Open World PvP

[Krotoan]

The op didn't say that playing in an open world environment where these things would be possible shouldn't be opt-in.

Please explain in way would you be able to do most of what they want if the other person had a choice of participation in the matter?
Killing people who disagree or are doing something they disapprove of? Given SOME may accept this as a valid risk if they had signed up for a PVP server in the first place. OP is very much speaking about a population they disagree with (and has specifically mentioned them) who mostly likes being left alone and would very very likely be opting OUT of this system if at all possible to continue to have their fun unmolested.

Killing people in the overworld while they quest?
"encourages partying while overworld questing"
Implicit risk says that this ISN'T something you could opt out of or you'd just turn it off to get the quests done.

I'm not saying OPT-IN PVP is bad. I'm saying what the OP wants is basically griefing. Not even veiled. They just want to grief players they disagree with and I can and will voice my distaste of it and raise a voice to say that as a player, I do not want this.

I mean let us be real that is what you are saying cause in practice that is what often pvp boils down to someone better picking on another because the objective is to kill the other person.

Often followed by enjoyment for winning the match or having fun killing them.

Liking PVP can involve: Enjoying a contest between players knowing you're up against a human instead of a script or AI. Enjoying winning. Enjoying knowing that at the end of a FAIR contest you are the more skilled player.

Bullying always involves: Using a stronger position to antagonize someone weaker.


PVP CAN involve bullying but it is not in itself bullying. If the aspect you most enjoy of PVP is finding weaker players with no chance to defend themselves and constantly killing them, then you are enjoying bullying.

[Awha]

Please explain in way would you be able to do most of what they want if the other person had a choice of participation in the matter?
Killing people who disagree or are doing something they disapprove of? Given SOME may accept this as a valid risk if they had signed up for a PVP server in the first place. OP is very much speaking about a population they disagree with (and has specifically mentioned them) who mostly likes being left alone and would very very likely be opting OUT of this system if at all possible to continue to have their fun unmolested.

Killing people in the overworld while they quest?
"encourages partying while overworld questing"
Implicit risk says that this ISN'T something you could opt out of or you'd just turn it off to get the quests done.

I'm not saying OPT-IN PVP is bad. I'm saying what the OP wants is basically griefing. Not even veiled. They just want to grief players they disagree with and I can and will voice my distaste of it and raise a voice to say that as a player, I do not want this.




Liking PVP can involve: Enjoying a contest between players knowing you're up against a human instead of a script or AI. Enjoying winning. Enjoying knowing that at the end of a FAIR contest you are the more skilled player.

Bullying always involves: Using a stronger position to antagonize someone weaker.


PVP CAN involve bullying but it is not in itself bullying. If the aspect you most enjoy of PVP is finding weaker players with no chance to defend themselves and constantly killing them, then you are enjoying bullying.

Let us be real outside of strict setting like ranked or a competitive mode one team will generally always put up against a weaker team. Especially if premades are involved, and wpvp is no different if people attack another’s from a more advantage position. PvP and bullying should never go hand in hand since that is just the nature of PvP.

Taking advantage of the weakest link or using an advantage is not bullying and each of those can still be found enjoyable. The aspect of bullying and PvP should never go hand in hand since that is a stance that could never be proven unless the person doing the action states otherwise it will always be based around an assumption of the person who was defeated.

I get the idea where you are coming from but as someone that enjoy competitive PvP in games like EOS, WoW, and Tor your notion is a lofty dream the reality is as mentioned outside strict environments the parameters you put forth are already ever met. Especially because those who are skilled tend to be friend other skilled players in their respective games and thus stack the odds in their favor.

While I do not think it is your stance one could say your stance views premades with stacked players are nothing but bullies because they enjoy playing with friends.

[Artemiz]

You should probably read the thread. I get from that diatribe that you think you're so smart and informed that you don't need to but you really should. You might understand my position then and given your awful attitude I won't be repeating it to you, or replying any further.

[Taliriah]

You should probably read the thread.

Not worth my time. I've had more than my fill of extremely bad faith argumentation from gaming forums over the years.

[Caurcas]

You're jumping into a thread that is 58 pages long and just bringing up points that have already been discussed at length. Even the post above yours points out how opt-in is far from a perfect solution. The original thread isn't even asking for opt-in, its asking to inflict it on the entire player base.

Also, I absolutely will judge a bully and make zero apologies for doing so.

Where is this bully of which you speak? Do they actually exist, or is it a constructed bully?

[Artemiz]

Where is this bully of which you speak? Do they actually exist, or is it a constructed bully?

You want PvP because you think "might is right" and you want to "deal with" pf groups you don't like on a PvP server which is forced onto a PvE player base. And that's just the OP. Do I need to say more?

[NW3]

This thread serves one real purpose. SE, you cannot ignore that there is an interest in PvP amongst your paying customers. I hope it gets your required attention: cheating, less gear/content with each expansion, etc.

Can we omit medals altogether in Feast?

You can outfrag the other team convincingly and still lose if you don't pick up medals? Why not just make it about frags? You make every tank the errand-runner of having to pick up medals in lieu of fighting. Imagine losing because you didn't pick up medals... well it happened.

When you can ask yourself will any new player coming into Feast know he has to pick up medals after a frag and answer that question truthfully, well ask yourself what other game requires us to pick up anything after a frag?

[Caurcas]

You want PvP because you think "might is right" and you want to "deal with" pf groups you don't like on a PvP server which is forced onto a PvE player base. And that's just the OP. Do I need to say more?

How is that bullying? Just because I want the chance to solve things by my own hand? Meanwhile the parties I am opposed to might well prove more strong than myself. I don't see the bullying.

[Artemiz]

How is that bullying? Just because I want the chance to solve things by my own hand? Meanwhile the parties I am opposed to might well prove more strong than myself. I don't see the bullying.

Well, might is right is self evidently the mindset of a bully. As for the party finder groups thing, I'm no Inspector Clouseau but even I can work out you want to chase ERP groups around the housing zones in a pack. You can't do it alone so you would have to take the "regulators". Even if they are breaking the TOS that would still be harassment and bullying, they don't want to fight you, they want to do........yeah. Your responsibility as a player, and an adult is to report them, not turn into Billy the Kid.

[Caurcas]

Well, might is right is self evidently the mindset of a bully. As for the party finder groups thing, I'm no Inspector Clouseau but even I can work out you want to chase ERP groups around the housing zones in a pack. You can't do it alone so you would have to take the "regulators". Even if they are breaking the TOS that would still be harassment and bullying, they don't want to fight you, they want to do........yeah. Your responsibility as a player, and an adult is to report them, not turn into Billy the Kid.

I dunno the Siren county war sounds like a heck of a party.