bite-size 5-10 minute challenges), feel like they could be so damn appealing/lucrative if the effort were actually made... I really hope they revamp them rather than discontinue them entirely.

I liked them well enough, but I don't even bother unlocking/doing them on all other characters beyond my initial-now-having-long-been-deleted character as there was nothing new to them.

Guildleves, on the other hand, I'm not too sold on. Anything that gets me out into the open world is good, but I disliked everything about the system apart from its being a way to manually spawn mobs or nodes that, upon killing/gathering all, gave somewhat meaningful experience.

I'd much rather the world itself be designed in such a way as to make little mob ecosystems or playgrounds of sorts, ideally as could lead to increasing access to further, reasonably rewarding challenges with exp gathered there, such as by spawning harder mobs, triggering events, etc.

I'm open to different variations, but the manual spawning and non-competitive (maybe even cooperative) nature (IIRC) of guildleve are the features I want.

Heck, it feels like FATEs always ought to have just been a way to just clue players in to events triggered through open world systems so they could join for the bigger, more spectacle-like moments. At present, though, they've no cohesion or connection beyond the rare FATE chain...

There could be more of such links, but independent FATEs would still have to exist. Sometimes, you just want to do something without feeling like you've just started on a chain that you may not have time to complete.

I don't really think it's possible though for technical reasons - the Trust system works because the dungeons in ShB were specifically designed to work with the Trust system from the very beginning, and so their mechanics could accomodate the Trust AI. Pre ShB dungeons however, were never designed for that, and so the GC squad had to work around this, hence the more limited abilities they have, and why you can't just take your GC squad into any old pre ShB dungeon, there is only a very limited list available they can be used, because through much careful testing and experimentation only those dungeons SE has been able to adapt the AI to work with as good as they can, rather than the other way around (they can't mess with dungeon mechanics too much otherwise it ruins it for player parties). It's a catch-22 I'm afraid.

Certainly all new dungeons will be able to use the Trusts, and more characters will become available to be used with it (Estinien after all is confirmed to become a Trust in EW), but I do not see the GC system being ever rolled into it I'm afraid, for the aforementioned reasons.

That's why I talked about post 6.0. I was thinking of a combination of the two for future contents, not existing ones.

[Shurrikhan]

I'm open to different variations, but the manual spawning and non-competitive (maybe even cooperative) nature (IIRC) of guildleve are the features I want.

Here's one spitball variation, though I guess it'd be a little more like to a Behest...

There are various little rifts throughout any zone (level of pre-information TBD). Upon reaching them, or after a small process of assembling related clues in the area, you can lift your clear Guildleve glass (those stain-glass plates, though this one normally without an image) and it fills with a particular, stylized image (in old 1.x fashion alike to an exceedingly large Tarot deck), and some hints as to what would be required of you. If you then focus your Echo and peer through the glass, you are transported to a particular time in that place, and enter automatically into a short quest in an instanced space. Anyone in your party and in the zone can choose to join and be transported there automatically. No overall timer -- only that of very particular events that thematically need it -- and you can mostly exit and reenter as you please, including to do DF activities.

:: When completed, you and your party can exit the Echo through an interactable rift, to the position of that rift in the "uninstanced" world, or exit via the UI to return to their previous positions from which they entered.

Alternatively, Guildleves as... Bounties, of sorts. No timer or the like, as not to punish queuing or swapping over to FATEs. Instead, you simply have additional Key Items by which to spawn particular enemies, and certain gatherables and nodes are uniquely visible to you.

There could be more of such links, but independent FATEs would still have to exist. Sometimes, you just want to do something without feeling like you've just started on a chain that you may not have time to complete.

We could say the same for anything. "Sometimes you just want to gain a level without feeling like you've started on a leveling progression you may not have time to complete." Etc., etc.

Chains don't give outright compounding experience. They're just related FATEs that sometimes unlock a FATE that's meant to be more challenging and thus more rewarding.

My point was just I feel the world shouldn't just be... stagnant... outside of FATEs. Rather, the FATEs themselves should just be proof of the zone's motion, calling attention to any of its many strands when they give opportunity for bigger spectacles or larger-scale combat.

[linayar]

Chains don't give outright compounding experience. They're just related FATEs that sometimes unlock a FATE that's meant to be more challenging and thus more rewarding.

And I'm not against that, but sometimes I just want to get to the most rewarding and challenging FATE without having to do previous FATEs (or worse, wait for others to do them and just join at the end).

The point here is that I just feel like the world shouldn't be stagnant outside of FATEs. Rather, the FATEs themselves should just be proof of the zone's motion, calling attention to any of its many strands when they give opportunity for bigger spectacles or larger-scale combat.

I don't mind more of that, just not all.

[Shurrikhan]

Speaking of, I actually don't like when there is content that just stops but is still in the game. Guildhest and combat guildleve are two such contents. I've said in the past that combat guildleve is my favorite type of open world content, but since they're not updating it, I'd rather these two contents be removed and adjust the rewards for other contents to compensate.

I'm not sure how I feel about contents that seem to be replaced, like squadron-trust. If they roll trust to older contents, then I would be fine with removing squadron. Otherwise, I guess it could stay as it has distinguishable features, like being related to the GC.

Guildhests, or at least their promise/concept as curated learning scenarios (perhaps later developing towards bite-size 5-10 minute challenges), feel like they could be so damn appealing/lucrative if the effort were actually made... I really hope they revamp them rather than discontinue them entirely.

Guildleves, on the other hand, I'm not too sold on. Anything that gets me out into the open world is good, but I disliked everything about the system apart from its being a way to manually spawn mobs or nodes that, upon killing/gathering all, gave somewhat meaningful experience.

I'd much rather the world itself be designed in such a way as to make little mob ecosystems or playgrounds of sorts, ideally as could lead to increasing access to further, reasonably rewarding challenges with exp gathered there, such as by spawning harder mobs, triggering events, etc.

Heck, it feels like FATEs always ought to have just been a way to just clue players in to events triggered through open world systems so they could join for the bigger, more spectacle-like moments. At present, though, they've no cohesion or connection beyond the rare FATE chain...

________

As for Squadrons and Trusts, I'm hoping they revamp Trusts to work for HW and StB. I disagree with Enkidoh (below) that there's any sort of hard block to such. If you need a Trust character to teleport to make a preestablished mechanic work out, so be it. That said, I'd also like the option of choosing from among my Squadron (or setting a default party who would then be added to the Trust menu) for that content span, and wouldn't mind the ability to order Trusts around just as one would for their Squadron. I'd like to combine the two systems, as you said.

[Fland]

Speaking of, I actually don't like when there is content that just stops but is still in the game. Guildhest and combat guildleve are two such contents. I've said in the past that combat guildleve is my favorite type of open world content, but since they're not updating it, I'd rather these two contents be removed and adjust the rewards for other contents to compensate.

I'm not sure how I feel about contents that seem to be replaced, like squadron-trust. If they roll trust to older contents, then I would be fine with removing squadron. Otherwise, I guess it could stay as it has distinguishable features, like being related to the GC.

Combat guildleves and guildhests are mostly for new players still levelling up. They will always be "new" contents to new players just starting.

[Goji1639]

I'm not sure how I feel about contents that seem to be replaced, like squadron-trust. If they roll trust to older contents, then I would be fine with removing squadron. Otherwise, I guess it could stay as it has distinguishable features, like being related to the GC.

Squadrons are a lot better than trusts; a fully leveled squadron all set to offense clears dungeons faster than most DF groups, so replacing it with trusts would gimp our ability to level 1-60.