Thread: Paladin button consolidation for 6.0

Originally Posted by ItMe

And I don't see how reverting cover to the SB effect would address the idea of button consolidation.

I said that because the only reasonable and GOOD change to Cover would be reverting it back to SB Cover. Cover works in such unique way compared to all other tank cooldowns that merging it with any other skill would only be detrimental, in my opinion.

Originally Posted by ItMe

You say they work fine the way they do now, and you're right, but there is also nothing wrong with putting them on one button.

There is something wrong with it. The only way to merge Sheltron and Intervention would be to make it a budget TBN that gives 100% block, and in doing so would end up killing what makes Intervention unique.

Originally Posted by AvernusTyrfing

I said that because the only reasonable and GOOD change to Cover would be reverting it back to SB Cover. Cover works in such unique way compared to all other tank cooldowns that merging it with any other skill would only be detrimental, in my opinion.



There is something wrong with it. The only way to merge Sheltron and Intervention would be to make it a budget TBN that gives 100% block, and in doing so would end up killing what makes Intervention unique.

You seem to be under the impression I'm asking for a change in these skills.
Which I'm not.
You use Shelltron on only yourself.
You use cover and Intervention only on NOT yourself.
Why not double up?

Shelltron
Used on you: Shelltron
Used on ally: either the effect of cover or intervention (whichever they'd wish to consolidate).

Nothing would change.
You'd have access to all of your skills.
But you'd also have 1 less button to fit on your hotbar.

Originally Posted by ItMe

You seem to be under the impression I'm asking for a change in these skills.
Which I'm not.
You use Shelltron on only yourself.
You use cover and Intervention only on NOT yourself.
Why not double up?

Shelltron
Used on you: Shelltron
Used on ally: either the effect of cover or intervention (whichever they'd wish to consolidate).

But you are asking for a change, merging those two skills IS a change to how they would work. Merging Sheltron and Intervention would not only need them to rework how both skills work, they would also need to rework the animation for it.

And besides, there simply is no way to merge Cover with Sheltron without drastically changing how Cover works.

Originally Posted by AvernusTyrfing

"Holy circle and Holy spirit combine so they function like Ast's gravity."

If both were merged they would have to lower the potency on it and thus the Requiescat rotation would end up being shafted and end up weaker, so they would have to make more adjustments somewhere else. There is no need to make such a change.

Holy Spircle: Deals unaspected damage with a potency of 350 to target, and 250 to all surrounding enemies.

Ez pz.

Originally Posted by Jandor

Holy Spircle: Deals unaspected damage with a potency of 350 to target, and 250 to all surrounding enemies.

Ez pz.

Not really that easy. That works for dps prefered target AoEs, but not for tank preferred self originating AoEs. I've lost count of the number of times only a portion of a trash pack is hit by Confietor due to my current target being in a bad position while Holy Circle could have hit them all.

Originally Posted by Ultimatecalibur

Not really that easy. That works for dps prefered target AoEs, but not for tank preferred self originating AoEs. I've lost count of the number of times only a portion of a trash pack is hit by Confietor due to my current target being in a bad position while Holy Circle could have hit them all.

Automatically centres on self with no target, with 350 potency affecting the closest enemy. Confiteor can be the same.

There ya go, consolidated a button and made another one better. I'm on a roll.

Originally Posted by Jandor

Automatically centres on self with no target, with 350 potency affecting the closest enemy. Confiteor can be the same.

There ya go, consolidated a button and made another one better. I'm on a roll.

No, you are not. You fail to realize that the game auto-targets when you are hit when not targeted or hit with an ability. People would just end up creating /ac <Spell Name> <me> macros for when they need to hit a large number of targets around them such as in trash pulls. Leaving Holy Circle and Holy Spirit separated is fine.

I disagree on merging Sheltron and Intervention nor Cover, and here is why:

Having multiple actions targeting an ally, and at least one of them having a "on yourself" or "on party member" effect, may cause the wrong effect to trigger when using another in succession. i.e. if you want to cover your partner, and Sheltron on yourself, it will end up being cover + intervention which is then wasted!

Ofc this issue doesn't affect other tanks because they only have 1 ability each that can target allies: WAR-Nascent Flash, DRK-TBN, GNB-Heart of Stone. Warriors Nascent Flash CAN also be targeted on self, but the effect is the same if you target an ally. Nevertheless, should your "tethered partner" die during Nascent Flash, both Nascent Glint and Nascent Flash effects will be lost, but I guess this is just a programming problem, intended or not.

Ari made the most important point, that you can't look at other tanks, as the other tanks respective actions do the same thing to self or party member (except for GNB with Brutal Shell active, but that's negligible) regardless, where as merging would mean Sheltron / Intervention would have two completely different functions depending on who or what you have targeted. This would probably be more effort than worth in an attempt of button consolidation.

It boils back down to the programming issue as stated, I can see a lot going wrong, like targeting macro lagging out or target out of range for some reason or another, or even when manually targeting a party member, the game could most certainly error and use the wrong skill, and you end up wasting 50 gauge on Sheltron instead of Intervention as intended. I see no reason for gauge actions to be merged.

Originally Posted by Ultimatecalibur

No, you are not. You fail to realize that the game auto-targets when you are hit when not targeted or hit with an ability. People would just end up creating /ac <Spell Name> <me> macros for when they need to hit a large number of targets around them such as in trash pulls. Leaving Holy Circle and Holy Spirit separated is fine.

I second this, merging Holy Spirit and Holy Circle is actually an atrocious downgrade for both skills, and making a targeting nightmare in an already crappy targeting system is down right awful in consideration.

Plus to sound like every other tank, when stuff was removed or consolidated, I don't wanna lose one of my animations, I happen to like both animations for Holy Spirit and Holy Circle.