FF14 devs just keep doing your thing because my god

[Nayout]

and replaced with fixing ARR, blue mage, ocean fishing, skysteel tools, firmament restoration, MM Extreme and more advanced features in the "eureka" content such as the Critical Engagement system, duels, a savage version of DR.

Counting the arrangements to ARR as content seems to me to try to add nonsensical things, no one just used these arrangements because the game has never been focused on having more than 1 character.

Shadowbringers feels like an expansion of "fixing" things instead of adding things. The problem comes from an expansion where we still had two dungeons, we had 4 Eureka maps with Baldesion, we had a Deep Dungeon, we had 2 Ultimates, we had a map. in the feast.

And I don't know, but when I see that more people play this game, I intend that the content also increases and instead we continue with the "same" but distributed in different facets, they try to do pve, pvp, crafters / gathers, social, casual content ,etc.

FFXI always focuses on PVE, PSO2 focuses on both PVE and social content, Wow focuses on PVE and PVP. But here? They try to focus on everything

[Penthea]

Before telling anithing sorry for my bad english (i'm from catalonia and still learning it).

Your english isn't perfect but it is very easy to understand what you want to say and that's the main thing. Your english is very good

This is just my opinion i'm not a pro player or a god just a normal dude

I feel that FFXIV suits a player like this better. WoW has a wealth of content if you want to approach the game with a more serious attitude, but if you don't want to or don't have the time to then FFXIV is the better choice because it has a lot of content that doesn't require pre-made groups, rushing or a strict timetable.

[AutumnsHollow]

I feel like some of you have had terrible experiences and are super jaded because of that. I haven't played wow since early wrath but I got back into it for the shadowlands launch and enjoyed myself.

The community is nowhere near as bad as many claim it is, nor is it as uncasual friendly. I played very casually with a SO and we beat the normal raid in two weeks and we pushed up to 13 difficulty wise in mythic +.

Community wise I only got attacked twice. By a random tank in a heroic dungeon and a dps who was ignorant in normal raid. Most of the time people just don't talk, just like in 14. If you're friendly they usually reciprocate it. Just ignore trade chat since that's where most of the toxicity comes from or remove it entirely and it's never directed at you personally.

Just doing the normal raid every week gave us quite a bit of gear and conduits. Eventually we stopped and only did one mythic dungeon per week because of how lucrative the great vault system is. Just join a random person's mythic group and even if you don't time it you get a high item level piece. I could spend a lot less time doing weekly stuff than I do in FFXIV.

Their new "legendary" uses a much funner version of palace of the dead called torghast. You get a currency there weekly to buy the relic basically and inside you get orbs that actually changes how your character plays entirely. It scales difficulty depending on how many people are there so it's very easy to solo and it doesn't take a long time.

Blizzard literally stole that from 14 who ripped it from 11 and improved on it. I hope SE sees that and makes an even better one to one up them off in endwalker.

SE IMO needs an ego check and could stand to steal some systems from wow and learn how to improve some of their systems. Blizzard could also learn from SE. One thing I was very impressed by in general is the technology under the hood for skills in wow that made combat more seamless. I really wish SE could take some of that technology. Playing wow made me appreciate even more how sleek our UI is and how customizable it is.

I don't know why there's so much false information in this thread and hate. They're both just companies who want your money, not you. Neither are perfect and they both have a lot of flaws but they're also objectively both good games. Wow is not as grindy or toxic as people claim in it's current iteration. There's a lot of stuff to do for casual players like myself. 14 is nowhere near as perfect as some of you like to pretend it is.

[Edax]

I don't know why there's so much false information in this thread and hate.

I would be interested to know what information is false so I have a better understanding of the situation.

[Sqwall]

FFXI always focuses on PVE, PSO2 focuses on both PVE and social content, Wow focuses on PVE and PVP. But here? They try to focus on everything

I find it VERY difficult to compare FFXI to WoW. They came out around the same time (2002 and 2004) respectively. FFXI' man focus was community and MAKING players understand you need other players to progress, and it will be VERY difficult to solo this game and enjoy the story. It's a Final Fantasy after all. I would love to see players solo Promyvion content. You can't.

