On Novice Networks and Inappropriate Discourse

[Caurcas]

For a long time within my server's (Siren) novice network I have noticed a disturbing trend of the chat devolving into inappropriate discourse in relation to what the game is rated. This coupled with the recent broader enforcement of the ToS has lead me to try and turn the chat when it becomes this to something more productive to what the chat is suppose to be, which is to say a chat trying to promote better play for newer players. However, this is usually met with derision by my fellow mentors, who continue to hide behind "Interactions not rated by the ESRB" and the like.

This, of course, related to the long term broader issue of novice network and unrelated discussion. I tend to take the road that unrelated discussion is fine as long as it is rating and ToS appropriate and that novice network is mostly working as intended. However, this mindset has allowed a more unseemly element to emerge, at least in Siren's novice network.

So I come to these forums to ask how we work on this, without the usual position of deleting the novice network and mentor system. How do we fix this?

[ZedxKayn]

Report them. They're either too stupid to understand what what they are quoting implies or are disingenuous about it. If it's ToS breaking, they will be punished and stop.

[SturmChurro]

Just yet another strike against the Novice Network. I don't know what it is with some players of this game and the obsession bringing, as you say, inappropriate discourse to this game. It's ridiculous. I agree, these players should be reported. The GM's will handle it, I just wish SE would handle it and get rid of NN and the mentor program as a whole. I'm shouting it from the rooftops at this point, but the game would be better off.

[SenorPatty]

Hello, thrash mentor here from Siren. Before I go on, I need to disclose personal information about myself: I'm generally on NN from 5pm EST till 10ish, Mon-Fri. Saturdays and Sundays are rogue hours. So in all, I can't speak for the hours that I'm not here. Now let's get into the juicy bits of "inappropriate" convos and "non-related" convos.

Let's start with the easy one: the non-related discussions in NN. I suppose this refers to conversations that have nothing to do with the equivalent of being a customer service rep in the NN. From my perspective in NN, we have these sort of discussions because, well ain't easy way to say this but the NN space is dead. As in, nothing goes on, no sprouts or returners are saying anything so mentors just...chat. And I hate to break the glass of illusion that the illustrious nameplate of Novice Network has but this is actually not against guidelines. In fact, GMs have actually sanctioned people (mentors) for trying to police chat into CSR-only atmosphere. Now when anyone does have a question, there's at least someone, even me the thrash mentor, to answer the question. Sometimes yes, the "off topic" conversation continues but the query is still being answered. You can't really expect two-four human beings to immediately stop themselves mid discussion about male viera lore. Give them some time to realize that someone did ask a question or ask it again. Typically, they will redirect if you're not being assisted. Again, this is what I see according to my disclosure.

As for the inappropriate, you're going to have to be a bit more specific. Is language use? Is it harassment? Is it making derogatory comments? Are they making uncomfortable jokes? Some things that are being said won't sit still well with one crowd while the other is fine with it? All I can advise on that subject is blacklist and/or report. Because somethings are going to be clear TOS violations and others are gonna be full on grey matter. Either way, if you don't like what's being said and you've already made it known that you don't like it and they don't stop, then report as you will. SE will investigate and decide the course of action.

Thrash mentor out o/

EDIT: Also, I just have to put this out there, for the Siren's NN: There are some mentors, off the top of my head that I can't name due to forum policies who go so out of their way on a daily basis (again, from my disclosure) to help, it almost makes me cringe. They're too sweet and too nice. There's even this one that feels like he has to pre or post apologies when he talks because he doesn't want to offend anybody. That's just sad, imo. It shouldn't be like that but we are in an age where it's just easier to misconstrue and slap accusations because someone's not being serviced the way they want to be. Then again, there have been some notorious thrash mentors who-hey, don't look at me, I make the word thrash endearing but only for me- who are only there to stir shit up for no reason only because they can, with their carefully, cleanly worded...opinions.

Again, just recognize that Mentor ain't all that you think it's supposed to be, it's just a system that if you're lucky enough, you'll find that most mentors there in Siren are just regular peeps who dish out help and info as they play through the game, all the while having fun with it. Could it improve and be better? Absolutely, 161% agreed. But until that time, just gonna have to accept that it's what it is.

[Tommara]

Returning player on Siren, so was invited to the channel immediately.

It was so full of off-topic spam, that I parked it into a separate chat window. Just in case I needed to ask a game-related question.

Inappropriate? I could care less. Irrelevant spam that has nothing to do with game information, nah, I don't want to listen to it.

I'd much rather hear useful gameplay information in the Novice Network, information that I didn't know to even ask, which was what I signed up for.

Edited Note: In the absence of that, silence would be good.

[LianaThorne]

Anyone who thinks "Online Interactions are not rated" is something meant to protect them after all of the shit going down with the RP community deserves to be reported. Stupid.

[Jin-]

People told me I threw in C&C Generals quotes on NN. Supposedly I was a drunk mentor.

[Caurcas]

To respond to this in its entirety, I find myself largely agreeing with you. Unrelated chatter is the life's blood of a novice network, and in and of itself provides a way for a newer player to easily socialize and connect with the existing playerbase. In addition to this the vast majority of mentors occupying the Siren novice network are a completely fine lot. However, my issues lie with a certain clique of mentors that tend to move unrelated topics to an inappropriate direction. To be blunt, that direction tends toward the sexual.

Furthermore, this group tends to attack any other mentor trying the reign the chatter to a more appropriate topic. I myself have been subject to this many times. This has led to an underserved malignment of my reputation within the Siren novice network, and a few others aswell. Not going to lie this bothers me more than it should, as I have poured alot of time into trying to make the novice network a better and more welcoming place. I would love to recommend this game to friends and family but this behavior and image of the game this conjures stops me.

Edit: This is in response to SenorPatty's post.

[Shougun]

I imagine if they added chat channels you'd see that area improve a bit, and also might justify harsher punishments for using it as a chatting space for mentors. I believe at least part of it is people wanting to have discourse with strangers in a chat room but SE not really offering that while playing the game, else you have to park yourself in a city (which if you go to Limsa or Ul'dah you'll find).

Of course then you'd get to see the joy, peace, and total zen of general chat channels and I assume some would want these masterpieces optional . I tend to get a kick out of listening to Xroads general chat back in the day, but it was certainly not always above board lol.

[Nethereal]

To respond to this in its entirety, I find myself largely agreeing with you. Unrelated chatter is the life's blood of a novice network, and in and of itself provides a way for a newer player to easily socialize and connect with the existing playerbase. In addition to this the vast majority of mentors occupying the Siren novice network are a completely fine lot. However, my issues lie with a certain clique of mentors that tend to move unrelated topics to an inappropriate direction. To be blunt, that direction tends toward the sexual.

Furthermore, this group tends to attack any other mentor trying the reign the chatter to a more appropriate topic. I myself have been subject to this many times. This has led to an underserved malignment of my reputation within the Siren novice network, and a few others aswell. Not going to lie this bothers me more than it should, as I have poured alot of time into trying to make the novice network a better and more welcoming place. I would love to recommend this game to friends and family but this behavior and image of the game this conjures stops me.

Edit: This is in response to SenorPatty's post.

Boy if you think the image of this game is bad you ain't seen nothing.