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  1. #10
    Player
    Alleo's Avatar
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    Jul 2015
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    Light Khah
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    Moogle
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    Arcanist Lv 91
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodric View Post
    On Hydaelyn:


    We'll see how things go, but as ever I urge everybody to keep an open mind!
    about your points

    So now you want to make it so like we are "tempered" by her because we just want her to be good? We know that she is a primal but that does not mean that she is bad. Primals are after all acting according to their summoners wishes. If their wishes were to save the newborn lives and to have them live their lifes than how is that bad?

    I want her to be good because I am tired of these FF tropes that every single god like being needs to be bad and destroyed. I also have a hard time seeing her as bad when we know that Answers is partly from her view.

    Also we still dont know if its her reason alone or if the summoners intented her to do that. What if we find out that it was necessary to truly take care of the sound? And how is it bad that she desires to take out the Ascians? We can still remember the ancient ones but also can see that the remaining Ascians are a threat that needs to be stopped otherwise everything we know and love will be gone. She also does not prevent the truth from coming to light or did she ever stopped us from searching for it? Also since she is a primal it makes sense that she was made to believe certain things or that she does not know better. That does not make her bad it just means that we cant 100% trust what she says to be true, just like how we could not trust Emets rose colored glasses about his own people. But not being able to take every of her words as the truth does not at the same time mean that she is a bad guy either.

    And yes there are stereotypes and for FF it kinda happens quite a bit that the Gods turn out to be horrible. So for me it would be much more a breath of fresh air if she was just good with her own kind of flaws.

    But yes I do keep an open mind, If they do go into that direction I personally might not like it because right now I just dont see those points that make her so shady. It would just be nice to not always be called out as somehow close-minded or "tempered"...no we simply just want the story to go a certain way, just like I am sure that you have probably not wanted for Garlemald to be going in the direction its now. A nation purely built to do evil and create calamities that is now lying in absolute destruction while the people of Garlemald are tempered and used as a way to fulfill Fandaniels and Zenos wishes



    Quote Originally Posted by Slatersev View Post
    Just wanna say, in JRPG's "Supposedly benevolent god is actually super evil" isn't really a fresh or unique direction, its actually incredibly common.

    And I think people taking "sides" between the two based on the idea that one has to be malevolent is sorta missing the point. They were both created to save the planet. The definition about what "saving" it meant was just different between there summoners.

    I think the actual direction there story is heading isn't "This one is the baddie go kill it" its, that the fact that two being both born of good intentions ended up being diametrically opposed not out of any choice of there own but out of the specific ways in which they were created.

    It's a tragedy, not a conspiracy where one is gonna end up the Big Bad.

    If anything I imagine Endwalker ends with both of them sacrificing themselves for the star to help end the "Sound" because despite all there differences they still have the same fundamental goal.

    Basically two imperfect but not evil gods is wayyyy more compelling to me then just flipping a switch and saying "Haha good god bad......again."
    +1 for that. Its just like how when we saw Thordan in the trailers we kinda already assumed that he would be a evil guy because of course the pope in the fantasy setting has to be that.
    I would also be fully behind your idea for an ending on both of them. Instead of "haha crystal mum is evil too" I would be fine if they are both flawed thanks to their creation but that they both will save our world at the end. It imo would also make much more sense that they destroy themselves instead of us somehow having the power to beat these powerful primals. (And way better than having Zenos consume one of them too...that guy should be the one standing no chance before such old beings..)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jandor View Post
    I think that Zodiark and say, Ifrit for example, are both primals in the same way that a space shuttle and a bicycle are both vehicles. They share some basics in common, they're both man-made devices for getting someone from point-A to point-B for example, but beyond that they're not very comparable.

    I have to wonder how much of what we have learned from dealing with modern primals will even be applicable to the pair of several millennia old reality warping gods at the heart of the story.
    That makes sense. After all it was Emet who said that they are something like our primals. I really wonder if the tempering with Zodiark either only happened because the summoners wanted to be controlled in some ways (because their magic was running wild) or if it was the huge amount of aether needed to summon him that did it. After all we know that even someone with the echo can lose control of a primal (I am looking at you Ryne). And since most current primals are called forth through the teachings of the Ascians they maybe just created summonings which can only be done with tempering on top of that.

    Hydealyn had way less people to summon or fuel her. (Maybe even only those original summoners) What if that makes it so that they could resist it? And because she was much weaker she needed the power of sundering to even be able to try at all?

    I also wonder if Zodiark or Hydealyn even count as active right now? Other primals always need huge amount of aether that they take from the land to be able to exist. Hydealyn alone should have kinda destroyed the star by now if she really needed aether all the time, the same with Zodiark when he was active. (They only talked about new sacrifices to get old ones back not to keep Zodiark "alive") What if those two simply can exist without hurting the land because the aether that the Ancients used was so massive that they are using this? What if her silence is her simply being so weak because she truly just used up most of the fuel that was given to her at the time of creation and she does not want to take from the world?
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    Last edited by Alleo; 04-16-2021 at 05:55 PM.