WoW being a revolutionary MMO that it was changed EVERYTHING. UI, Combat, PVE, PVP, Gear, Dungeons, raids, open world, like we have never seen before maybe closely resembled in Everquest that came before it. There has been many article's from the OG WoW designers that basically said we never intended the game to become what it did (referring to eventual BC expansion), and evolving into such a HUGE following of what it became at it's height in popularity. That had to be the SCARIEST thing to understand as a developer of one of the most revered game of the time. How do you live up to fan expectations and continue on?

I saw bit's of Final Fantasy story structure in Icecrown Citadel raids, and that had a SUPERB story that was locked behind raiding content. When I played that it was like I was fulfilling the story arch of Arthas and seeing the end of a GREAT character. After that I just didn't have that much invested in WoW when CAT came out. I lost my motivation to continue to play a game where I no longer cared about the lore and started to care more about my gear and gold. The journey was no longer valued and I no longer cared about the meaningless reward that followed. It became routine.

I remember the day I quit WoW and cancelled my subscription. I looked at my friends list and only 1 person was on, I stood there with nothing to do since I had done everything up to that point that I wanted to do. I felt....alone in a MMO that I cared about so much. It felt only natural to close the chapter on WoW by cancelling and moving on to make other memories, rather then hang on to something that only brought me sadness. WoW was never going to be the same, and I was right.

There will be a day when our expectations aren't met in FFXIV and it will be heart breaking for a lot of people. All we can do is keep pushing that back by BEING vocal and voicing our opinions to a dev team that actually listens! We lucky few that have an MMO to call home.

[Nayout]

I find it VERY difficult to compare FFXI to WoW. They came out around the same time (2002 and 2004) respectively. FFXI' man focus was community and MAKING players understand you need other players to progress, and it will be VERY difficult to solo this game and enjoy the story. It's a Final Fantasy after all. I would love to see players solo Promyvion content. You can't.

They can be compared perfectly because even though they are totally old, FFXI continues to update with PVE content to this day, even when the story ended in 2015 the game continues to update with PVE content and when they tried to do something different like PVP it was a failure tremendous.

Wow also has that focus and it is a matter of seeing the constant updates and what they focus on when developing. As for example in PSO2 some updates of the game only focused on giving more social aspects to the players, in which the players feel at home and that they can change of scene more easily with the absurd amount of cosmetics. That is why when New Genesis was announced, one of the important aspects that they announced was what would happen with cosmetics and emotes.

[Jeeqbit]

The problem comes from an expansion where we still had two dungeons, we had 4 Eureka maps with Baldesion, we had a Deep Dungeon, we had 2 Ultimates, we had a map. in the feast.

Stormblood only had 2 dungeons half the time. Shadowbringers did get a new PvP map but it remains to be seen if we'll get a second like in Stormblood.

Stormblood had Anemos, Pagos, Pyros, Hydatos and BA. Shadowbringers has MM Extreme, BSF, CLL, DR and Zadnor.

It's not entirely clear what has replaced what but it's clear how resources have been diverted into different things. At least personally, I haven't run out of Shadowbringers content to finish.

They do focus on everything though and they are redoubling on that by having more content for crafters and gatherers, and it's a good point how other MMOs might focus more on a specific area. I think that I like the game-building that comes with lending focus to all aspects of the game though.

[Shougun]

I feel like some of you have had terrible experiences and are super jaded because of that. . . .

I don't know why there's so much false information in this thread and hate.

It is very popular to hate on WoW here. While I don't spend much time with WoW's social stuff I've also seen it seems popular to use FFXIV to either dunk on the devs for messing something up or use FFXIV to be that 'weeabo, awful game'.

