Dark Knight Megathread

[Kalaam]

Bloodspiller will now be a 20s recast with 6 stacks, look forward to it.

[mallleable]

It'd be hilarious if they like changed Shake to only be a personal buff, and removed Nascent Flash, and were just like 'yup WAR is a selfish job for selfish players glhf.'

[Mayhemmer]

It'd be hilarious if they like changed Shake to only be a personal buff, and removed Nascent Flash, and were just like 'yup WAR is a selfish job for selfish players glhf.'

Well, sure. That'd make sence to me, from a job fantasy and lore standpoint, though I know the devs just don't give a damn about jobs sticking to their thematic roots anymore. Shouldn't WAR be a selfish tank, that does big damage and life-steal? I think it should be. PLD and DRK are the ones with lore themed around protecting people.

[Jidka]

What if Dark Arts also grant 100 potency healing on GCD attacks ? (or even on every enemy attacked ?)
That way, DRK would have self healing until they choose to consume it to refill Darkside.

[Oizen]

It'd be hilarious if they like changed Shake to only be a personal buff, and removed Nascent Flash, and were just like 'yup WAR is a selfish job for selfish players glhf.'

Well honestly I think they're going to HAVE to nerf both WAR and PLD pretty heavily in the party sustain area, the big stink we had about TOP and P12S being cleared healerless as current content both have a commonality of swapping those healers over to extra PLDs and WARs.


Bad things will happen if we don't deal with this now and we keep powercreeping in this direction.

What if Dark Arts also grant 100 potency healing on GCD attacks ? (or even on every enemy attacked ?)
That way, DRK would have self healing until they choose to consume it to refill Darkside.

It would definately go a long way in helping DRK sustain itself, but a lot of DRK's sustain issues actually come into play in content that does JUST ENOUGH damage to be threatening but not enough to break TBN.

In which this would just make TBN not breaking feel even more shit. If we did what you suggested but also allowed the Dark Arts stack to always be given like the HoC healing, it be a very welcome change.

[Absurdity]

Well honestly I think they're going to HAVE to nerf both WAR and PLD pretty heavily in the party sustain area, the big stink we had about TOP and P12S being cleared healerless as current content both have a commonality of swapping those healers over to extra PLDs and WARs.


Bad things will happen if we don't deal with this now and we keep powercreeping in this direction.

The problem with TOP weren't solely those jobs, although they definitely need to nerf their party sustain. It was the combination of all jobs with healing to cycle through and nonexistent sustained party damage in the fight. Redmage, Reaper, Dancer and Summoner all bring not only some fairly decent healing but also mitigation utility, with monk providing a 10% buff for all of their healing actions.

Everlasting Flight is 700 AoE cure potency over 21 seconds every 2 minutes
Rekindle is another 1400 single-target cure potency over 15 seconds (provided the target drops below 75% which isn't very hard to achieve)
Curing Waltz is 600 AoE cure potency every 60 seconds
Arcane Crest is 250 AoE cure potency over 15 seconds every 30 seconds
Shake is 800 AoE cure potency over 15 seconds every 2 minutes on top of the 15% barrier
And of course Nascent Flash with it's ridiculous 1600 single-target cure potency every 25 seconds.

I left out Vercure and Clemency since those come at the cost of DPS, everything listed is just free healing.
Warrior's healing is certainly overtuned but it wasn't carrying that no-healer kill on it's own, especially since they only had 1 warrior.
Sustain, especially AoE healing, on all the non-healer jobs needs some looking at.

[Supersnow845]

Really TBN has the right idea, you shouldn’t get the excog on HOC for free (same as the regen on holy Shelton and the healing on bloodwhetting)

Tank mitigations should be about using them at the right time, the whole “well GNB gets it for free so DRK should as well” mindset is what’s messing up the entire support role because the healers have the same problem

[Oizen]

Really TBN has the right idea, you shouldn’t get the excog on HOC for free (same as the regen on holy Shelton and the healing on bloodwhetting)

Tank mitigations should be about using them at the right time, the whole “well GNB gets it for free so DRK should as well” mindset is what’s messing up the entire support role because the healers have the same problem

I agree but we're a bit too far beyond that at this point. I really can't see them nerfing the other 3 lv 82 tank mits, it would piss off a lot of people.

[ItsUrBoi]

For sure job changes have already been made, however, as SMN got a last minute rework in 6.0, I hope SE sees this and considers maybe giving DRK a slight rework in 7.0 or 7.1, as they had removed too much in the 5.0 rework.

Here are some ideas to change existing actions:
- Combine Dark Mind into Oblation. Too many buttons that should do the same thing, lowering the CD per charge to 45 seconds might help.
- Combine Carve and Spit and Abyssal Drain together into a new oGCD that heals and does high potency damage to 1st target, with fall off for other targets.

