Dark Knight Megathread

[ArthurATDayne]

I fear that putting that healing trait on delirium would not be that helpful. We would still need to go into delirium for burst phase in the rotation so while that would be a helpful heal, it would likely happen at a "fixed" time.
Now if we had a dark art buff that gives some abilities a healing effect, we'd get some control over *when* to get that heal. DA Abyssal drain applying a Hot/DoT (pseudo draining the target's HP) so it becomes a useful skill against bosses for example.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love for a button that specifically grants an On Demand Heal whether in a damage burst phase or Not i.e. GNB's Aurora or WAR Equilibrium but baking in a Weakness/Con/Drawback of some sort like with Delirium being mostly used in Rotation anyway & requiring melee range landing Weaponskills on a boss/mobs seems easier to sell to SquareEnix than just a direct oGCD Self Heal Button without any drawbacks or conditions.

I'd also like for Dark Mind & Oblation to just be 1 60s CD skill that can be used for reduce All Damage types or even an HP Bubble shield too. There's a certain combination of intended gameplay, logic and neglect from SquareEnix on how Dark Knight should be played, I'm trying to understand why they did things the way they did and hopefully push the right buttons too.

Who knows, maybe after reading all this there will be a new quickie patch a few months after Endwalker Release:

"After reviewing all Feedback we have decided to replace Enhanced Unmend with Enhanced Living Dead: While under the Effect of Walking Dead, Restores Health 1200 Potency. You still need to be healed 100% of your HP though while under effects of Walking Dead or you DIE. We hope this will address HP Sustain requests, Thank You, Love & Kisses SquareEnix"

[shao32]

Im seeing a few request to remove MP cost from TBN lately and i have to say that's not easy to do, first of all bcs TBN is tied to the Dark arts proc wich have a gauge tied to it (useless gauge all being said) so thats means rework the whole proc mechanic or delete it but at the same time they can't bcs thet need to keep Dark arts name somehow on the jobs bcs is a signature skill on the job identity across the various FF games at the same time they will delete the literally only mechanic the job has and rework it means they have to actually put some brain cells on design the job even for that thing and i doubt they are going to get in to that at all, in other word it's a corner im pretty sure they aren't willing to work on it.

For self healing bring back Sole survivor, during his duration (10s) DRK get a heal of idk, 100p per GCD hit and heal the job with a cure of 700p when sole survivor fades off, 100p x5 + 700p when the effect fades off 1200p selfhealing every 60s aviable when you want, meh idk why i even think on it when i know it's never going to happen, boring evening don't mind me.

[ArthurATDayne]

Im seeing a few request to remove MP cost from TBN lately and i have to say that's not easy to do, first of all bcs TBN is tied to the Dark arts proc wich have a gauge tied to it (useless gauge all being said) so thats means rework the whole proc mechanic or delete it but at the same time they can't bcs thet need to keep Dark arts name somehow on the jobs bcs is a signature skill on the job identity across the various FF games at the same time they will delete the literally only mechanic the job has and rework it means they have to actually put some brain cells on design the job even for that thing and i doubt they are going to get in to that at all, in other word it's a corner im pretty sure they aren't willing to work on it.

For self healing bring back Sole survivor, during his duration (10s) DRK get a heal of idk, 100p per GCD hit and heal the job with a cure of 700p when sole survivor fades off, 100p x5 + 700p when the effect fades off 1200p selfhealing every 60s aviable when you want, meh idk why i even think on it when i know it's never going to happen, boring evening don't mind me.

Something something from the Dark Knight Job Quest about Love making all the suffering and pain bearable and fueling the willingness to fight against the injustice of it all. Something something about Light born out of the Darkness.

Or maybe it's the Copium Dark Knight players all having a puff of. We can hope and cope.

[Kalaam]

Im seeing a few request to remove MP cost from TBN lately and i have to say that's not easy to do, first of all bcs TBN is tied to the Dark arts proc wich have a gauge tied to it (useless gauge all being said) so thats means rework the whole proc mechanic or delete it but at the same time they can't bcs thet need to keep Dark arts name somehow on the jobs bcs is a signature skill on the job identity across the various FF games at the same time they will delete the literally only mechanic the job has and rework it means they have to actually put some brain cells on design the job even for that thing and i doubt they are going to get in to that at all, in other word it's a corner im pretty sure they aren't willing to work on it.