So honestly.. seems balanced in the end lol. But I find it really unfortunate, people will jump on the train to parade and exacerbate their hate even if they would under any other circumstance be fine with an idea or suggestion. WoW could learn a lot from FFXIV, and FFXIV from WoW, and not just in what they do well but things that didn't work out and why as well (they can act as each other's third party research lol) - and they don't need to shift entirely to the same target audience if they wanted to specialize their audience target (there is a huge overlap of audience potential but near the end part of gameplay there is clearly a bit of a focus in each mmo, one having a lot more progression friendly mechanics and content in that sphere, and the other more into supporting the 'raid' scene - although even in that they both have some overlap).

Sometimes it really does feel like sports or religion in here (or there, of what I've seen shortly), when it comes to talking about WoW. Very few people care if you reference TESO, GW2, Rift, Wildstar, or whatever. Naturally like the above subjects there is different saying "that team or religion isn't for me, but I can see past that and also tell that not every idea that comes from that origin is also 'not for me'" and then there is prostrations you see mix in with that, so one has to be careful lumping everyone together (talking bad about WoW doesn't necessarily say you're a blind white knight fan boy), but I've seen quite a few situations where it's clearly just fan hate / fan love which doesn't help anything besides look bad.

But hey- if you want to farm karma just talk bad about WoW in context of FFXIV lol. People love hearing how they've made the right choice and others made the wrong choice .

On the bright side though- Yoshida has spoke well of WoW and Blizzard a few times and from reading his perspective on the game story direction (things take balance) and long ago in ARR development I'm decently confident to think that Yoshida doesn't simply look at WoW and think "nothing good comes from that game, nothing to learn here". So at least the some of the people that matter for design are keeping aware.

[Nayout]

Stormblood only had 2 dungeons half the time. Shadowbringers did get a new PvP map but it remains to be seen if we'll get a second like in Stormblood.

Stormblood had Anemos, Pagos, Pyros, Hydatos and BA. Shadowbringers has MM Extreme, BSF, CLL, DR and Zadnor.

It's not entirely clear what has replaced what but it's clear how resources have been diverted into different things. At least personally, I haven't run out of Shadowbringers content to finish.

They do focus on everything though and they are redoubling on that by having more content for crafters and gatherers, and it's a good point how other MMOs might focus more on a specific area. I think that I like the game-building that comes with lending focus to all aspects of the game though.

I'm not talking about Frontline, I'm talking about The Feast where the Crystal Tower map was introduced

The problem with Bozja is that it has come to replace both Deep Dungeon and 4 Eureka maps with a system that is tremendously lazy, Eureka had its own ecosystem where the climates affected the environment, where it had to work with a system to Summon enemies each one with their own system to Summon and with their own times, for which they worked with their own people to make this possible.

In the end, an entire ecosystem was changed for a map that ends up becoming monotonous where people only speak to ask for a party when entering a combat where they simply spawn successions of fates and battles. I do not consider that Shadow has less content than the rest of the expansions, the problem comes that the content is divided into many things and the feeling of little content while part of the new content is a raid of 48 (savage) people that seems an experiment Failed as the Diadem (who would do a 48 person savage raid when this game's pve scene is so small?) This is intensified when an Ultimate is eliminated, two events are combined into one to give worse things than the two together, we still have two incomplete races, etc.

We all wish they could focus on all kinds of content but unfortunately the FFXIV team cannot do it because SE and this is where all the problems are generated.

[Jeeqbit]

The problem with Bozja is that it has come to replace both Deep Dungeon and 4 Eureka maps with a system that is tremendously lazy

I suppose that's true. I was fine with Eureka but obviously most people weren't, so it seems most people wanted it to be casual and lazy.

We all wish they could focus on all kinds of content but unfortunately the FFXIV team cannot do it because SE and this is where all the problems are generated.

I see it suggested often that FFXIV is underfunded, but I don't know where the citation for this is. The credits got so long in Stormblood that it looked like they had been spending a lot of money on hiring and outsourcing.