Final Fantasy XIV and a Culture of Enabling

[NanaWiloh]

This seems like it needs to be said but, if you value performance. Then entering
the duty finder with a parser running is just asking for disappointment.

[LaughingBanana]

Reading this thread, I am reminded on that famous proverb;

What's it sound, eh, "You run into an asshole in the morning, you ran into an asshole. You run into assholes all day, you're the asshole."

Yeah, that's it.

[TaleraRistain]

By the Twelve, is this thread still going?

I've been playing since 2014. I've mained WHM since 2014. And being in small FCs or no FCs in that time, I've done PUGs 99% of the time since 2014. I don't take long breaks. I play almost every day. I couldn't guess the number of instanced runs I've had over 7 years, but it's a lot.

I can count on one hand the number of times in 7 years I've had to either leave a full group or kick someone. I've had runs of all types. Some went smooth as silk. Some were as bad as you could get and still clear. These mystical, magical amounts of afk people or hour long runs just sound like fairy tales to me. The vast majority of my experiences are fairly easy runs with little drama. I've had small pull tanks. I've had dps that was a bit low. The rare times I was on dps, I had healers who struggled some. But instead of complaining, we worked with what we had, the stronger players helped shore up the weaker ones, and we got through.

My experience is completely in my control. If I'm lazy and let the game decide that for me, then I don't have any room to be complaining. I didn't bother putting in the work to craft the experience I would have preferred. Therefore, I don't punish others who had no idea of whatever my exacting requirements were when they queued into the same Duty Finder queue as I did. Just like they don't punish me because I don't completely share their viewpoint. We find a way to work together as a team.

I personally feel like a much stronger player because of it, since hardly any groups phase me now. I just roll up my sleeves and get to work. Seems like a lot of people in this thread could benefit from trying that sometime instead of being afraid to have anything but the absolute perfect experience.

[Mykll]

Not a very good parallel because at that point the focus of the question shifts, how many people actually know such an option exists and do you know how many people know said option existed when you referenced it in your first post?
Do you know if you're the norm or the outlier in this situation, how do you know everyone else just doesn't use the base settings of the forums? If something is more commonly true than not true then that is the norm until otherwise.

Hasn't the focus of this thread shifted, from is there a problem period and what to do, to now how much of a problem is it? For each person that states the problem is happening all day every day, to those that notice fluctuations of the quality of runs but almost never bad enough to kick people, which one is the norm? Does anyone know the norm? No, they only know from their own personal point of view. Just like I know from my point of view, almost all forum software has this option, and pretty much day 1 on any forum I set it to max. No clue what percentage uses whatever setting. But I do know enough that different people use different settings, from anything specific to default. Just like in this thread, and the other one about tolerance threshold, people have different tolerances on what they accept, especially in any of the normal 4-mans, and nobody really knows what is norm, jut their own personal experiences.

I would bet you're the irregular, and operating under rules that have a fairly large chance of being outside the norm while expecting people to read between the lines is fairly disingenuous.

Yes, and that is why one of the reasons I fairly quickly added my reason for posting what I did, in the new second post, instead of editing the first post and causing more confusion. Not sure why seeing how it was confusing, and could be to more people, and then explaining myself, is such a bad thing.

[Caurcas]

Reading this thread, I am reminded on that famous proverb;

What's it sound, eh, "You run into an asshole in the morning, you ran into an asshole. You run into assholes all day, you're the asshole."

Yeah, that's it.

I, myself, am reminded of another proverb: "Get off society's back."

[LaughingBanana]

I, myself, am reminded of another proverb: "Get off society's back."

Considering that you think that this "enabling" thing, as you said in your first post, "is infecting every corner of this game", and that you yourself have posted that your "back is breaking trying to carry so many people", then doesn't it follow that the "society" is not this awesome and incredibly proficient group of players that you seem to consider yourself in but actually the throngs of innumerable other people in the FFXIV community that you consider as full of general incompetence and malice?

As such, I actually agree with your choice of proverb, actually. Yes, maybe it's time for you to "get off society's back", as it were. Just utilize tools like PF if playing with the rest of "society" burden you so much that you feel like your back is being broken by it.

But I digress. I would still contend that a vast majority of players do not consider playing with others as a burden on their back, and I am personally thankful that the FFXIV community is by large an accommodating and welcoming place to players of all sorts of skill levels, and not one when players who are not performing godly from time to time are sequestered into some faraway place for fear that they could offend a select few who feel like they're far superior than the general rabble.

[Atreides]

The biggest issue here actually lies in the absolutely flawed mentor system, it allows player who have absolutely no idea what they are doing outside of running dungeons all day to "teach" others their ways while having no actual mastery of their jobs.
SE needs to rework the system the commendation system we currently have only enables solo players that run dungeons with randoms all day to become mentors which breeds the worst possible mentors.

[Vahlnir]

The biggest issue here actually lies in the absolutely flawed mentor system, it allows player who have absolutely no idea what they are doing outside of running dungeons all day to "teach" others their ways while having no actual mastery of their jobs.
SE needs to rework the system the commendation system we currently have only enables solo players that run dungeons with randoms all day to become mentors which breeds the worst possible mentors.

Eh, I think you have the problem with the mentor system wrong here. The issue is that a lot of players become mentors JUST for the displayable crown and mount and have no interest in helping at all. Sure, some give bad advice but that could come from literally anyone. I'm a mentor and I've given advice I thought was right only to be corrected by other mentors in my NN. It happens and people learn. I will never claim to know everything. I just try to do the best I can and hope it's enough.

[Awha]

I still say the crown should be changed to a shirt icon. You do not know the quality of shit you will get. Either it will help you grow or it will halt your growth. Just to someones standards it will still be shit advice.

Joking aside I get it this game gives ya nice reason outside of niche content to even try. That is why I disagree with the notion of offering help, the reality is SE should be the ones to foster the desire for the player base to learn and improve with upping the difficulty of the content. This is why I choose not to offer advice and just wait the 5 min and then remove the underperforming player. I get it content is easy enough to clear without trying. Just do not do it around me or risk getting the boot.

[Penthea]

I, myself, am reminded of another proverb: "Get off society's back."

This is a phrase I often see being said to those who genuinely need help from society so maybe pick something else.