What was the Japanese reception to Nier crossover?

[ItMe]

Yoko Taro said it will be canon to both, but for sure it is not canon to FFXIV.

Wait... in what way are the raids not cannon to FF14?

[Erendis]

Wait... in what way are the raids not cannon to FF14?

In what way are they canon? They are about as canon as FFXV and FFXIII events if not less...

[Alleo]

Wait... in what way are the raids not cannon to FF14?

The raid is canon to the game but I guess you can say that the whole Nier universe behind that isnt. For example if its true that Yoko Taro said that this raid will be canon in his stories, then that would in turn mean that somewhere Nier and all the other games also happened in the FF14 universe. I guess in that case its easier to say that these connections are not canon, so the Nier raid happened in FF14 but that does not mean that there is a whole Nier universe out there.

[ItMe]

Oh, I can actually help answer those questions.

Wth there is an old alien factory?

It's actually a new factory built shortly before the alliance raids, it's just a replica of an old factory that the machines have mindlessly copied.

Why did aliens decide they needed to destroy the First?

Because that's what they do: go to worlds and destroy the life there so they can use the planet.
(this is touched in in the raid storyline actually, and spelled out in the journals in the post raid weekly quests)

Why are aliens on the First when all other aliens ended up on the Source?

The first is a place that people can travel to, and the aliens just traveled there.
Nothing is drawing aliens to the source, that's just where we were up until Shadow Bringers so that's where SQEX wrote storylines. If the Omega raids were happening in Shadow Bringers they probably would have taken place on The First instead.

[Mansion]

The first is a place that people can travel to, and the aliens just traveled there.
Nothing is drawing aliens to the source, that's just where we were up until Shadow Bringers so that's where SQEX wrote storylines. If the Omega raids were happening in Shadow Bringers they probably would have taken place on The First instead.

I can accept a lot of what is going on with the Nier raid but that's my main gripe. Sure, I get the "the expansion is on the First so the raid must be", but that's not an in game explanation.
Midgar and Omega landed on the Source after the Sundering, through space travel. So my understanding was that in the physical plane, The Source would be accessible physically through travelling. And Shards are just other dimensions which you can travel to through more complex means (Ascian magics for instance). But anything coming from outer space would see the Source, and land on the Source.

But now, we have the Nier aliens that came directly on the First (I don't recall any mention that they came to the Source before "phasing" into the First). So did Hydealyn's Sundering applied further from the original planet, and the Nier aliens only exist in that dimension? (which would technically mean that this is the "same" dimension as our real world, or at least Drakengard/Nier's depiction of it.) Or is there something I am missing?

[VirusChris]

It's not a Nier story, though. It's a FFXIV story borne out of a collaboration with Nier creators. The story of Yorha is canon to FFXIV unless otherwise stated, not canon to Nier, unless otherwise stated.

When I said that, I meant 2B and 9S's story in the world of FFXIV. Sorry, but if we have a Crossover with characters from other series I expect to see these characters from different series interacting and bonding together in a Crossover. The bare minimum at least. I wasn't expecting to have it completely a Nier story. A mixture of FF and Nier (considering Drakengard is like the reverse FF in terms of themes).

This was sadly just a FFXIV tale with Nier characters as cameos/guests. You can literally swap them out with other FF or original characters for FFXIV and explain a hidden factory of automatons and it wouldn't have change that much.

There was nothing really unique to warrant the Nier to be here, which is a shame. That's the problem I see.
The barely existed. Anogg and Knogg could've been their first friends and develop a close friendship to get them to stick around more, yet no.

I would've loved to have 2B and 9S meet the locales, learn about this world, hear more about the WoL and grow for a bit in this new settings. Giving layman details about their own history - not enough to spoil anything, but enough to connect it to their world - and their reason for existing.

And keep all of the boss battles to, those were great.

However, the final part felt SO rushed that I couldn't take in that the characters from the Nier universe are here and they were gone as soon as they got here. Especially 9S! He's finally back online after the first raid and weirdly enough goes back to his friendly outgoing self. No mention of the WoL and 9S fighting before? No apologizes for the confusion? You didn't even talk to him and after the final raid was done, he's gone. I was peeved when I learned that.