For self healing bring back Sole survivor, during his duration (10s) DRK get a heal of idk, 100p per GCD hit and heal the job with a cure of 700p when sole survivor fades off, 100p x5 + 700p when the effect fades off 1200p selfhealing every 60s aviable when you want, meh idk why i even think on it when i know it's never going to happen, boring evening don't mind me.

Make Dark Art an action that lights up the gauge to remind you that it's ok.
You know like for Living Shadow that gets a full on gauge too. And boom, you can make TBN 25s CD with another type of effect, like giving 50 Blood. Or spreading its remaining shield to party members if it doesn't break I dunno

[shao32]

Make Dark Art an action that lights up the gauge to remind you that it's ok.
You know like for Living Shadow that gets a full on gauge too. And boom, you can make TBN 25s CD with another type of effect, like giving 50 Blood. Or spreading its remaining shield to party members if it doesn't break I dunno

That would make the proc a clear dps gain wich is not a bad thing per se but considering how useless is the whole Darkside mechanic having that extra edge means very little outside of having more fluff for the shake of having more fluff saddly.

leaving that apart TBN shouln't ever grant any resource if it's free bcs it would make it being used on ecast instead of when you need it bcs damage, in any case grant a small heal or a micro regen of 5s, something defensive not ofensive to avoid that.

Something something from the Dark Knight Job Quest about Love making all the suffering and pain bearable and fueling the willingness to fight against the injustice of it all. Something something about Light born out of the Darkness.

Or maybe it's the Copium Dark Knight players all having a puff of. We can hope and cope.

Copium for sure, while im practicaly have absolutely no trust at all on Yoshi and his team on DRK im stupid enough to keep fighting for it bcs my inside refuse to give up.

[ArthurATDayne]

The Devs certainly don't have it easy and neither do DRK players.

So say TBN gets nerfed to 25s CD 7s Duration, now our Mitigation uptime & Potential Dark Arts procs are severely reduced like cutdown in Half and we create new problems:

Original TBN 15s CD 7s Duration is 28s Potential Uptime within 1 Minute while a nerfed TBN 25s CD is 14s Potential Uptime within 1 Minute

From 70-80 (because we get TBN at 70) when TBN is on CD for 25s...

Personal All Purpose All Damage Type Mitigation options are just 2 Skills Rampart 90s CD 20% Reduced Damage & Shadow Wall 120s CD 30% Reduced Damage

Personal Magic Damage Only Mitigation option is Dark Mind 60s 20% Reduced Magic Damage :/

Party & Personal Magic Damage Only Mitigation option is Dark Missionary 90s CD 10% Reduced Magic Damage that DRK also fall back on

Loss of potentially half the Dark Arts Procs from 2 25s CD TBN usage within a minute instead of original 4 15s CD is partially compensated by additional Edge/Flood of Shadow if TBN no longer costs mana.

So now what are we going to do about BOTH Mitigation and/or HP Sustain AND loss of Dark Arts Procs? Merely More Blood or Mana for Damage while ignoring the other obvious problem? What about Mitigation and/or HP Sustain?

Because of how TBN works by putting up a 25% Max HP Shield and thus Preventing Damage Taken Outright, The Devs seemed to chose DRK's On Demand HP Heal to Reduce compared to PLD/WAR/GNB so it's an intentional DRK Weakness that, to them, is balanced against TBN.

As much as I joke about Devs I do like how they seem to at least look at the whole kit sometimes so there's some method to the madness.

If anyone is calling for TBN's CD to get nerfed to 25s, I'm demanding at least an additional 15-20% high uptime Mitigation Button of some sort, like a Max HP Bubble or All Damage Types Reduced, or something baked into TBN as a Trait i.e. After TBN expires or pops, Apply a 15% Reduced Damage Taken buff for 10s and/or Heal Over Time to smooth out damage taken either by directly reducing/preventing/healing through it. Must be available at level 70 at the latest.

Or a straight up No Conditions Attached 1000 to 1200 Potency On Demand Heal as part of the deal. Must be available at level 70 at the latest.

And adjustments to either Mana Sustain or Cost of Edge/Flood skills so we can cast an additional 1 or 2 per Minute.

[baklava151]

Happy 1000 posts

My random shower thought today was about Salt and Darkness, what do you all think about making it a 5 sec CD but costing 10 Blood to use and doing 150 potency per hit? I don't know if I'd add it to current EW DRK since it'll only make the opener even more bloated, but in a vacuum I think would be more interesting than the current S&D

[Kalaam]

We really need a way to make use of DarkSide as a ressource. The ressource management of DRK was always the fun part.
If we had to be careful about having enough manage to use edge/flood to prolong DarkSide all the while spending it as much as possible on some skills (dark art enhancements or others) it'd be great I think.
I mean, maybe Living Shadow should cost DarkSide instead of Blood (even makes more sense lorewise). So we'd basically have to try and keep darkside between 31 and 60s when Living Shadow comes off CD, takes 30s out of it, etc etc. Meaning we'd have to keep enough mana saved for it, between spending other abilities.