New stuff:
- Add another combo after Syphon Strike, that generates Bloodgauge over time, so you can alternate between Souleater and this new button, or a high potency attack like Goring Blade.
- Change Delirium to grants something unique instead of Inner Release copy. Stormblood's version that extended other buffs was cool in my opinion.
- Add a new ability that heals you ( old Sole Survivor was pretty interesting, or old Blood price )
- Job action timers can be 40 seconds too, increased frequency is very nice!
- Living Shadow is kind of boring as it doesn't exactly copy your actions nor does it do anything under your control, maybe a RPR style enshroud effect would be better, but suited to tank?
- 2 job gauges is an alright concept but only on jobs that have something else as their identity ( ex: Ninja's mudras ). Darkside feels incomplete and the Bloodgauge is too similar to Warrior.

PLD is the Confiteur combo tank, GNB is the 30 second Gnashing Fang and Continuation tank, Warrior is the Inner Release tank, DRK is kind of left out...

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

For sure job changes have already been made, however, as SMN got a last minute rework in 6.0, I hope SE sees this and considers maybe giving DRK a slight rework in 7.0 or 7.1, as they had removed too much in the 5.0 rework.

Here are some ideas to change existing actions:
- Combine Dark Mind into Oblation. Too many buttons that should do the same thing, lowering the CD per charge to 45 seconds might help.
- Combine Carve and Spit and Abyssal Drain together into a new oGCD that heals and does high potency damage to 1st target, with fall off for other targets.

Carve & Spit / Abyssal Drain merge, sure whatever though I prefer if Carve & Spit didn't get deleted as I like the animation of the skill.

As for the Dark Mind + Oblation merge - for the love of god, can we stop suggesting this? Dark Mind's only issue, if anything, is that unlike GNB's camouflage it does zero and null on physical damage; a problem Addle & Feint have been addressed on by simply giving half of the other type's mitigation as well. Doing so would make Dark Mind not completely dedge for physical purposes (dungeon pulls among many things).

And seriously, Oblation is great because it is versatile and gives you choices without having to sacrifice access to DM. Sure it isn't the best Lv82 gain vs other tanks, but it really does not need to be merged so we reach an arbitrary amount of mitigation buttons per tank. Could consider a 400p heal once it expires, similar to that AST mitigation from EW.

New stuff:
- Add another combo after Syphon Strike, that generates Bloodgauge over time, so you can alternate between Souleater and this new button, or a high potency attack like Goring Blade.
- Change Delirium to grants something unique instead of Inner Release copy. Stormblood's version that extended other buffs was cool in my opinion.
- Add a new ability that heals you ( old Sole Survivor was pretty interesting, or old Blood price )
- Job action timers can be 40 seconds too, increased frequency is very nice!
- Living Shadow is kind of boring as it doesn't exactly copy your actions nor does it do anything under your control, maybe a RPR style enshroud effect would be better, but suited to tank?
- 2 job gauges is an alright concept but only on jobs that have something else as their identity ( ex: Ninja's mudras ). Darkside feels incomplete and the Bloodgauge is too similar to Warrior.

PLD is the Confiteur combo tank, GNB is the 30 second Gnashing Fang and Continuation tank, Warrior is the Inner Release tank, DRK is kind of left out...

• The Blood-over-time idea is interesting. Maybe not just BoT but also a HoT opposed to Souleater's direct Blood + Heal?
• Stormblood Delirium was based and I'd happily take the Blood-MP interplay back in a heartbeat.
• Bloodbath (lol). The job naming everything darkness and blood doesn't have access to Bloodbath, which is weird. Personally I'd prefer a PvP style DRK, but the players will never be ready for it in PvE. (for reference - HP spending would be limited but DPS-efficient, so no you wouldn't enslave your healers into dps-fodder for you)
• 40s, 45s, 80s. Good times with these. 40s BW, 80s Delirium, giving you 47.5% haste uptime. And placable Salted Earth on 45s CD. Wish Salted had a bit more than just that (see PvP).
• I saw an idea about making Living Shadow actually copy certain things you do, similar to Bunshin but on steroids. OGCDs included and with maintenance upkeep. Was a really cool idea.
• Bloodgauge could use different spenders than Bloodspiller and Living Shadow. Also frankly, Bloodspiller today and Bloodspiller back then feel nowhere alike. Back then a 540p DA-Bloodspiller was absolutely massive, today with 510p Carve, 460p EoS and 600p Shadowbringers, Bloodspiller feels like a drop in the bucket.

As for Darkside - Darkside spenders/drainers. Could link to the living shadow idea perhaps. We had this concept for Geirskogul in HW Dragoon. It was a nice concept, but the issue was the randomized access to the Blood of the Dragon time generators.

We had our identity - the Haste tank with weaponskill enhancement. The tank who had resource interplay (MP <--> Blood). DRK tourists at the time didn't like it and we had to pay for it. All they had to do to tone down the "spamminess" of Dark Arts was +50% the cost and potency gains from it. I like EoS and Shadowbringer in aesthetic, but I lost too much to be happy about them and they are bland.