Just 2B and 9S (with some cameo from 21O)... No A2, no Commander White, no Devola and Popola. I wasn't expecting a lot of characters. When I saw 2P I was hoping for an original take on the Nier characters. Like they were part of the FFXIV world from the start or something.

Well... no use crying over spilled milk. I'll keep on doing the weekly to see what the rest of the story is.

PS: Also, isn't it kinda canon to Nier? Yoko Taro has a way to bind all his stories together one way or another.

[linayar]

When I said that, I meant 2B and 9S's story in the world of FFXIV. Sorry, but if we have a Crossover with characters from other series I expect to see these characters from different series interacting and bonding together in a Crossover. The bare minimum at least. I wasn't expecting to have it completely a Nier story. A mixture of FF and Nier (considering Drakengard is like the reverse FF in terms of themes).

This was sadly just a FFXIV tale with Nier characters as cameos/guests. You can literally swap them out with other FF or original characters for FFXIV and explain a hidden factory of automatons and it wouldn't have change that much.

There was nothing really unique to warrant the Nier to be here, which is a shame. That's the problem I see.
The barely existed. Anogg and Knogg could've been their first friends and develop a close friendship to get them to stick around more, yet no.

I would've loved to have 2B and 9S meet the locales, learn about this world, hear more about the WoL and grow for a bit in this new settings. Giving layman details about their own history - not enough to spoil anything, but enough to connect it to their world - and their reason for existing.

And keep all of the boss battles to, those were great.

However, the final part felt SO rushed that I couldn't take in that the characters from the Nier universe are here and they were gone as soon as they got here. Especially 9S! He's finally back online after the first raid and weirdly enough goes back to his friendly outgoing self. No mention of the WoL and 9S fighting before? No apologizes for the confusion? You didn't even talk to him and after the final raid was done, he's gone. I was peeved when I learned that.

Just 2B and 9S (with some cameo from 21O)... No A2, no Commander White, no Devola and Popola. I wasn't expecting a lot of characters. When I saw 2P I was hoping for an original take on the Nier characters. Like they were part of the FFXIV world from the start or something.

Well... no use crying over spilled milk. I'll keep on doing the weekly to see what the rest of the story is.

I'm not sure I understand your complaint. In terms of character interaction, I feel it's no different than the Monster Hunter event, the FFXV event, the DQ event, the FFXI event with the girl, etc. All of them are still FFXIV stories and you can swap the characters in those events with FFXIV original characters. In fact, what characters were there in the Garo event? And the Ivalice raids were even FFXIV original versions, not the actual characters from FFXII/Tactics. A collaboration depends on each specific collaboration and can be as involved or not as they choose to be.

PS: Also, isn't it kinda canon to Nier? Yoko Taro has a way to bind all his stories together one way or another.

Technically it can be, but until they confirm it, there is no reason to think it has to until there is any effect that can be seen on a Nier game.

[Alaray]

nier raids kinda blew

cool music, cool atmosphere but none of it felt particularly well connected to the world of XIV and, while I didn't really care about the Ivalice Raid Series for the Tactics bits, it did expound a little upon the lore of the world and did feel relatively connected to the game's history and setting.

mechanically I didn't really enjoy the raids that much, 9s operated whatever was prolly the coolest one and that had a long, boring intermission. Puppet bunker ozma was kinda fun, and uhhh... for the last one Red Girl was neat but that one triggers epilepsy something fierce. Looking under the arena for the building was neat, though, on the last one.

but they were all very "oh cool" the first time (except the first boss of Paradigm he sucked and was a let down and we basically just fight him again as a trash mob on the motion sickness elevator), but don't feel fun to do more than the 1 time. None really did anything interesting, anything that new.

The story was more forgettable and less interesting than Eden's raid story, at least from someone who never played Nier (and I mean, Omega's story was pretty bland for someone who doesn't really care who tf Kefka is, but Kefka was at least fun to fight).

just felt like one big ad. which it was, but it had no soul.