[ArthurATDayne]

We really need a way to make use of DarkSide as a ressource. The ressource management of DRK was always the fun part.
If we had to be careful about having enough manage to use edge/flood to prolong DarkSide all the while spending it as much as possible on some skills (dark art enhancements or others) it'd be great I think.
I mean, maybe Living Shadow should cost DarkSide instead of Blood (even makes more sense lorewise). So we'd basically have to try and keep darkside between 31 and 60s when Living Shadow comes off CD, takes 30s out of it, etc etc. Meaning we'd have to keep enough mana saved for it, between spending other abilities.

I like this, now we're talking serious DRK business. I rather it use the Darkside Timer as well because it kind of fits thematically, something about using up our Time as resource and also...

Living Shadow using 50 Blood AND 120s CD is Clunky because it's competing with Bloodspiller & Quietus which DRK players tend to reflexively spam as needed whenever there's enough Blood to spend outside of Delirium.

So sometimes or all the time, whenever Living Shadow is ready to use, the DRK player ends up hitting a Bloodspiller/Quietus by reflex before the brain registers that it's optimal to use Living Shadow now.

Oops, time to get another 50 blood for Living Shadow, maybe I'll remember to use it next mob or boss? It feels a bit jarring not to spam Bloodspiller/Quietus when I can just so I can Stop to use Living Shadow, like I'm stopping my flow of combat so I can summon it, he takes his sweet ass time posing and flexing before moving slowly to the targets to fight.

100% support Living Shadow using 30s of Darkside Timer. He's a professional time waster already.

[Malthir]

We really need a way to make use of DarkSide as a ressource. The ressource management of DRK was always the fun part.

I agree, I've posted this before as a suggested change that would actually make Darkights engaging again imo.

Dark Knight Changes:

Remove the auto darkside and turn it into an OGCD toggle

When not in darkside all moves give mana back

When in darkside mana is constantly drained, the final move in the weaponskill combo and all OGCD all cost mana but all heal the Dark Knight.

Obviously numbers for this need balancing to not make it OP but ideally keep the cost of the abilities low but keep the constant mana drain moderate, the aim would be to balance the mana gain outside of darkside with mana cost of being in darkside, similar to the original design.

Take quietus and bloodspiller off the blood meter

Unlink C&S and Abysall drain

Remove the current delirium and bring back the old weaponskill

New move Overwhelming Darkness to replace living dead. Fills all darknight resources mana/blood/darkside meter, resources and health regen increased massively overtime for 15 seconds after 15seconds all meters are zero'd regardless of state when the ability ends and all gain for these meters are blocked for 5seconds.

Moveset Change:
Weaponskills to reflect what stance you're in. None darkside you're effectively just using a greatsword, in darkside you start using some of the more darkness themed moves.

None Darkside weaponskill combo
1 Hard slash
2 Syphon strike
3 Delirum

In Darkside weaponskill combo
1 Souleater
2 Powerslash (our old combo finisher where we shot the blast from the hand)
3 Bloodspiller

OGCD non darkside
1. Unmend is now a OGCD
2. Scourge (bring it back)
3. Spinning slash (now aoe and a OCGD)
4: Carve and slice reduce cooldown to 18 seconds reduce damage
5: Plunge no change

OGCD darkside
1. Unmend becomes Abyssal drain
2. Scouge becomes Quietus
3. Spinning slash becomes Flood of Shadow
4. Carve and slice becomes Edge of Shadow
5. Plunge no change
6. Shadow bringer unchanged

UI Class bar changes

The counter for darkside is now the darkest night counter, instead of counting down it counts up while you're in darkside for however long you were in darkside. This is the resource pool for TBN and living shadow, at 50 is used to cast TBN, living shadow can be triggered any point over 50 but last longer the more you use. Add in a second press to living shadow allowing the DRK to destroy the shadow early to return a portion of the cost to the counter.

Keep the blood gauge but give us a move that lets you absorb a portion of the blood gauge to either give a chunk of mana or heal depending on whether you're in darkside or not you could use the old dark arts animation for it.
(In a later change I would like to see this as a modifier like dark arts was adding de buffs but would require lots of work.)