Maybe the actual games are more interesting and more well-written, but this raid series kinda killed what little interest I had in Nier to begin with.

[CKNovel]

nier raids kinda blew

cool music, cool atmosphere but none of it felt particularly well connected to the world of XIV and, while I didn't really care about the Ivalice Raid Series for the Tactics bits, it did expound a little upon the lore of the world and did feel relatively connected to the game's history and setting.

but they were all very "oh cool" the first time (except the first boss of Paradigm he sucked and was a let down and we basically just fight him again as a trash mob on the motion sickness elevator), but don't feel fun to do more than the 1 time. None really did anything interesting, anything that new.

The story was more forgettable and less interesting than Eden's raid story, at least from someone who never played Nier (and I mean, Omega's story was pretty bland for someone who doesn't really care who tf Kefka is, but Kefka was at least fun to fight).

Nier suffered from the "Omega" effect aka it's in its own bubble to allows creators to go wild and introduce Exdeath, Chaos or Kefka. But once you make it explode, it disappears without leaving a trace. I would have loved Chaos and its 4 minions outside of Omega.
On my part, I'm kind of a FF fan so every bosses talked to me and I was "Woaaah" when I saw Omega vs Shinryu, their rivality explained and established again.

But I progged E1S to E8S with people that were not fans of Final Fantasy franchise, so they were like "who this" so when they saw Neo Exdeath, it was just a second phase to them.
On top of that, everything Omega did had no impact and will not have an impact on the outside world. Alexander, bless this raid, had an strong connection to the outside world.
Eden felt like the additionnal chunk of game after the credits scene. It wasn't amazing, it exist to fill the plothole that was the vast emptiness.

I haven't played UCOB, sooo... I can't say how the story was. But I definitely have good memories of Alexander!
Even if you had no idea of Alexander or Ark, it felt part of XIV's story and any player can connect with it.

Did he even say that? Ethys talked about this, that he searched through countless of interview and stuff but couldnt find any sort of evidence that he ever said that. So I too would be curious if he stated that or if this was something someone just dropped once and it took of from there.

I don't have the source but I definitely remember something like that but I think it was in the lines of "Nierark Apocalypse will have its impact on Nier's world".

[Saefinn]

Nier suffered from the "Omega" effect aka it's in its own bubble to allows creators to go wild and introduce Exdeath, Chaos or Kefka. But once you make it explode, it disappears without leaving a trace. I would have loved Chaos and its 4 minions outside of Omega.
On my part, I'm kind of a FF fan so every bosses talked to me and I was "Woaaah" when I saw Omega vs Shinryu, their rivality explained and established again.

But I progged E1S to E8S with people that were not fans of Final Fantasy franchise, so they were like "who this" so when they saw Neo Exdeath, it was just a second phase to them.
On top of that, everything Omega did had no impact and will not have an impact on the outside world. Alexander, bless this raid, had an strong connection to the outside world.
Eden felt like the additionnal chunk of game after the credits scene. It wasn't amazing, it exist to fill the plothole that was the vast emptiness.

I haven't played UCOB, sooo... I can't say how the story was. But I definitely have good memories of Alexander!
Even if you had no idea of Alexander or Ark, it felt part of XIV's story and any player can connect with it.

I've bolded the point that I think that hits the nail on the head for the problem with fan service content. If it doesn't fit, it only has more potential to tickle fans, if made to fit then it has more potential to tickle anybody. I think Omega relied too much on the weight of the old Final Fantasy bosses to carry the interest...until the end, which I am sad we didn't get more of.

And Coil of Bahamut was a great story and I adored the raids.

I think Coils and Alexander are examples of how raids should be done. They offer great things for fans of the series in reference to elements they love, they offer new stuff with it that fits within the world, its story, lore and has the potential to connect with people new to the game or not fans of the games it references and of course, Coils and Alexander actually felt like raids - not tougher trial fights. But I feel Eden was done closer to how Omega should have been done. I hope what we get in Endwalker returns to that feel.